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Problematic Dealings with Annart--DOA Faceup Artist - RESOLVED

Nov 21, 2006

    1. She does very nice work and my first transaction with her went pretty smoothly and I was happy with the work,

      BUT, there is an extreme language problem and she apparently doesn't understand or speak English well enough to grasp a lot of things.

      I sent her more heads to do faceups for me today (11/20/06) and then sent her payment (she requires payment in advance) through Paypal.

      I inadvertently sent it to her hotmail address where she has been corresponding with me from, forgetting that she uses a different paypal e-mail for receiving funds.

      However, the hotmail address is also one of her paypal registered address and she was notified by Paypal at the hotmail address that funds were in her account and to "click here to view details of this transaction."

      But she refused to do so and also refused to click on the link insisting this was not her account.

      I told her to try her password and I would bet it would go through and if it wasn't her account, then it wouldn't. (I knew it had to be hers since she was notified the funds were there).

      Still she wouldn't do it and told me to quit "bothering" her. I was making her crazy, etc., etc., etc.

      So I called Paypal and they said to have her call them and they'd explain it to her and tell her it was OK to withdraw the funds from the hotmail Paypal account.

      She refused to call and told me to open a dispute to get my money back and that we would handle it through lawyers and courts--that I had committed a crime (sounds like she doesn't know what a crime is).

      I told her it was a mistake and certainly not a crime but she got quite belligerent and so on.

      So, I filed a dispute with Paypal even though I told her I didn't want to have to do that and that she could solve the problem easily. SHE kept telling me to file the dispute to get my money back--that she was washing her hands of it so to speak, so I did because that seemed to be the only way to get the funds out of "limbo" in her hotmail account.

      But the transaction had deteriorated so much on her side with her insistence about not doing anything, etc. I told her to send the heads back when she gets them and refund my money. She is angry because she does not understand and if she can't understand, then she isn't the person to do business with in my opinion. Now I am concerned about my heads and whether or not I'll get them back.

      I think she is talented but there is too much room for a lot of confusion on her part and terrible misunderstandings because of the language problem mostly (I would think that is what it is and not that she's just unpredictable).

      Anyway, I'd strongly advise against dealing with her since there is so much room for great misunderstanding and problems on her end of things.

      Some of our correspondence over this terrible situation with Annart:

      From me: Is this you? I can't retreive the money because it went to you at your hotmail account and you simply need to withdraw it:

      Payment Sent
      Name and account nubmer hotmail account transaction ID

      From Annart to me:
      Hi Jo,

      I do not receive any money from paypal can you check it out,

      (This was the confirmation e-mail to HER attached to her message above)
      Dear Lai-Yin Leung,

      Jonell Belke just sent you money with PayPal.

      Jonell Belke is a Verified buyer.
      Payment Details

      Amount: $193.50 USD

      Transaction ID: 000000000000000 (there was an actual trans. ID here)

      Subject: 3 Faceups--Moon, Unoa, Estella

      Note: Please let me know you got the payment. Thanks! Jo

      View the details of this transaction online (clickable link which she refused to click on)

      From Annart to me:

      I mention it so many time. I DO NOT have that paypal account. And I "NEVER EVER" mention to you about dream.... payal. I always said art_........... (but this is one of her accounts)

      And now is not the time to ask me to access that unknow dream account. Now all you have to do is contact paypal asap to "STOP" it.


      And it went downhill from there as I was trying to be calm and explain it all to her:

      From Annart to me:

      That is my name but I told you I don't have that account. I don't have any password to get in that account. If you don't contact paypal then cost you lost money, I can't help. Don't tell me can't stop it. Paypal have funtion to doing that. Even you gonna drive me crazy to die. I still can't go in to that account

      More from Annart to me:

      If I do have that account and password, I already get in without your asking.

      I said so many time I can't get in that account. I DON'T have password to access in.

      Lets both file this case to the police and payapl. And I will send all our email to Paypal and police.

      I already sick of this mess. Any question you send to paypal and police or see in court with lawer.

      I am talking about police and lawyer because I'm not getting mad. Because I can't do anything on your ridiculous request

      Go dispute to paypal , I don't care on dream.....account. Because I don't know that account. I have clear email said you make mistake on this not me. When it go to court, it is going to you. The one create crime is you. That is no use to point finger on me. again see you at court with lawyer. And don't worry at all because I have all emaill approve I never make any mistake.

      Annart FINALLY called Ebay and this was her response to me about that call:

      I spoke to them and they give me 5 digital case number to login paypal to change the password but after I get in to that screen it asking me Security Questions. Ask I told you that I have no information on that account. How do I have the security answers. And the paypal close at 10pm. before I thinking to call them again on there business hour tomorrow. But as I mention to you so many time, I don't know about this account, all the questions paypal ask is not match what I said. Please reply to me asap.

      Make it clear. After this mess finish I don't want to see your name anymore. You made this stupid mistake and now said I'm not understands this sorts of things happen? From this words your really made me mad and angry and now I won't do anything anymore.

      If you don't dispute the case to paypal and try to get the money back that is not my business more. Before I still tell to do something to help out but now forget. You really make me mad.

      Now she is refusing to send my heads back, leaving them to flounder around at the post office for weeks so that I MAY get them back after the first of the year:

      Annart to me:

      As I said so many time "I do not use dream678" paypal account. That paypal account looks bad or not is not effect on me. I just want you get money back. Go dispute the case asap to get your money back. I can't provide the information that match that account's record. That mean I'm not able to get in.

      "Dispute" the case and get the money back

      anyway you do your own. you completely...... I don't want to say it out.

      I will not pickup the package, the post office will send back to you if no one pickup. I don't want to get any trouble from all you terrible mistake anymore. And you never try to understand I can't do anything on that account. That means you don't logical think mind. I can't deal with the none logical person anymore.

      How can I have you money? You can't read or you do have brain problem? Did I ask you send the stupid money to dream? Are you nut? How many time I mention I don't have that account's login? you totally crazy and out of mind. I get mad and angry because you don't use your eyes to read and use our brain to think. I said I can't login that account and don't have the way to fix it so many times but you just keep force me to login. you brain damaged. You should be ashamed of your brain damaged that can't read and think.

      I NEVER said one word to her about her scamming but she came up with the idea that I was accusing her of it:

      From Annart to me:

      Again you don't read and think. I said I don't have that account, how do I first registered. You really brain damaged. Or you thinking I scam on you? I said so many time to you and remind you send the money to art_........... You stupid. you don't use your eyes to read and think people scamming?

      This is my last email. I going to completely ignore your no brain person. Go open from paypal and get your money back. That dream..... has nothing to do on me. you believe or not I don't care.

      So, as you can see, she has major problems!!! She is refusing to do anythng to refund the money and she is going to let my valuable doll heads float around the post office system and I can just HOPE they get returned to me.
    2. Don't be stupid. You trying to hidding the email that you make the mistake and forgot to send in wrong account. And I told you I have the approve. Basicly just sent in to wrong account. You did the mess and trying to pass all the responsible to me. You completely crazy and out of mind. The simple just open case to paypal telling them you sent the money to wrong account just that simple but you keep ask me to do something stupid. You are the most horrible brainless person I had ever see. And you are most horrible to post all our email out on publics that already against the law, without I say ok you can't post our email to publics. That already are good thing to give you lawsuit. Even that simple basic law knowledge that you don't know that telling everyone you are completely out of mind. I tell you now that I will keep everything to record including this illegal against law post. Even you delete this post later. I will still have record and ready to give you lawsuit.

      Sender &#65306; <Designsforher@aol.com>
      Date &#65306; 2006, 11-21 3:35:35
      Receive &#65306; dream678@hotmail.com
      Sudject &#65306; Re: 3 Faceups--Moon, Unoa, Estella

      | | | Inbox

      So the name on the dream678@hotmail.com Paypal account is NOT you? Someone else uses this same e-mail address for Paypal payments? I can't cancel it I don't think but I will call paypal and ask. Otherwise I don't know what to do. Jo

      PS I have had some really bad days and weeks since my mother is sick and I forgot you told me that your paypal address is something different. Thanks!

      Ebay Auction Link ( New Auctions Every Week: http://search.ebay.com/_W0QQsassZcollectorfanatic

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    3. I rest my case.....posted that I inadvertently sent it to the hotmail account in the very beginning of my post. Not being able to read English well or not understanding the meaning of many things seems to be the big problem here.
    4. I posted just a few of the e-mails (there were MANY) and such so people could understand what exactly happened.

      I truncated the e-mail addresses (didn't post the whole address) on purpose.

      Annart posted the response in her post (a very polite one from me) by copying and pasting the whole address (her hotmail).

      I have nothing to hide and nothing to apologize for except that I made an innocent mistake by sending the funds to her OTHER e-mail address which is the one we had been corresponding with all a long.
    5. Please use your eye to read I already said so many times. I do not use dream678 account that is doing nothing to me for any bad record.

      After you dispute the case, I called paypal and told them already I don't have access to dream678 account and paypal told me I just simple reply the email that paypal gonna send me and give paypal a authorise to access dream678 account and will refund to you that only take 3 to 4 days mean around Monday. Now you and me will have record on dispute case that won't come out and scamming issue. And it only took me 10 minutes to explain whole situation to paypal after you dispute to dream678.

      See how simple this is. You just keep wasting our time and anger to ask me access dream678 account that I have been telling you so so so many times that I can't access in. And keep discriminate to me that I'm not well in English.

      Anyway I will forward a copy to you that about paypal authorise refund.
    6. Swan20:

      You are right. Annart got a confirmation e-mail from Paypal because she responded to me using that e-mail and it included the Paypal confirmation to her name under the Hotmail account. It didn't go to a non registered account or to someone elses's. It was hers and it didn't say unclaimed on it as it does if you send it to a wrong address or a non-paypal member. Then I could have simply clicked on unclaimed and reclaimed my money.

      But she INSISTED this was not her account, even though it was, but apparently one she didn't use and just escalated this way out of proportion to what it really is!! We have all done something like this--typed an e-mail address wrong for Paypal or something and I've had it happen to me as a seller and it is very simple to figure out if you can comprehend things and if you don't get yourself so upset you can't see or think straight as Annart did.


      Enough said!
    7. The one who laughing is me not terrible person like you. I told you how many times? Almost every single email I said open case and dispute it seems beginning. What do you mean your suggested? Use your brain. Even paypal can't reset my password without correct information matching on the account. Paypal can do something after you dispute. Thats what I keep asking you to do dispute at beginning, not you suggested me, don't turn the things around. Before you dispute, paypal only let me try to reset the account but not sccess. After you dispute they can help me transfer fund back to you without I login, I just follow what payapl ask me to do from the email, not you suggested. I ask you dispute not only because you and it can protect myself with all case log down on that problem account with paypal. But your brainless keep ask me to login the account that I know nothing about it. You made me sad because you don't read and listern and don't use your brain. Use your Brain please read read.....forget it. you don't use it at all.

      reply from your message

      If this weren't so sad and disgusting, I'd be laughing. You ask me, "See how simple it is????" after you were the one who kept insisting you would/could not do anything? I was the one who suggested you call Paypal and try the suggestions I offered but YOU kept refusing and sending me very nasty e-mails calling me names, etc. YOU are the one who made it complicated.
    8. Why I'm so mad and angry this person because seems begining I said I don't know and don't remember this account existing and ask this person stop payment and open case. But this person never listern and keep ask me login that account to refund. If I can login, I won't ask her dispute the case to paypal. And that is a protection for both of us because paypal will log down the whole case log. I almost mention it on every email I sent out to this person said I can't login that account but this person never ever listern just ignore me and keep ask me to login. And I can't understand why this person don't want to open case from paypal, Kind like rare. Like now after case open paypal can help me refund without I login to the account. And paypal agent told me that is simple and normal thing happened, simple just open case and they can fix it.
      This argument should not bring to public, just contact paypal to fix it but this person bring everything to here, its already one big terrible action. If I don't make it clear, everyone just think all the mistake make by me.
      As you see this person after making mistake just pass all the responsible to other.
      I'm not trying to make other people stand at my side but at least who read this post they have information can do their own judgment or just ignore it.

      But thank you for not stand at my or that person side. And gave me very good suggestion. But just because I'm very mad and angry because this person don't read and listern at all to keep ask me doing all the none sense action to get in the account that I told this person, I can't.

    9. Thats the reason why this person drive me crazy. From the beginning of the email. I said stop the payment and open case/dispute to paypal. But this person keep asking me login the account that I don't know and don't remember it, how can i do the refund? This person just ignore what I said and that already over 10 emails, every email I mention dispute case at paypal and I can't login to account. But every email this person reply just ask me login to refund.
      If you are me. Over 10 emails you ask someone open dispute case but just ignore and all the reply just ask you to login the account that you don't know. What may you become?
      For me, I become mad and crazy.
      But thank you for not stand at one of us and give me good suggestion what I did wrong and what I should do become better.
    10. I will not take the package from this person because I scared. Because this person told me lost the package one time and someone took the package but found it out later.
      If I go pickup the new package the confirmation from Post office will show I have the package. Even I send it out, this person can ignore everything I say and I do, just like this case. If I don't pick up, that will not have argument at all. Again even I send it back, this person can ask for someone pickup the package and say lost it then point the finger to me again, like this case.
      This person can't be trust, seens this person ignore open case from paypal at the beginning.

      Open case from paypal is the most normal and correct way to sent to wrong account not bugging other to login the account that can't be login.
    11. Nightshadepromise:

      The problem is Annart and not me. My first package that she sent back with completed faceups WAS lost by MY local post office and delivered to someone else which had noting to do with Annart and I never said it did or accused her of anything on the first package. I just told her if it wasn't found, she might have to file an insurance claim. I have received a letter of apology from the postmaster here for mishandling that package and another one so if anyone would like to see it, I'd be glad to provide it. Annart is now insinuating that maybe it wasn't really lost???? I don't know what goes on in her mind but it certainly comes out very different than reality.

      All that Annart has to do is REFUSE the pacakge and ask that it be sent back to me the sender per my request.

      She just needs to be sure that the PO there knows it is to be returned immediately rather than let it sit at the PO and keep getting notices of attempted delivery. That's all.

      She has made this into something it is not. I never ever pointed any fingers at her and the reason I asked her several times to retreive the money in her other (hotmail) account rather than file a dispute is because disputes are not good for someone's record and I knew that she would latch onto that somehow and accuse me again of making things difficult for her with a dispute even though she insisted I file the dispute instead of helping her to retrieve the money.

      All this other extraneous name calling and hysterics on her part is her own doing. I was simply trying to help her help me by being able to access the funds and I did have to repeat myself calmly and politely in different ways to try to make her understand. It was futile!

      It got so bad on her part with the name calling and misunderstanding everything I POLITELY suggested, that she get my money back to me and when the doll heads arrived, sendthem back. I don't want to deal with you anymore if you are going to be this way.

      I did nothing wrong except make the mistake of sending it to her other paypal address (hotmail) and all the escalation and misunderstanding from that point on is all her doing. Period.
    12. As everyone can see now. This person until now still trying to ask me login the account that I can't login and already mention from the beginning. And still saying wouldn't want to disputes(this person finally disputes after the last email). And will anyone worry about the account goes bad that you don't know, can't login and not using it? (this already mention from beginning also)
      Hi everyone if you are me, how you feel? And what words you can use to talk with this person?
    13. Just question. Now we both open case from paypal. Should I still try the way to teach me? Is the account still holding? Because the paypal agent suggest open case for dispute too. Thank You for your suggestion.

    14. After Clicking on Profile, go to E-mail in the first column on the very top.

      Click on Email.

      It will open a window that allows you to add, remove or make primary various e-mail addresses.

      Add your hotmail e-mail address.

      Then go to Paypal under the hotmail e-mail address.

      Accept the funds, then refund the funds. You shouldn't be charged fees when you refund.

      I've been trying for over 24 hours now to explain to you how to do this.
    15. As I said that the paypal agent told me it doesn't work, as long as I have the password to login that is the reason why paypal agent agree to ask you dispute case. And I did mention before.....but you just ignore me and keep thinking you are correct.

      Thats what I did that follow what you said and the message from PayPal.

      {The email address you submitted is already registered with another PayPal account. If you own that account, login to perform transactions. Otherwise, please enter a different email address.}


    16. If you own that account, login to perform transactions.....

      Did you try logging in?

      I guess it is possible that you have different passwords and security questions for each e-mail address, but I have 3 e-mail addresses registered with paypal and although I never use the other 2 anymore, I could still access them if I received funds to them.

      Also, if you go to your history tab in the Paypal account, you should see any other e-mail addresses you have registered with Paypal.

      You can highlight the hotmail e-mail address and click "search" and it should pull up any transactions (my payment) to your account under the hotmail address.
    17. Everyone can you see what this person said? From all the post almost every single one. I mention "I can't login, I don't know this account, and I don't use it and I don't remember it" And already contact paypal agent to help and tried to login and the security questions. I did mention in emails and all posts.
      But this person still asking me "did you try logging in?" .........

    18. Annart, I have no idea what you've said except that your earlier messages to me were a refusal to try to login or access the account in any way.

      I offered another suggestion regarding the account which is try to access it through your history (where you can view all transactions--pmts. sent/received, etc.). If you log in to your other account and you can see the hotmail address under the history then perhaps you can access it that way. Did you try that?

      I am just trying to wade through all that you've said and offer suggestions and you keep insinuating I'm stupid, brain damaged, etc. which is not only unprofessional and rude but it is very far from true. That's about all I've taken from your posts which is way off the subject.

      Paypal doesn't always know what it's doing and you can talk to 2 to 3 reps and get 2-3 answers so I suggest you keep calling until you get someone who can fix this immediately.

      As an example of how inconsistent and strange Paypal is, they are telling you things such as it will take 4-5 days for a refund and sending YOU e-mails but haven't communicated with me at all except to send two form letter type e-mails that the dispute and then the escalation to a claim have taken place.

      Not ONE word about a refund in 4-5 days or anything. Nothing mentioned in the dispute file either. How much sense does that make since it is my money and my refund we are dealing with????

      Not your fault there but it just shows you that they have a system and way of doing things that sometimes is very one sided and that all their reps are not as familiar with everything as they should be. You just have to keep trying till you get one that gives you the correct information.

      You seem to be saying they told you to open a dispute also and that makes no sense. Why would you do so in a case like this?



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    19. PS to Annart, did you try removing the hotmail account and adding it again with a password you know as someone suggested earlier?

      This is dragging on and on for no reason because you are either not understanding what Paypal is telling you or you are getting reps that don't know much or both.

      If don't have my refund by late Wednesday, I will just stop payment on that particular transaction with my bank. I don't like to have to do that as it costs me $29 and headaches with Paypal, but this is getting ridiculous and it shouldn't have to.

      Also, when the postman knocks on your door, PLEASE just tell him to immediately return the package to me.
    20. Annart, this is what you need to do:

      I spoke with Paypal and all your conversations with them are not a matter of record.

      You need to reply to one of their e-mails to you sent to your Paypal hotmail e-mail address and say:

      "Please refund the $193.50 to designsforher@aol.com"

      And it will get done almost immediately and otherwise it will take 11 days.

      Please do it right away (reply from one of the e-mails they sent you with the authorization to refund the money to me.)