1. It has come to the attention of forum staff that Dollshe Craft has ceased communications with dealers and customers, has failed to provide promised refunds for the excessive waits, and now has wait times surpassing 5 years in some cases. Forum staff are also concerned as there are claims being put forth that Dollshe plans to close down their doll making company. Due to the instability of the company, the lack of communication, the lack of promised refunds, and the wait times now surpassing 5 years, we strongly urge members to research the current state of this company very carefully and thoroughly before deciding to place an order. For more information please see the Dollshe waiting room. Do not assume this cannot happen to you or that your order will be different.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Dollshe Craft and all dolls created by Dollshe, including any dolls created under his new or future companies, including Club Coco BJD are now banned from Den of Angels. Dollshe and the sculptor may not advertise his products on this forum. Sales may not be discussed, no news threads may be posted regarding new releases. This ban does not impact any dolls by Dollshe ordered by November 8, 2023. Any dolls ordered after November 8, 2023, regardless of the date the sculpt was released, are banned from this forum as are any dolls released under his new or future companies including but not limited to Club Coco BJD. This ban does not apply to other company dolls cast by Dollshe as part of a casting agreement between him and the actual sculpt or company and those dolls may still be discussed on the forum. Please come to Ask the Moderators if you have any questions.
    Dismiss Notice
Severe ongoing issues and concerns with Dollshe Dollshe Ban

A Debate about Debate

Sep 19, 2008

?

I agree that... (tick all that apply)

  1. Threads should never be locked permanently

  2. Threads should be locked after 2 months inactivity (with option to restart).

  3. Threads should be locked when they are stuck in a loop (with option to restart).

  4. People who can't control themselves should be temporarily suspended from the Debate subforum.

  5. People should never be barred from discussion for any reason.

  6. The edit post feature should be removed.

  7. The edit post feature is too valuable to remove.

  8. A "Debate" Archive would be a good idea for old, inactive or locked debate threads.

  9. Threads in the Debate subforum should be approved by the moderators.

  10. Anyone should be able to start a Debate thread, any time.

Multiple votes are allowed.
Results are only viewable after voting.
Page 6 of 12
    1. again i take it back

      (but just because its confusing people i asked if anyone disagreed with the three strikes. but lkj made a good point)




      consider it a bump
       
      #101 octobercrow, Sep 25, 2008
    2. If someone doesn't agree, I'm sure they won't need prompting to say so on this thread. If they're the type that would need prompting to voice an opinion, then they don't sound like the type to frequent the debate threads.
       
      #102 LKJ, Sep 25, 2008
    3. ya true...

      i guess i was thinking maybe is they read the the question it would make them think about it more? i dunno
       
      #103 octobercrow, Sep 25, 2008
    4. I just finished reading yesterday's (and today's?) rather intriguing debate threads that got locked.

      I have personally always thought it rather foolish of a person, any person, regardless of their viewpoint on a particular issue, to enter into a discussion with no intention of being open to other viewpoints. Debates are for education as well as persuasion. Entering into one in order to repeat yourself multitudinous times is not only pointless, but counter-productive.

      And why? Because none of us knows it all. I don't, you don't, nobody who has a corporeal form on this planet knows it all. Learning what other people think, and why, is a wonderful way to expand your knowledge base. I read a number of really thoughtful responses along the lines of "oh, I never looked at it that way, I'll have to think about that more!" By not simply closing their minds to the possibility of a different viewpoint, they may -- or may not -- learn something that changes their own ideas.

      And that's all I will have to say about that! :)
       
      #104 Baakay, Sep 25, 2008
    5. What if the ability to edit posts in debate was taken away? Let's face it, it's really annoying when someone decides to just erase their entire post. That's unfair to the people in the thread who are really there for the debate. And maybe if people couldn't edit their posts they'd stop and think about what they had to say before they hit the post button.
       
      #105 onnawufei, Sep 25, 2008
    6. That's a great idea onnawufei,I think that some people just say things out of anger and don't truly take the time to think on it and then give an answer. Of course there are plenty of those who do think about their reply,but I agree with onnawufei that posts should not be able to be edited on debate forums.
       
      #106 xXDarkNekoXx, Sep 25, 2008
    7. Onnawufei, I like that idea as well.

      It would certainly cut down on a lot of the backpedaling.
       
      #107 Shen Xia, Sep 25, 2008
    8. I can certainly see the benefit of not allowing people to edit posts, but I would hate to lose the ability to do so. ^^;
       
      #108 Dezarii, Sep 25, 2008
    9. Not being able to edit posts might make people think harder about what they're posting and force them to check and wait more. I don't think it would be perfect, but it's a pretty good idea.
       
      #109 Tereya Chan, Sep 25, 2008
    10. Heh. Typos would make the inability to edit a horror on my posts, but I do agree that it would make people think all the harder before posting. Sounds like a good idea to me.
       
      #110 LKJ, Sep 25, 2008
    11. I think disabling the edit feature would cut down a lot of the extra quoting that goes on in some debates. People will always quote the kinds of statements that a backpeddler is most likely to remove later so that the poster still has to be responsible for and own up to what they've said.

      If people didn't have the edit feature perhaps they'd be more concerned about double checking the content and intent of their posts.

      I am highly prone to typos so I know some of my posts would look terrible. That's something I can live with if other people can overlook it from time to time. :sweat
       
      #111 idrisfynn, Sep 25, 2008
    12. If you really take your time and carefully check what you're posting there shouldn't be a lot of typos. Also,it would keep a huge debate from getting too out of control too quickly because everyone would be double checking things and taking their time to make sure they have the best answer. It would keep the drama to a minimum.
      Or at least I hope,lol.
       
      #112 xXDarkNekoXx, Sep 25, 2008
    13. I have suggestion : Maybe the original poster or anyone else can surmise the main points of the debate after a few pages.This will keep the debate on track and updated. Just a thought.
       
      #113 breeze, Sep 25, 2008
    14. I think onnawufei idea is a very good one, I do think it would make people think twice before posting.
       
      #114 mystical-maz, Sep 25, 2008
    15. I see what you're getting at,that's not too bad either. Although I've noticed that people get caught up in personal drama and tend to ignore the thread poster's attempts to keep everyone on track. -__-
       
      #115 xXDarkNekoXx, Sep 25, 2008
    16. I too thin kthat the edit option being disabled, like on the feedback forum, is a great idea. I have written things then realised they were not right, and edited them. What should happen, is that another post is left where you explain that you have changed our mind, realised you were wrong or whatever....then you have to face up to what you said and be mature about it. It's a difficult thing to do to swallow your pride, but a very valuable lesson. Then, rather than people being wanky about you beind your back, they can see that you are in fact a reasonable person and might have just said something overly emotional in the heat of the moment.

      That said, not being able to edit your posts will also make someone spend a good deal of time over their responses and hopefully try to stop knee jerk comments.

      I do also think that the three-strikes-your-out policy would be really good too, but I think that would mean quite a lot of moderating and reading of threads. I don't know how exactly the forum is policed- how moderaters keep check of each thread, but being able to warn someone seems a good idea to me.

      Finally, I think maybe leaving some things down to the OP is quite a lot of stress for the OP. As the OP for the thread that has just had a temp lock because of one single person highjacking it- I was really upset that it had happened. I tried to keep it on track but I think my comments were kind of getting lost in amongst the others because people were getting (and rightfully so) defensive and wanting to respond to the poster who was attacking them.

      What tends to ruin a thread is when someone cannot accept that some people don't like their opinion (which is just part of life folks, and as Baakay beautifully put, doesn't neccessarily mean anything bad) and decide to use attack and nasty comments in a way to back up their opinion. Then, after riling people up, go and edit out those bits that had upset people. At the end of the day, we are all entitled to an opinion of course, and just questioning it is not meaning suddenly everyone hates you, but if you truly believe something then you should stand by it and find valid reasons why you feel it (without insulting people- even if you just do believe it and thats it). So, removal of the edit option works for me.

      Just to reiterate; without the edit option you can still change your mind on your opinion or backpedal, but do it in a mature way, face up to what you said, and damn well apologise!

      XXX
       
      #116 Absynthe, Sep 25, 2008
    17. the no edit option can be good i guess


      except for those people who wont be carefull and re read their post before they post it, then it wont help with back ups because they will post (maybe more than once depending on how many replys) another post saying something like " i worded that wrong thats not what i ment sorry dont pay attention" or "yeah that was offensive im sorry i take it back" but sure enough they would probably still get a few quotes and fire backs


      or for example in this post i made two posts people told me didnt belong here so instead of waiting for more people to tell me i deleted them


      but over all im for the restricting the edit button (but maybe just in a debate?) because although i dont think it will help everyone i dont think anything can and i guess it could help if enough people cooporated
       
      #117 octobercrow, Sep 25, 2008
    18. I don't think the edit button is a bad thing per say, but that perhaps it's been getting abused of late. I've always thought of it as a way to clean up a post or add something I've forgotten. It's never occurred to me to use it to delete an entire post--that I think is an abuse of the edit button. Also, once people have started quoting your post, you shouldn't go back and make a lot of changes--at that point it's time to either stand by what you said or concede that you were wrong, either way, otherwise it gets confusing.

      However, I haven't seen that happen as much in the past (though I'm sure it has to an extent) as I have in a few recent threads. I admit that I like having the edit feature, but I can also see why people are suggesting it be taken out. There could be some guidelines added about editing posts, but of course, that is assuming that people would read and follow them.

      *edited for typo* lol
       
      #118 Taco, Sep 25, 2008
    19. I don't think removing the editing feature would really be too helpful - there have only been a few immature people who have removed their entire posts to backpedal. It seems punishing to those who only want to edit to tidy up or clarify their wording.

      The best way to immortalize someone's probably-going-to-be-edited text is to quote them. That'll preserve a record of it. I know that when someone says something offensive, I often quote them so that people who see my response later know what I'm referring to even if it's gone!

      Just out of curiousity, I have added a poll to this thread.
       
      #119 armeleia, Sep 25, 2008
    20. what about temporarily locking a thread? (the last thread to be locked says it is temporary i know) but shouldnt that be a choice? sorry if you cant add something to a poll once you've made it, if you cant then ignore this


      i think temporarly locking threads can help quite a bit it gives people that cooling off time everyone keeps mentioning


      i know from now on im going to give myself time to cool off if im frustrated but not everyone will and simetimes its really hard not to "fire back" so to speak so yeah


      and like someone below me said the edit button is really good for if you need to add something you forgot but you dont want to double post so on that note what if you can edit your post but not delete anything just add things? is that even possible?


      if all the things im saying sound crazy then forgive me im not sure what we can and cannot do as im not a big internet person
       
      #120 octobercrow, Sep 25, 2008
Page 6 of 12