Accidentally Buying a Copy: What Should They Do?

If I accidentally bought a recast, I'd immediately throw it away and warn everyone about the seller. It'd be heart breaking to be out that money but I'm too much of a hypochondriac to keep resin that isn't from a reputable company. Not to mention the usual it's-just-not-fair-to-the-artist thing of course.

 

@Miu Len, I hope you would try to get your money back Paypal has a procedure for dealing with bootlegs and fakes, so if you do purchase a recast by accident using Paypal there is a way back.

 

Oh! Thanks for letting me know because I didn't know that was possible! I thought we would get in trouble just by buying a recast or a bootleg of anything so I didn't think there'd be a procedure for that sort of thing. XD

 

I don't think someone who bought a bootleg deliberately could claim back through Paypal, but the safeguard is there to protect buyers who are perhaps sent the wrong item by accident or are missold a fake item. I think Paypal even requires that the bootleg item be destroyed, so the seller wouldn't be able to rip off someone else.

 

Sometimes by the time a person discovers the fraud It's too late to get money back. However I do believe that the buyer should report the seller and get the information out that they sold someone a bootleg item so that no one else gets scammed. As for the doll, it is up to the owner as to what to do, It's not their fault that they bought a fake as they didn't know. In the end it's the type of situation no one wants to find themselves in.

 

If I were the girl I would definitely keep it. If DoA doesn't allow, I still could post it in my own web page.The emotional bond is already formed and it will be like killing a child if you were to ask me to throw it away. I would definitely continue my love for the doll.

 

This was something I feared when getting my first few dolls. I currently have 5 and they were all purchased from companies (Denver Doll, Junky Spot, Parabox, DiM, Fairyland) or a trustworthy friend.

Honestly, I would comfort the girl. She didn't know and now she feels wrong about loving something she's so attached to, and it's sad. Yes, copies are banned on DoA, but she could still share photos in other places, like many others have said. Just because her doll isn't of true origins doesn't stop it from being something she loves dearly. Her feelings shouldn't change about it just because she learns it's a copy. She loved it before she knew and it was still a copy then, why should that change now that she knows?

It's a sad story whenever someone gets outcast for having a copy, especially when they had no clue. It makes you wish someone could be there to say, "Hey, you still love her, why not forget what they think for a moment and just enjoy your doll. She needs love too."

 

So.. A copy? A "cheap" doll?
If she should keep it or sell it? Or something else..
KEEP IT! LOVE IT! It's nothing wrong with it T_T

Again: There isn't nothing wrong with a copy!!
I've heard those who thinks it's not okay with a "fake" doll but it's ok with fake clothes. It's not wrong...

 

I don't know in your countries, but in France it's called "recel", keeping of something considered as stolen (yes, it is...It's not the doll's fault but its stolen art), and it's forbidden and punishes by law. So I understand, if you were not aware at first that your doll was a copy, you have bonded and want to keep her in your closet, but nethertheless, to buy a copy is wrong.
Don't compare with clothes : clothes are not art (and nevertheless you may be charged at customs if taken with copied clothes), and the copied companies are not as small as BJD's companies or artists who will rapidly die if now people find recast or copy is a normal thing ! Will you find acceptable for a living to sell "genuine copies" of famous painters without any rights to pay, or will you print books of you favorite authors to sell under your name, or anything like this ? So why do you think it's normal with dolls ?

And I will add you don't have the same garanties about the quality of resin : it may be a toxic one, an unauthorized company who is looking for quick and illicit benefit will not be as anxious about its customers and employees well being.

 

Like I said before. Keep the doll. It can still be as beutiful as dolls she had before/other dolls.
I don't know if I said this earlier but screw what others say. If she likes/loves the doll she should continue with that.
I would absolutely keep the doll

Oh, sorry. It's my first time here. Didn't know were this were placed xD
But to answer you. I compare dolls with clothes, yes. Because "real" is "real", and fake is fake. And that's how it is. For an example. There's no difference between converse with a star, and converse without a star. Well, yes, better material and the star. For me it's a shoe. And that's not illegal.
Now maybe we talk about different things, but I just want to explain myself.

Why on earth would I print out and sell under my name?! If I want to make a "copy" of my author, I just have to write somthing familiar and so it's done.
If I'm not mistaken, the recast companies tell everyone it is a copy, they even tell the original company?
I'm new to the hpbby, I haven't study this with recast, I'm just gessing. And here it's ok to have a copy, as long as it isn't stolen.

 

The recast companies certainly do NOT tell the original companies what they are doing. They just buy a doll, copy it and sell it.

 

No recasters don't tell the original companies...they buy the doll from the company, use that doll to make a mold, and then sell the copies.Most companies post warnings about buying recasts and the harm it can do to their businesses. (I won't get in to legalities or anything because this differs from country to country.)

 

There is a difference between Converse with a star and sneakers without a star, but not the one you think! One is a shoe by the brand Converse, with brand marks, the other is an off-brand shoe. The name Converse is a legal trademark, just like Super Dollfie or Barbie. If I had a shoe company, I could not use the name Converse to market my shoes without risking a legal challenge by the Converse trademark holders, just like other doll companies may not use the name 'Super Dollfie' for their dolls and Mattel would come down very hard on another company making dolls called Barbie!

Please read the following announcements [1], [2] - Den of Angels absolutely does not support copying dolls. It is absolutely not okay to have a copy on this forum as Den of Angels considers all recasts to be stolen works - to recast a BJD is to steal years of design and artistry from the original creator of the doll as well as steal future sales from the legitimate company.

Recasters do not tell the original company what they are doing because if they did, the original company would know exactly where they are and be able to sue them. Some recasters are open that the dolls they sell are copies, some are not and they try to sell the dolls as originals and for the same price as the original.

 

Copyrights involving clothing is different than copyrights involving images and 3d items(sculpture/toys) With clothing as there's only so many ways to construct a pair of pants or shirt, or dress, only prints, logos and brandnames can be copyrighted. Not the look of the pants themselves. Otherwise you'll get into weird situations/monoplolies where say only Levi could sell jeans(I think they were the first to sell pants made out of denim) So if you buy a pair of jeans and it doesn't have the levi logo you're not buying a fake pair of jeans, you're just buying a different brand. Now if you buy a pair of jeans and it has the levi logo, but didn't actually come from the levi factory then you are buying a fake pair of levis and that can create a problem(seriously google impact of counterfeits goods and learn)

As to what a person should do if they find out they've purchased a counterfeit, first contact paypal as paypal does forbid selling counterfeit goods, and if they paid via credit card they can also contact their credit card company. According consumerreports.org you can also file a complaint with your local consumer law http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/2012/06/how-to-spot-counterfeits/index.htm

 

Buying and having counterfeit dolls is buying and supporting illegal dolls that are made by criminals. How can you love somthing that is deliberately made to harm the artists work. It is becoming a huge industry and I am very happy DOA takes a strong stand against it by naming the companies and sellers by name. I see all the arguments why you should keep and still love these dolls, they are all wrong arguments that gives the Criminals a chance to do their bad work.

Take a stand as a true BJD doll lover and be against COUNTERFEIT DOLLS !!

 

Haradaeri, a copy isn't "something familiar" ou "just a doll" : it's the twin sister of a existing doll. To use your own exemple, it's not "a shoe", it's a sneaker with a star the size and form of a Converse, made to let you think it's a Converse (I mean a real one - Converse is a brand, not a model), and most of time sold under the name of the real one (if it's sold as "copy of a XXXX" and you still buy it, you're not a poor ignorant customer like supposed in the thread, for the law you're the aware accomplice of a thief).
A doll a little alike another one - like a sister or a cousin - will not be define as a copy, unless they are of unusual and "artistic"proportions so in this case it may be, but dolls exactly of the same size and proportions with exactly the same head, it's art thief. And no, the thieves don't ask permission and only stupid ones say openly "go and buy my copy".
IF you are an artist and create something you're proud of, and make a living with it, would you find "normal" and "not wrong" if somebody take your very idea and model and sell it without giving you any credit nor benefit, saying for an excuse "but I sell it half price, and she doesn't make enough" ? Are you sure you wouldn't mind ?

 

As a professional musician, art theft is a familiar topic for me, so I have given this a lot of thought before I even knew what BJDs were.

An everyday example for me would be if someone bought a CD I worked on from someone else, who claimed it was original but was in fact a copy. In that case, the buyer has been betrayed and ripped off quite as much as myself, so I would not blame them, it is not their fault. The person to blame is the one who made the copy and knowingly sold it as original.

That goes for dolls as well. If somebody, newbie or not, unknowingly (!) bought a fake, they can not possibly be held responsible for somebody else's crimes. That also goes for people who bought a doll believing it to be original, and decide to sell it secondhand, only to have the buyer find out it was a recast - they (the secondhand seller) have also been ripped off and can't possibly be punished for putting their faith in the wrong person. If possible, I'd encourage them to track down the original seller / recaster in order to be able to warn the rest of the community. Damage control FTW.

If it were me and I still had the chance to get my money back, I probably would; if it were too late, I'd keep the doll, but still make sure that people knew where it came from, so they could avoid falling into the same trap.

 

I really think that this term "Recast" needs to be changed to what it really is -- COUNTERFEIT.

It doesn't sound so attractive when called by what the doll truly is, does it?

The procedure to counterfeit is done by recasting a company or artist's doll. It's not legal, it's not like making a similar shirt or purse. It's illegal in the United States and there are other forums with links to laws proving this is true.

The OP states they "accidentally" bought a recast? Then contact the authorities, and give the product to them so they can prosecute. Plain and simple.

another useful link about international law
http://www.customsandinternationalt...unterfeit-merchandise-into-the-united-states/

 

Now it sounds like I have one o.o
I don't even have my first doll yet xD A Souldoll. She's beautiful

And yeah, my friend told me recasts aren't ok here. Of course I accept that. When I told my opinion about keeping it, I didn't mean that person have to post about it.
And that's good to read you guys don't download music and stuff, I'm happy! ^.^

I'm also happy that you tell me about recasts, bacuase as I said, I don't know much about them xD

I just don't think it's wrong. I mean you can still love it. And if it's illegal, why does those companies "live on" and making them. How come there's no one who report them?

 

Although you are entitled to your opinion, I feel that it would be more appropriate for you to read up about the situation before deciding that you really don't think copying someone's work and stealing their future sales is wrong.

Whenever a new recasting 'company' starts up, immediately the doll community will start contacting legitimate companies to let them know what has happened. We're very good at this. The simplest reason why recasters are very difficult to stop is because the majority of them are located in China*, where the laws regarding counterfeit goods are very different to the rest of the world. Pursuing international copyright and trademark infringement is extremely expensive and if you're a small company of one to five people designing and producing dolls, you simply cannot afford those legal fees. Even Volks, which is one of the largest BJD companies, cannot afford the legal fees to challenge each recaster knocking off their work.

If people didn't buy recasts, the recasters wouldn't make them. Recasters have no conscience - they aren't making dolls for fun, they aren't making dolls so that everyone who wants one can have one, they are making dolls to steal money that is not rightfully theirs. They have no creativity, so this is their way of cutting into the BJD hobby and trying to get a slice of our hobby cash.

Recasting is a supply-and-demand issue and consumers have a lot to answer for for making this problem bigger and involving more companies in this ruinous practice. If you buy a recast by accident, that's very sad, but things can be done to a) get your money back and b) track down the person who sold you the illegal doll. Buying something by accident is just that, an accident, the only person to blame is the dodgy dan who sold you the doll in the first place. However, if you deliberately seek out a recast to buy, that is an entirely different issue. You, as a consumer, are contributing to the decline of the company who designed the doll you admire and the decline of the entire hobby. Something to ponder.

*There are a great many legitimate companies located in China too, so there is nothing wrong in having a Chinese-designed or -made BJD. Angel of Dream, Bobobie/Resinsoul, Island Doll and Spirit Doll are just a few of the large number of companies originating from China and producing their own original dolls.