Accidentally Buying a Copy: What Should They Do?

Ipledreamer, you're right. The company doesn't lose the rights to their sculpts even if the sculpt is a limited edition and no longer produced. It is also important to remember that when you buy something you own only the item you buy. You don't have reproduction rights over it - you cannot copy it and sell those copies, or even give copies away. Once something is your property you can sell it on, or give it away as a gift or throw it away if you want to, but you legally cannot make copies of it.

Companies have shown time and again that they're willing to work with their fans and respond well to polite petitions and fan campaigns to get certain dolls re-released. Some companies will release a doll as a limited edition full set but later release the blank doll as a standard, making the full set the limited part and the doll available to everyone.

 

There is always a way to find discontinued stuff without resorting to recasts. People clean out of their collections all the time. If you really want something, post a WTB and see what happens.

 

As a person on a limited budget in this hobby, and as a newbie, the second-hand market can be a very dangerous place. I constantly have my eye out for "too good to be true" deals, which is why research and communicating with the seller is so important. I have seen recasts that are impossible to tell from legit in photos and pose just as well as legit, so unless you hold the doll in your hands and look inside the head you don't always know what you're getting. I feel that I was very lucky in getting my doll; I posted on a few groups on Facebook of what I was wanting to pay and someone from here responded with exactly what I was looking for and included the certificate, and for that I am very grateful.

It is extremely easy for someone in my situation to be taken advantage of, so to find out - even after research and communication - someone had sold me a recast while leading me to believe it was legit, I would be devastated. But I would also have an attachment to the doll since I had spent the time finding a sculpt I love at a price I can afford. I would definitely contact the seller to let them know I knew what they had done, whether they meant to rip me off or not. Then I would probably go ahead and keep the doll even if the seller offered me a refund, due to attachment and to prevent someone else from being duped if they tried to sell it as legit again, and I definitely wouldn't resell it myself. I just wouldn't post any photos or information about it here, since that is against this board's rules. I would hope that if I had mistakenly posted here before realizing the doll was a recast, that I wouldn't be flamed for it or have people telling me what to do with my purchase or how to spend (or in this case, waste) my money. If my situation changed and I eventually saved up for a legit version of that doll, I would absolutely buy it and save the recast as faceup/blushing practice or mod fodder... in which case I wouldn't be posting many photos of it anywhere since I'd have my legit to share.

There is a very big difference between being scammed by someone who may or may not know what they are doing, and from going to a recaster and knowingly buying a fake. When you as a buyer are scammed, you are the victim and should not be punished for that. It's even possible the person who sold it to you was scammed and didn't know what they were selling, and I honestly don't think they should be punished either. The fault lies with the original person who knew what they had and sold it as something else.

 

If it were me, I agree with most people in saying that I would keep the doll. I am against recasts and finding bjd's suspiciously cheap is a huge indicator, but as a newbie, I wouldn't have known that. I would just keep her to myself. I'd do photoshoots and still buy/make her stuff but I wouldn't post about it. And I'd probably stay away from DOA for a while, since everybody already knows that I owned a recast. But time passes and people forget. And if that doll never comes up again, then they probably wont even remember if you wait long enough. If I've already bonded with the doll, and knowing that it's impossible to sell a recast on the marketplace, it seems dumb to get rid of her.

 

Yeah, I know in DOA we're not allowed to post recast dolls. I'm just saying that they can have a recast dolls and possibly mod them to their liking and post them somewhere else.

I'm just going to say that I agree with your reasoning.

 

Being in that hypothetical situation, I would not sell the doll and instead save up for the real deal when/if it turns up on the second hand market. She bought it in good faith, and it turned out bad - but selling it on would encourage other people to buy recasts which is even worse. I'm not a full-fledged artist, but I think what the recast companies are doing is one of the worst things ever, and even though I haven't cut off friends for buying recasts, my regards for those people was hastily lowered and my respect for them lost. For all I know, they could just as easily rip off something I make, or friends make - as they're clearly showing no respect whatsoever for the hard work artists put in their art and the integrity that's behind it. Also, having the "authentic dolls are too expensive" as an excuse isn't really cutting it - not everyone can afford everything, and that's harsh, blunt reality. I can't afford a Porsche, that's why I drive a VW. I won't be able to by myself a limited, full-set doll from expensive companies, but there are plenty of dolls left to choose from that are in my price range. Not having money is the reason people rob banks, and buying recasts is just as illegal and as damaging.

However, I'd feel terribly for the girl being in such a situation depicted in the first post. If one of my dolls would turn out to be an illegitimate doll, having bought it in good faith of its authenticity, I'm not sure if I'd be able to keep it. For I like to show my dolls and the crafts I make them, and not only would I feel bad showing it too others if they'd turn out to be recasts, but also I wouldn't like to show it in fear of giving people the notion that it's okay to buy recasts. I wouldn't be able to sell it, but have to put it in its box under the bed. Alternatively use it as a project/test doll to try new stuff on, as long as I don't show it to anyone.

It's a tricky situation, best avoided by buying directly from the company or their retailer. This hobby is tricky, in that sort of way - I didn't even know what a recast was when I first found out about the hobby, and as recasts are a sensitive subject it was hard getting information about it without accidentally stepping on people's toes.

 

Strange how exactly this happened to a friend of mine.
She was completly new to the hobby.
Just knew the dolls were beautiful and that she wanted one for herself to sew for her.
And it was exactly like this, that she bought one from an online store and fell completly for her, when she came home.
She sewed for her and was pretty happy till she came across the same doll on an owner picture on facebook.
She chatted with the owner and told her she got the same doll, even shared pictures.
The other person was nice enough to simply tell her that her doll wasnt legit, but a fake.
(which was pretty visible in retrospective, because the colour didnt match any of the legit ones)
Only then my friend realized, that there existed copies in general of bjds.
(She thought there were only legit ones and didnt knew much about the different companies too)

She too searched for the original sculpt just to see that it was totally out of her price range to buy the real deal.
So she kept the doll still for sewing practise and because of the emotinal bond they had already.

Her statement was, that she never would pay the real price for one of those dolls, since they seemed too off for her.
That was, till I showed her, that there is also a second-hand market, where she could buy the real dolls for less too, without buying a copy.
And so in the end of the year she bought her doll a legit 'boyfriend' off from ebay, with original box and everything. ^^
Its pretty visible how much more she likes that she can share him everywhere and talk freely about owning him, in comparision to her first doll.
But she also states, that she still does love her first doll the most, due to the time she spended with her.

And in general I think its pretty visible, if someone use the 'I didnt knew it was a fake!' as some kind of excuse to get away with it, because no person in their right mind would make a big thing out of it, after discovering the truth.
I think the people who really didnt knew, like my friend, just dont talk about it anymore and keep their distance from the topic.
Enjoying the fake doll in their own way and sharing the real ones to their hearts content everywhere else. ^^

In this case it was just missinformation and bad research, which seems to happen so easily to Newbies, who just want jump into the hobby.
That why I think sharing knowledge is so important.

 

I think that to throw away a recast, as long as it wasn't toxic to hang on to, would be something of a waste. It seems to me that it would be better to acquire a legitimate version of the doll that was recast, then use the recast to show people how the recast compares with the legitimate doll, and what to look out for. That would be better for spreading awareness of the problem with recasts than just getting rid of or destroying it.

 

If it isn't destroyed though there is a significant risk of the recast doll being sold on - for example, collectors pass away and don't always discuss their collection with their unsuspecting families before they die. There are many people on this forum whose families have zero interest in this hobby and wouldn't be able to distinguish dolls by company never mind which are legitimate dolls and which are fakes without a doll enthusiast with experience in this area to point out the differences. The families either sell the dolls on or give them away, but without knowing about fakes they'll get mixed up in legitimate doll sales and hurt the secondary market.

If a recast is bought accidentally the buyer can and really should put in a claim through Paypal or contact their bank and initiate a chargeback because they were not sold legitimate goods and are entitled to their money back. Paypal requires that counterfeits are destroyed so that the same item can't be used to defraud other people, banks may have similar requirements too. It is better to try and get your money back from the fraudsters who tried to cheat you than to hang on to a doll you really wouldn't have bought if you knew the truth about it. As much as we like to project human emotions on to our dolls they really don't feel anything and you don't have to feel particularly sorry for a doll because it's a recast. If I found out I owned a recast my feelings about the doll would change pretty rapidly and I definitely wouldn't hang on to it. I couldn't enjoy owning a doll if it was a recast and I wouldn't want it in my house any second longer than it had to be.

 

I don't see the scenario as a dolly sin at all. They bought something they thought was legit where's the sin on the buyers part. Not researching isn't sinful at all not everyone does loads of research before buying things they see and love.

 

I would still keep the doll because she had bonded with it , and it wasn't her fault as she wasn't aware that it might have been a fake.

 

If I bought one by accident, I'd personally keep it, but keep it a secret. I don't like to throw things away.

I don't get why people buy recasts, though. A lot of the secondhand market is the same price/cheaper than recasts, and if your doll isn't in the color you want, dye it or blush it! It's really more daunting than it seems!

 

I can't believe people would keep it after knowing it was a recast AND getting a refund. A recast's very existence means one less legitimate doll bought from the hard working people who sculpted and engineered it. I can't believe there are forums and YouTube groups that celebrate that kind if theft. It sickens me.

 

Well, if I got a refund, I'd probably use it to buy a legit version of the same doll. But I wouldn't trust recasters to give money back, to be honest!

 

I would definitely try to get a refund. If a refund was impossible I would give the doll to my best friend's daughter. She would love and adore it but it probably wouldn't make it very far in her care, thus being enjoyed but eventually destroyed.

I'm the type who just wouldn't be able to get over the fact that my doll is a fake. I would rather own clothing from value village than buy a fake louis vuitton handbag. It's just the way I am and the doll being a re-cast would turn me off it.

That being said, how many people who disagree with recasts download free music, free movies, etc...

I believe I saw this argument in a video somewhere, how can you be against one type of theft and not against the other?

 

Ament to that. People don't think twice about stealing some things. I design crochet patterns & people post them to websites for free all the time and think nothing of it even though all pattern designers state that they are not to be posted to any website. The attitude is who cares and the little guy loses sales when they make very little profit in the first place.

If I bought a recast accidentally and could not get a refund there is no way I would toss it in the trash. You pay good money for something you should not have to be punished twice for it. In this case the seller is the thief not the buyer.

 

You would get a refund through PayPal or credit card reversal, I doubt a criminal would give a refund.

 

There are circumstances where it's impossible to get your money back. I doubt a new doll buyer would figure it out right away unless someone with more doll experience told them their doll was a recast.

 

If this is completely hypothetical? Hold on to your hats, the queen of unpopular opinions is in.

I would destroy it. Outright. I've seen many people say they'd keep it because of a bond they'd forged with it, and don't get me wrong, once that bond is formed it's hard to break.

But I personally cannot stand the idea of knock-offs, and as someone who has had work that they've released FOR FREE abused by terrible people who are making a profit out of SELLING my work? That bond would not last. In a way, I guess I'm petty and flighty. But by the same token, I would acknowledge the fact that it's not the doll's fault- the company behind selling it should be held accountable. I would do all in my power to make sure nobody makes the same mistake I did.

 

Well then your majesty, I'll be your handmaiden of unpopular opinion because I completely agree ^_^ Destroy those illegal items and NEVER knowingly support theft and shutting down smaller companies or making popular companies like Dollshe stop making dolls (they went off the radar for like 3 years because of a recasting ordeal).

People who knowingly buy recasts disgust me and I would not associate with them. This day in age there is NO excuse. There are plenty of cheap legitimate companies that make beautiful dolls now, tons of information on how to mod or dye your doll (or modders to do it for you) there are even services to get a doll sculpted exactly the way you want it from scratch. It's just laziness, entitlement and greed that fuels these people, they don't care if they destroy the company that spent months, in some cases years sculpting and engineering that doll that they supposedly "love" as long as they can get a quick, cheap payoff.