Accidentally Buying a Copy: What Should They Do?

I agree with most people say and I say that this hypothetical girl should keep her doll. I mean she's new to the hobby and it isn't really her fault if she didn't know. As long as she didn't go around "praising" the fake company it's fine. Just don't post it on DOA, you can still love it if it's a fake. Luckily in my first few months on DOA there were many report threads about fake dolls so I was kinda aware. But even now, i still don't know much. It's not like the girl purposly did it, she shouldn't be hounded for her actions. Though I am kind of against the whole "I want a doll cause it's cheap" thing sure I love dollzone and bobobie(sp?) but it's for it's sculpts not price (that's just a lil bonus ) IMHO saving up the monies to get your "dream doll" is part of the hobby...though it seems that price wasn't a big issue here....sorry for rambling I do that lots ^^;;

 

Ok, let me rephrase my comment, since it disturbs ME when something thinks that I'm an immoral jerk, or whatever.

If I bought my dream doll, thinking that it was real, and got it home to see that it was a fake, I would be upset. But if i paid less than what the real doll is worth, and it looked just fine to me, then I would NOT throw it away, and I wouldn't be upset. I'd be perturbed that I was conned into something illegal, but I'm not going to feel like my life is over because of it.
And for the record, there is a different from knock-off and exact copies. In the case of getting a knock-off, as in it says "Volkz" or something instead of "Volks" and it's slightly off, then I don't think that is as bad as getting something that has been deliberately stolen. In the case of the latter, I would be more upset, but I still would not discard something that I had paid for.

 

A company calling their dolls "Volkz" IS something deliberately stolen. It is totally unacceptable for a company to replicate/seriously imitate a popular company's name, sculpts, etc. It is illegal and ethically wrong, and its something even more sensitive when its essentially artwork that is involved. While I wouldn't blame a person who unknowingly purchased a 'fake', I would certainly blame the company or someone knowingly supporting a company that ripped off another...

 

Then every dollar store in the US should be shut down, along with every supermarket, grocery store, and discount place. Go down any aisle in any grocery store, you'll see the "Canned Soup!" next to the "Cambles soup", with similar coloring and shape and design and everything, yet at the same time proclaiming that its say, stop&shop brand rather than that particular brand. Go down another aisle, you'll see store brand anything next to and with similar packaging as any other major brand.

However, i do agree that if this hypothetical "Volkz" started producing recasts of "Tsukaza" and "Reizner", for example (^.~) then there'd be a problem. Although, if this "volkz" made bjds of lesser quality, for lesser value, with different sculpts, it wouldnt be illigal. A bit misleading, yes, but thats the intent, to make the buyers think your products are better than anothers, be it by using the same shaped bottle, placing your store brand "chips abound!" next to "Chips ahoy!" or calling your company volkz rather than volks. Certain marketing schemes are pretty low, but still legal.


I will say, though, that i agree with kirakukami in that if i got a doll under the impression that it was a major company's specific sculpt only to find out it was a recast or a fake, i'd be upset, but surely you arent suggesting that i should just throw out that few hundred dollars i just spent on something i thought was legit. I'd feel ripped off and upset and all, but i'm not just going to throw it out. I'll throw a fit to the seller if it was somehing i'd gotten on ebay or in the marketplace or something, and bad feedback ahoy, but i'm not going to throw it out.

Heck, i'd probably make a point of finding the real thing and basing a storyline around it XD The poor unsuspecting clone would probably end up all depressed that he was called a fake and a fraud and the real one would be all awesome and cheer him up, cause just because he was created with bad intentions doesnt mean he's a bad thing himself and just cause the doll was created from recasting another mold doesnt mean he's not a doll. But hey, thats a plotline for another thread ^.~

 

This is not accurate to my knowledge at all. Copyrights and trademarks exist for a reason. You cannot name your company something so similar if you are selling the same family of products.

 

I honestly do not think that anyone has the right to berate someone else who has had the misfortune of accidentally buying a "knock-off". It is hard enough to deal with the consequences of finding out you've bought a "knock-off" doll without being made to feel worse by others who are not accepting or understanding (not trying to insinuate anything here). If a person was to buy a "knock-off" without their knowledge and was to post pictures of the doll on DOA. Instead of not allowing the person to post on DOA and making them feel like an outcast. A special allowance needs to be made ( i am aware that this could result in people claiming that they accidently purchased a "knock-off" when in fact they purchased the doll with the knowledge that it was a "knock-off" ). If you do come across a person who is a newbie and who happens to post pictures of "knock-off", not knowing it is one. Be the better person, whilst you can let them know that their doll is a knock-off, do it in a kind manner and maybe even offer them some support, assistance and advice. Being humble towards another person will make you feel as though you have more self-respect and you'll be better for it. When a person first enters into the bjd world, it can be very confusing and overwhelming. It's only after you've been versed in world of bjd's for a certain amount of time do you become more knowledgeable and are able to avoid buying "knock-offs". My advice to anyone who was thinking about buying their first bjd is to do as much research as possible, the more informed you are, the better of you'll be for it in the long run. Speaking of doll "knock-offs", i am curious to know how you would even be able to tell the difference between a real and fake doll if you are new to the bjd world? Is there a section on DOA which newbies can access to find out about known "knock-offs" and companies who make them? If not that would a very good thing to do and would help newbies in avoiding buying knock-offs.

I would just like to add that this is my opinion and i am not trying to insinuate anything about anyone one on DOA. Nor is it my intention to insult anyone or turns this into a fight or heated debate. I just thought i would offer my thoughts and hope that someone will see this issue from my perspective.

 

See, while i understand why it'd be at least somewhat infringing on copyright and trademakrs, i'm also having issues believe that every discount/dollar/grocery/wahtever store in the US (and maybe all over the world, i'm only familiar with the stuff around my area) should be put out of business and sued to no end just because they make similar products with similar labels and similar titles and put them on the same shelves next to the actual things--yet they havent, and this isnt something new. i mean, i could be missing something integral to the inner workings of my grocery store and dollar store that allows them to use almost identical packaging to the point that someone running past and only glancing at what they're tossing int eh cart would easily miss the fact that its not the brand they intended, but somehow i'm doubting that its illegal to do something like that--at least here--when its so commonly done in like every store.

--this isnt saying i dont see issues with the marketing ethic behind such practices, but just that it doesnt seem illegal due to how often and openly its already done virtually everywhere.

 

Store brands vs. leading brands is unrelated to the direct copying of BJD sculpts and the naming of the company that infringes on another company's name. (Besides the fact that the leading brands actually produce many "store brands".)

A company cannot call themselves Compbells and sell soup, for example. This is the point of Kirakukami's post that I was disputing, she said that a company named Volkz that sold Volks-like sculpts isn't "deliberately stealing" I'm not sure what else it is? Its certainly not a coincidence!

 

By 'deliberately stolen' I meant that it would not be the exact same quality and mold of the original Volks. Gah, people. I'm not the devil here, and I promise that I'm not going to run off and buy a knock off, stolen doll and wave it around triumphantly.

The original question of this post was what if a girl bought a doll that was fake, loved it and played with it, and then found out it was not real. This isn't about people that buy knock off dolls just because they can, right? I didn't intend for my post to spawn a huge discussion about whether or not knock-off companies are ethical, because they're not. Companies that make exact copies of dolls, but the original name on them, and sell them for the same price are BAD. They're con artists, and they should be shut down.

And as for the Volkz thing, my point was basically where some of you took it, that there are knock-off brands of things in stores that have a similar image but aren't the same. I think the term for this is 'generic', and they make their packaging similar because people who buy the 'name-brand' are more inclined to buy a similar packaging.

But look, I'm not saying that generic dolls are great, either. I don't even know if these 'generic' types exist, but I was attempting to make the point that if a doll was called a generic but close name, like FOLKS instead of VOLKS, and the dolls had a similiar but very crappy parallel to the doll, like most other generic brands are, then I wouldn't see the huge hooplah with that. But if you're dumb enough to buy something like that, then you know what you're paying for.

 

I think since she bought it, she should keep it and to just be more wary in the future. Research is good, especially because of the price difference. Keep it, and be happy.

 

Well, I would LIKE to keep the doll because I would love it anyway, but I would be afraid of the potentially poor quality, dangerous resin that is often associated with rip-off dolls. o______________0 But other than that, if it was truly a question of ignorance, I would certainly be the last one to disparage someone for their doll; I'm no elitist by any means.

 

Personally I would mod said copy/bootleg extensively until it was unrecognisable. To me that would negate a little of the 'copy' aspect even though it would still be a knock-off.

 

Should she choose what appears to be a morally right path, and get rid of her beloved doll? Absolutely not! Not if the person loves that doll.

Should she keep her doll while remaining on the board, though she doesn't post pictures, bearing the stigma of having purchased a fake? Stigma - meaning - "a mark of disgrace or infamy; a stain or reproach, as on one's reputation." (dictionary.com) Pretty strong words for a person that accidentally bought a copied doll. What happens next? Burn him/her at the stake for his/her ignorance?

Should she disappear altogether, never to be seen on the board again? Making mistakes is part of the learning process and why should a person feel the need to disappear for making a mistake?

What would you do if you inadvertently purchased a fake you'd fallen in love with? I know what I would do; but I'm curious as to what others think. I would keep it and use it as a testing ground for face-ups and mods.

 

She has spent her money on a doll and fallen in love with it. Of course she shouldn't get rid of it, or even be ashamed; however, I would feel obligated at that point to get a second doll, to support the industry in the right way. I would also make a comment on the e-bay feedback section about the problem, and write to the company that made the knock off. I would also be out spoken of about my experience so other newbies don't make the same mistake.

 

I have to agree with most of the posters and say the hypothetical owner should keep it. It's not like she could go and reverse the damage at this point, so what's the harm in loving it even if it is a copy?

I just hope she wouldn't feel terribly guilty about it. It's sad when something like this happens and it's the company's fault, but it's the customer that suffers.

 

I would keep it. The money has been spent, the mistake already made-I would consider it a costly learning experience (even if it was an inexpensive copy).

I would still enjoy it, try customizing & such that I would be too scared to try on the real thing & post photos on flickr so others could learn from my mistake.

 

I would first of all report that seller to anyone and everyone that will listen, including DoA, the company that made the original sculpt, eBay, etc as a FRAUD. I would be angry if that happened to me. Then again, I prefer to buy directly from the well-known companies after getting feedback from others about them, so I am hoping (me being fairly new to this hobby) that this won't happen to me, but when I see dolls that just seem to cheap to be true, I wonder.
I don't think the person has to stop loving their doll or get rid of it, unless they want to. I'm not sure if the rip-off would sour me to the doll or not to be honest, or if I'd continue to love it. Than again, it's not like she can turn around and sell it either. I know I wouldn't even think of selling a fake, KNOWING it is a fake. So either accept the loss and move on, or keep the doll and love it. I'd be angry though if I got ripped off that way.
I also don't think the person should disappear from the boards. That kind of defeats the purpose. Instead, the person should stay and participate and read more, so mistakes like that don't happen. You'd be better off learning more before your next purchase.

I have heard this has happened to people. I've read brief comments about the fact that there are copies. But I'm a picky person when it comes to spending so much money, and would rather go to the source (Iplehouse for example, where I got Claire) than on eBay to look at "No-Name" dolls just because they are cheap.
It took me a while to get Claire, but I KNOW she's an original, directly from Iplehouse, and it pleases me to have spent that much on her. After all, she's worth the money... and so am I

 

For what the hypothetical girl should do, I would say it really depends on her. If she's very strict about counterfeits, the very fact of being a counterfeit would be enough to sour the doll regardless of its previous merits; I wouldn't be terribly surprised if this type of person just quit right there.

If she's a certain kind of blind and stubborn, she might take it personally and start moralizing or arguing about it and probably get suspended/banned anyway.

If she's in the moderate ground like I think most of us are, she would have already bonded with the doll, so there would be no point in disposal or even excessive guilt. Jokingly call the doll "Mr./Ms. Lead", laugh it off as a the price of a lesson learned and continue on in the hobby (more carefully).

I follow the middle and call it a sunk cost. She's already spent the money. Presumably she thought the doll provided enough enjoyment to seek a community like DoA in the first place. Even if the doll was a fake, the feelings inspired were real. What she learned afterwards won't change the original decision, so why dwell on it?

 

Call me a cynic, but: As a whole, the people on DoA are a very nice, genuine sort of people - until it comes to fake dolls. I can just imagine some of the people here giving this girl proverbial whiplash with how fast she would be thrown to the lions. I've seen it before with honest mistakes on this board and I'll probably see it again. (A certain post in the buying/shipping q's board springs readily to mind.)

If the girl survives that initial backlash and isn't so put off that she stops posting completely, she'd probably have a high level of guilt and resentment now permanently affecting her opinion of her beloved doll. I know that I would. Just -looking- at the doll would probably be enough to remind her of everything that's happened.

So as much as I would like to be one of the people who says 'she should keep the doll and not post it', I can't see how keeping the doll would make her happy. It'd be like having a very expensive (Well, not as expensive as some, but still quite costly) reminder of a very negative experience. The doll would also have the stigma now of being fake, being a knockoff.

I don't see how one could keep something like that without getting upset and uncomfortable when one looks at it.

If it were me, it'd probably feel like going through a bad break up. Here's something that you loved, you found out it was not quite what you wanted because people who meant well but were really quite nasty about it told you so. So you look at it, and the love is there, but there's a niggling doubt now, it's associated with bad things. You can't quite feel the same as you did because you know it's different. I think that'd slowly eat away at the affection she has for the doll until eventually she had to get rid of it. An experience like that might even be enough to put some people off the hobby completely.

Or at least that's probably what would happen in my case. -shrug-