Artists Using Doll Likenesses without Crediting [Mijn Schatje discussion]

Oh Luts, I love you so much. I'm SO proud to own one of your precious boys now. *hugs her DV Shiwoo* Igainst this woman, and if she doetaking a stand against this woman, and if she doesn't take down your work I will be completely livid with her!

Oh wow! I LOVE Junko Mizuno! I really hope that clothing company was naive towards what this woman has done.

 

I'll be honest, I'm surprised by the level of artistic ability I regularly see present on this board -- in a good way. It's a very positive thing to see -so- many people who are skilled in their chosen medium (whether it's 2d art traditional/digital, faceup, sculpting, costuming, photography... the list really -does- go on and on). I don't doubt people could easily do something that could really catch the public eye and interest.

I do caution, like a lot of others have, about doing it out of spite. If you're going to do it? Do it because you love it and because it inspires you. Believe it or not, it can show when you have a lot of passion and love for your subject, and that's where the art comes from. Spite? Well, that can show, too.

Personally? I am not a fan of her style. It's 'pretty', but it looks very sterile to me. May just be the color palette, but I don't think that's the sum of it. To my eye, the interaction of objects -- even abstracted objects -- should have a certain organic flow that I tend to find lacking in her work. That it's cut-and-paste assembled from other pieces goes a long way to explaining that sense of things being out-of-joint in ways that aren't directly intended. (Take a peek at one of the pieces that is a full body assembled from multiple sources images vs. just a head/portrait drawn from one source image, and you may get a better idea of what I mean.) Frankensteining can show, even if it's not something I'm not consciously aware of when I look at a piece. I'd seen one of hers before and it hit that nerve with me, and now I know exactly why.

 

Surreality I have to agree with you on MS's art. To me it's devoid of emotion, and that's something I really look for in art. Even some of the most abstract and intentionally sterile art has emotion in it expressed by the artist. Hers, not so much. And even before I knew that she traced the details in her stuff (like the flowers, swallows and such) looked like a bunch of copypasta. As I told my friend last night, that is NOT art. That's a junior highs chool collage project for a book report.

 

Great response from LUTS! As others have said, that is a good relief after the "did they/didn't they let her" Leekeworld situation...! Well done, LUTS, I think everyone is behind you!

And thanks Ginarolo, for compiling that list... wow, it sure is a lot...

 

Can someone please make sure all this info gets sent to Luts, since they are rejecting her pleas for "collaboration" and asking that her works be removed from sale/display? I am sure this would help them enormously in their efforts to contact retailers and galleries.

*Huggles my Abadon* I haven't been posting a lot on this thread, but I have been following it since the first few posts. I am so glad Luts is taking a stand against having their works used without their permission, and am still very interested to see how Volks responds. If both companies pursue action, she'll be in quite a bit of trouble.

 

Wow, thanks LUTS for the update That's good to know.

About the merits (or lack there of) of Mijn's artwork...I don't know how I feel, because I'm not sure how much of what I find attractive in it isn't due to the fact that she traced bjd faces, and obviously I find bjd aesthetic appealing. I think also if she set herself up initially as a collage artist, I might also be more appreciative(and of course if she had been more ethical from the beginning). Working with and putting together found objects is a valid way to create art and does take it's own skill to do well. However, the way she's gone about things is ten kinds of wrong, so it's hard for me to look at her work at all objectively.

 

The bottom line is this:

Mijn used photos without the permission or even knowledge of their owners and copyright holders, both company and private photos.

Posting of these images anywhere on the internet is a DMCA violation and can be reported as such to the major search engines and site holders, and they are obliged in the US to take action.

She has denied this for years.

documented by Radiotrash

When finally confronted with the evidence she denied this as well.

documented by Radiotrash

When forced to admit it, she still refused to admit the scope of her plagiarism.

documented by Radiotrash

When forced to admit the scope of her plagiarism, she has still made no effort at individual apologies, credit on the images, or even a token form of compensation.

 

I have to admit, just reading some of this has gotten my blood boiling. Because, yet again, some "artist" is cashing in on what is essentially plagiarized fan art. And by coming up with clever "stories" she can sell what she does for a lot of money. Although I haven't read through this entire thread, I can't be the only one who wonders if her "childhood" isn't as fabricated and pieced together as her "art." In the meantime artists who work hard perfecting their craft are overlooked because of a fraud with a better sales-pitch.

As for her fans. . . well, many people have to be told how to feel about something as esoteric as art. And probably most don't want to look foolish by asking questions or saying they don't like or don't understand the art.

I find her work flat, lifeless, and uninspiring. In all likelihood, any scrapbooker worth their salt could put together a better collage. Where is the life in the dolls' eyes that I know existed in the original photo? Did she steamroller it in her haste to get the print to market? The only thing I feel in looking at her "work" is that she see dollar signs as she assembles it. No feeling or love of the subject comes out, it's all technique and expensive computer programs.

 

Just wanted to add my cheers to Luts. Thank you so much for keeping us updated. And it's wonderful to hear this decision because it shows that you have integrity, which is always admirable of course. I think you've been giving pretty good advice to the general public too.

I've always liked your dolls and your items and this just makes me feel a lot more comfortable buying from you.

 

This. I cannot tell you just HOW MANY variations of LIES Mijn would have been telling, just by being able to use Luts email on her myspace. (why not your website btw mijn? Not important enough to put it where it really matters?)

And Dianna, I'm also so very proud of Luts stance. I completely blew my top when I saw that she had used an El. I'm all for "Everyone needs an El", but that's just not the right way Dx

 

I've been following this thread with interest, and I have to say that if one good thing comes out of it, I hope it's an increased awareness that you do need to ask permission, and that just because something is on the internet doesn't mean it's up for grabs.

I would also like to say to the group considering making a calender and shirts and stuff, please wait.
While it would be awesome to have a calendar of nice BJD art, to do it in her style would just muddy the waters and yes, it would look like a spiteful publicity stunt.
Say all you want about how it would be better and diffferent, but "Better" is a subjective term, and to the random man on the street, someone who is unaware of this whole travesty and the one we really want to be reaching, it would just look like a copycat work.
That would entirely defeat the purpose.
Instead, what about putting together a colaborative work showcasing all the different art styles of the very talented artists on the board? Not only would it be much more genuine, it would likely be more interesting and compelling.

I would also like to thank the team at Luts and Denny for standing up to this gal and not letting her slide with her false misunderstanding and lies. I know this must be a very trying time, but I think that if everyone sticks together we can outlast her and her lies and her "oh poor me, why is everyone picking on me?"

 

Now this... I would completely support that project! I'm not too much into the whole "trying to simulate other styles" thing anymore. Back in the day, I kept trying to replicate anime because it seemed like a cool subculture thing to do when I was in high school. But I finally realized and accepted it just isn't my natural style, even though I still find it appealing.

However, a collaborative effort of BJD-related art in each artist's own individual style would be a much more interesting project, I think. I would probably buy a calendar or similar product even if I didn't contribute artistically! I think that speaks more about cohesiveness in the community, and less about being spiteful towards Mijn.

Also, I'm so glad Luts is taking a stand. I haven't always seen eye to eye with some of Luts' stances on issues, but in this case I am behind them 100%. I appreciate the fact that they pointed out Mijn's lack of apology, and the way she phrased it as an "offer of collaboration" after the artwork had already been completed and published. It shows that the letters she's sending to the companies mirror the statements we've seen so far.

 

Seeing how she wrote to LUTS makes me wonder what she told Leekeworld in order to get their "authorization." It seems entirely possible that they said that she could put their URL on that specific piece, but did not otherwise give an endorsement. (It's a good business move to do so, really, as the piece is out there already and it may as well generate some interest for them.) It also seems that she is forgetting to mention that there is commercial use involved, rather than this just being an online gallery of fanart.

DIM and LUTS are lucky to have good English translators who are also very involved in the owner community... I feel bad for other companies who aren't so lucky. I worry that they will be taken advantage of simply because they aren't aware of everything that's going on, or can't see through the way she words her letters.

I wouldn't personally support making derivative doll art in response to Mijn Schatje's work... it sort of perverts the art. Perhaps at some point we could organize a DoA calendar of exceptional artistry though (and get the proper permissions), and do something that is purely creative and without the tinge of revenge.

 

I agree with Armeleia. I don't think we need to do anything in Mijn's style. The main focus, and therefore the draw, of her artwork is the faces. We don't need to vector our already gorgeous doll faces in order to make something of true art worth that can likely appeal to the same market.

And doing something to spite someone else, although it can be very cathartic, is never good for the Karma.

 

I would love a DoA calendar! I was not really going one way or the other with the other purposed project, I was not going to tell people no, but I was not going to out right support it either as it falls in a gray area I am not comfortable with. However, I love the idea of a calender and proceeds could go to supporting the boards (and the cost of making them). We could have face up artist, photographers, sketch artist, clothing commissioners all colab and we could try and get company sponsorship (and permission of course). It be a great way for companies to promote their items and DoA members to share their art and support the board we love. Ok...that was a bit OT, but I think this is an awesome idea that is not tinged with revenge.

 

Luts' response is one that makes me happy.
Good to see that the companies are fighting back against copyright infringement.

 

I wonder this too, Armeleia. It seems she's purposefully wording things ambiguously and avoiding the commercial use when emailing these doll companies.

Though a DoA Artist Calender would be pretty swell! Show these companies what real artists can do!

 

The tracing of photographs comes off as so unprofessional!

Granted, she may not have actually traced, she could have used a grid or drew by eye by looking at the picture, but either way, they're still copied from an original source.

Now, as someone who has done art for years, it's rather juvenile to draw from a photograph rather than from still life. Now, yes, it does help to learn this way from some perspectives, but a good artist should be drawing from 3D, not 2D.

 

I think it has been proven that she HAS traced...this is by the overlay of her prints and the orginal photos. Furthermore, she actually posted that she used a vector program and posted pictures of how she traced over the picture (several pages back are pics from the website she posted this on).

 

i think my next doll will have to be a luts doll now.
i am EXTREMELY glad luts did not let mijn walk all over them.

i hope volks says something soon.