Beauty is in the Eye of the Beholder...

I definitely agree with the statement, "beauty is in the eye of the beholder". Sure, there are aesthetics that are more popularly liked by the vast majority, but I, personally, don't like a lot of the more popular molds.

When I fell in love with Blue Fairies, the first one I saw was May, who is gorgeous, and many people have her, but after every picture I see, she becomes less and less intriguing? Many people would disagree with me. Also, I like quite a lot of the DOD sculpts, but I like DoT Isis, while Shall and E-an are the most popular, but they're not really in my liking.

Whenever most people talk about "beautiful people", or the classic beauty aesthetic, they mention how their faces are so symmetrical and perfect, but it bores me. For example, when Meryl Streep was a young actress and she was trying to get roles, not many would want to work with her because she's not a "classical beauty", but I think she's stunning. Also, if you look at Project Runway or America's Next Top Model (lol) or just fashion shows in general, the models aren't symmetrical, and models there have to be an intriguing beautiful.

Some of the dolls I like, a lot of people really don't. I love the Kid Dollmore Miro, but a lot of people would like to disagree. Not saying my tastes always stray far away from the mainstream ones, but I do like a lot of the ones that aren't always loved.

 

Well I see it two ways. There are "ugly" dolls that are just badly made, bad marks on them, sculpting is messy and uneven, and things like that. Some people may not think these imperfections are bad, and that's fine. I still don't like the doll, but I don't think its wrong for them to like it.

However there are also dolls that I myself personally just don't like. In my opinion, I find them ugly. However there isn't anything wrong with them, there are now flaws with it, I just personally don't like the look. Now, I wouldn't ever condemn someone else of for having one of these I find ugly, its a personal opinion. I just simply don't like them, but there's nothing wrong with others liking it.

 

I agree. There are many dolls that I don't like, maybe I think their mouth is funky or something, but I still appreciate that they are made beautifully.

 

I agree. all BJD's are beautiful. Even if i personally would not own, or modify a doll in the way others do. If its beautfiul to them then its beautiful to me :3

 

i've come across quite a bunch of dolls on the internet that i personally think are ugly due to all kinds of reasons but i'd never call anyone out on having "an ugly doll"; that's just rude and not my business. as long as the owner is happy with them and the doll is loved, nobody has the right to say anything bad about it imho. if you got nothing nice to say, don't say it at all.

 

Isn't that quote with everything like people, etc. and not just dolls? "Beauty is the eye of the beholder" Many people can agree to that but in reality, is it really true? Don't beautiful people with a beautiful personality get an edge in life compare to someone who is not so beautiful with a beautiful personality?

 

I never read the book by Margaret Wolfe Hungerford, but I believe that when people use
the phrase "beauty is in the eye of the beholder," they don't mean that everyone agrees
with the idea, or that it is true (truth is as subjective as beauty/art/reality/opinions/ideas).
I think it simply means that everyone has their own opinion of what is beautiful, and some will most
likely disagree on what is "truly-beautiful." Although people tend to agree in masses, that doesn't mean that
everyone and their mothers will agree. I believe the phrase simply means that unless we all (humans)
agree on what makes something beautiful, the idea of universal-beauty (universal meaning all within
the world) will never exist. Thusly "beauty is in the eye of the beholder," could be seen as more "true,"
because not all of us agree on what is "beautiful" - deviants (like me), will always disagree with
the majority.


I think it does apply to everything in life, but this forum's main focus is dolls, so in this case
the topic is focused on dolls. Also, depending on what you call "beautiful,"a few people do get advantages
in life because they appear "attractive" to others - same can be said just about anything else.
What ever sells more will be produced/exposed more often than what few people buy less,
it just makes sense from a marketing perspective. However, does that mean what sells more is in fact beautiful?
I would say no. I believe that as long as we're all different, "beauty" will always be "in the eye of the beholder." ^.~


- Enzyme ^ ^

 

Such a true statement. Yeah, I agree that it applies to a lot of things.

 

hmm You put a very nice perspective to it. It seems like many questions are very subjective on this forum and many people will have different answers. Thus there will never be a right or correct answer. I think people have to define almost every word of what they mean. If people do not define beauty or beholder in very deep terms, I can only generalize or assume what a person thinks. Edit: Thus I can only assume from many people that have posted already that they agree with this quote. I applied that question to people because I wanted to make an analogy. You don't need to take it literally.

However, I do believe that society has to have a coherent agreement to what they believe. If not, then there would be no society. Thus, I assume that beauty can be objective. If you argue that beauty is subjective, why is it not objective as well? But since this is from the "Beholder", of course it is subjective. The question itself was subjective to begin with. This also leads to another question. Is beauty intrinsically valuable or is it instrumentally valuable? People can agree to "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder" but what is really beauty or what is it defined as? Is it a mere attraction to something? Is it the dictionary definition?

Edit to expand on more: Is beauty subjective when people are influenced by others? For example, if I were to grow up in an environment where scars were deemed as hideous, then it is likely that I am going to believe that scars are hideous along with the genetic predisposition to conforming to society. Perhaps, there is even genetic component to as to why people react differently to things such as beauty or etc..

 

It´s hard to add anything new to this kind of discussion, where so many things have already been told at least once. ^^ But I still feel wanting to say something for myself, too, even it´s a bit same than above is already said many times.

I truly think everything isn´t beautiful aesthetically in that way all would please everyone´s eye, but there is place for everything in the world, so for sure there is a place for every doll model in doll loving people´s hearts. I´m sure there exists that sort of "beautiful" dolls that won´t make anyone disliking, offended or annoyed seeing it, but mostly every doll have some unique features in their face, body structure or other options, that make some people really fell for it and some not. That´s the personal taste of ours, which effects that. And I think there´s nothing wrong with that, as long as people don´t make others feel sad for saying something bad for their dolls.

Still I feel there´s difference between people saying "I don´t like at all the dolls of company X!" compared to saying "I don´t like your ugly doll!" I think most of people understand the first statement in that way it tells about personal taste; but it´s plain rude to tell someone you think her/his doll is not for your liking. In that kind situation it really is best to say nothing if there´s no nice things to say.

For me, there´s dolls I like more than others because the realistic measurements of the body, or more natural face expression. I don´t like all dolls in that way I would like to get them for myself, but that doesn´t mean I wouldn´t enjoy watching other people´s photos of that kind of dolls. I actually like really many dolls individually or as model in photos, but would never consider buying one.

People´s liking of different dolls are really depending of what they are looking for as their doll. Like above was told, what if someone wants to make a Quasimodo doll, or a character that isn´t nice and wanted to look mean, loathing, angry, or even withered? Cute and sweet model wouldn´t fit for those needs. Also many appreciate dolls as a realistic looking character, others want them to be like the idealized picture of human being (or some fantasy character) as the reality is all over the world around us. How could these be judged just like the same, as the both ways are as right in their way but have very different motive for their doll.

For example I myself like really much the sweet and real-looking children dolls, and enjoy them just being cute and posing as naturally as a real child. I also love the personal-looking Domadoll sisters which have the soft and chubby feminine body with little roll on waist and all. For me important with my dolls is that they look sweet and lovable, and I´m very happy with that. What I wouldn´t buy for myself would be for example some anime-eyed guy doll in big size, or evil-looking vampire doll, but that doesn´t make me dislike them; they´re just not the ones for me. Not all people like those which I do, and I have no problem with that.

Then there´s people, who write character and build their doll to fit on that role. They choose the doll model for that; they may want the anorectic body, to add scars or burnmarks to make the doll look "uglier" = like it´s seen bad things in it´s life. I have hardly ever seen a doll of those to be just a plain, cute and happy girl and that´s all. I love the way how people make their doll to be a person with whole life behind it. I think the "uglier" dolls, as thought in common way, fit so well for purposes like this. Though I´m sure lots of people buy them also in the same way than I do; because they fall in love their features for reason or another.

And one more thing that comes to my mind, is sort of "Dumbo" -thing; I think it´s common way to think when seen something unusual and not classicly beautiful, sort of "poor thing, nobody else must not care for you, I will take you home and love you" -way. Like, other elephants felt Dumbo ugly with his huge ears, but for the watcher it´s sweet and cute and clumsy and makes you love him even more.

 

I also think that not all dolls are considered beautiful. Some I'd look and say, " hmmm... " But I will not uprightly tell the person, " hey ur doll's ugly " . I believe everyone has different defination of beauty. and like how i may like scarier looking dolls, other may prefer a sweet looking doll.

 

*"the quality or aggregate of qualities in a person or thing that gives pleasure to the senses or pleasurably exalts the mind or spirit : loveliness." - Merriam-Webster Dictionary (Online)

If we go by a definition of "beauty," then I think beauty can never be objective, because it is distorted by individual's feelings/prejudices. Objectivity can't be obscured by those, if it is to be (sorry for the redundancy) "objective." If "beauty" is a person or thing "that gives pleasure to the senses," we assume the pleasure is felt by an "someone," that someone will have its own ideas and prejudices, which will then make what he/she considers "beautiful" not objective. Different people will have different ideas, and thus beauty to others might be objective, and might have different values. As an artist, I have to say that to me "beauty" has always been subjective (depending on the viewer), and will always have both intrinsic and instrumental valuables, because of that.

To me beauty is what the definition suggests: attractiveness, pleasurable-to-look-at. If I don’t' find something pleasurable-to-look-at, then to me it's not beautiful - can it be beautiful to someone else, indeed it can (and most likely will, because I am a weirdo!). Speaking as an "outsider", I believe what we (outsiders/deviants/weirdoes) might find pleasurable to look at, and what the masses find pleasurable to look at, is greatly different – I believe that's the reason why some people will disagree with the idea of the phrase "beauty is in the eye of the beholder," because of the great differences between what is seen by the masses/a-culture/society as "beautiful" and what is perceived by the "outsiders/small-group" as beautiful. It is easier to go with the flow, than to keep an open mind. I think that can be seen in this hobby very clearly, with the how “popular” a few sculpts/companies are, and how so many others aren’t.

As an outsider, I find dark/obscure things (like death, corpses, piercings, mutilation, sadomasochism etc) beautiful, which most people will disagree as being beautiful, but I also find nature, life, cleanliness and the planet beautiful, which most people will also find "pleasing.” Culturally (American), I can't say it is in my culture/society to like or find "death" beautiful, but I am influenced by friends (life-itself), who are from very different cultures than mine. So, yes, I do believe beauty is subjective (in every way), as it not only can be influenced by environment/culture/society/upbringing, but also by (and mostly) personal biases. That’s the reason why I own the dolls I own, and why my collection is relatively small. I don’t buy dolls because I can afford them, I buy the dolls I find beautiful when I can afford them – but only if they are “beautiful” to me.

I see a lot of comments like "I do find “X” dolls ugly but I won't say it to the owner's face,” yet I believe the question is not "do you believe there are ugly dolls," or "do you believe that because to you “X” doll is ugly, it is-fact that it is ugly," it's more like "do you believe that beauty is subjective and why?" Your comment is one of the few that didn't address the question like the former two, and made interesting points about beauty, real-life, truth, and people. So it sparked my interest in the thread again. I rarely post on debate threads (when I originally posted a few threads back, I thought this was more of a general discussion topic, as I find "beauty" a truly subjective/personal term, that can't truly be debated because it is not "objective"), so I thank you for your comments – truly thought-provoking.


*"beauty." Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary. 2010.

Merriam-Webster Online. 17 January 2010
<http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/beauty>

 

I can't claim to be so open-minded myself, since I'm kind of a terrible person. Sometimes, there are dolls I don't think are very pretty. At least with respect to sculpts, though, I remember that some person spent painstaking amounts of time creating it, and I'm not a sculptor or an art critic--so really, what can I say? As for the way people choose to customise their own dolls, I try not to judge because that's a choice they're happy with (a lot of pictures are just taken badly, anyway). I'm going to give my incoming doll black marbles for eyes, and that's bound to draw some criticism. Live and let live, etc. In the larger scheme of things, my personal opinion on other peoples' things doesn't matter.

Hmm, so I guess I do feel that way. Kind of.

 

I think anyone who has the skill to create BJDs is an artist, and all art is beautiful, even if you don't agree with it. I personally don't care for the very small, 'chibi'-ish models, but that doesn't make them ugly.

 

you know i do agree beauty is in the eye of the beholder. because i have had similar debates with my friends in RL. and we finally agreed to disagree. we each customize our own dolls as we see fit. and its beautiful to us in our own eyes. i have never heard of anyone changing their dolls looks or even changing molds because someone commented " oh i think your doll is ugly" personally i wouldnt use ugly as a word to describe. just unique to me is another way to put it. its not that i say it as a bad thing i always try to look at the doll in the eyes of the owner who took the time to make them their own.

 

It's like babies. No matter what, babies are always beautiful.

 

Sorry to say, but this is very untrue.
I find alot of babies absolutely hideous. Babies aren't beautiful by default, unless you're their parent.



But anyhoo, I think in this hobby, when there's lots of things you can do with your doll and their style (modding etc), beauty really is in the eye of the beholder. Someone might dislike it, but that doesn't make it ugly. And someone might love it, but again, that doesn;t make it beautiful. Not sure who defines that, but it's not that simple.

 

I really have to agree with you on this one. I also think that some people are more 'beauty driven' than others, which is why some sculpts sell. The owner doesn't think, wow, he/she is so beautiful, but more that it looks cool or unique, then beautiful. Whereas someone who is more beauty driven only buys the pretty sculpts. I hope that makes sense, I don't normally post in the Debate section.

 

I personally tend to like, or try to find something I like about all molds and individual dolls. I'm not always successful, but I don't sweat it. Sometimes there's just something about a certain doll/mold/company that I just can't like. If someone else can (and they obviously do, since the doll/mold/company is still around), then all power to them.

This is a very individualized hobby. We're not always going to find something we like every time we look. Some people want their dolls to have disfiguring scars, or gore mods, or glittery face-ups, and that's not going to appeal to 100% of the population. But if that's what works for them, then that's awesome.

Of course, there's going to be popular molds/companies (CP El or any Soom Monthly), but that doesn't mean their the pretties or best for someone else.