Contentious doll names - gods and so on.

I'm kind of assuming here, and you know what that makes out of you and me, but perhaps because demons are given a little more leeway in terms of bad behaviour? For example, if you show a surly gothtastic bisexual fallen angel swigging beer, chain-smoking cigarettes and stubbing them out on people's expensive furniture, swearing a blue streak, and wearing bondage gear, it's striking, but in most traditions demons are considered, well, bad, or at the very least different. Now attach any one of those traits to a deity or an angel, beings that most religions put a great deal of stock in as being "good", and you risk offending people by showing them as anything less than the popular perception of good and holy. You can blaspheme a being that's holy, but aren't demons in popular perception something of the opposite of that?

It helps that, in my circle of experience, people are much less likely to venerate demons. As a less-than-mainstream Christian I might be turned off, or maybe giggle if someone has a particularly skewed view of Satan (either as over-the-top, death-metal-album-cover ultimate evil or misunderstood leather pants-clad woobie) but I'd be a bit more annoyed if they had a particularly inflammatory and intentionally offensive portrayal of, say, Jesus. I wouldn't do anything to deface their doll, or deny them the right to have it, but that's a kind of courtesy, isn't it? I'd hope that other people would respect Neopagan doll owners by not doing something that's an intentional affront to their deity, but if they bought the doll, they can do whatever on earth they want to it.

EDIT: Random addition here-- it helps that, at least in my religious view, I don't think you could depict my God in anything less than highly symbolic terms. Other faiths have a more tangible set of images to them, but at least for most depictions of the traditional Christian trinity, angels, etc., you'd be drawing mostly off of other traditional works.

 

i think that is true Rhoswyn.
Demons are fun and most don't take representations of them seriously. People will get very serious, fearful even and take exception to representations of God. Someone would be likely to come along an accuse another of Idol worship i think.

Could anyone really create a representation of God, in a doll?

But for deities, i think it would be fun to have a Kuan Yin, goddess of compassion. She rides a dragon and everything

Yukiya what other gods were you thinking of? I bet their represented somewhere.

 

Rhoswyn >>> The way you typed it is actually what I'm feeling...just...couldn't type out my thoughts... They were kinda jumbled...

crystalquirt >>> Hmm...I did think of naming my msd after a Chinese god, Nezha. It was entertained but discarded as I felt it didn't fit my doll. Hence plain old common name. Edward.

Now I'm a little better with my thoughts. No longer jumbled. So what I'd like to say is that most dolls named after other religions' gods/dieties or ancient gods are deemed as normal. But the moment one of the names of the gods/dieties is being used from current religions, it becomes almost an issue.

Shouldn't demonic names be an issue too? 'Cause well...we shouldn't use demons' names for our dolls...as...it's unholy?

Well...opposite of good is evil. So if we can't name dolls after gods and dieties, we can't name them after demons and any other evil thingies because they're evil.

Er...

I lost my train of thoughts when my mum called me...so I hope the above is rather...logical enough...?

 

it is too logical
we can name them anything we want with out attachment to right or wrong!

 

I don't believe in anything, so I wouldn't be offended if someone calls their dolls after a religous person.
But I do believe that people feel offended, so I just don't give them that name.
But also I don't like the names for my dolls, like Jesus or Mohammed.

 

Just to throw something else in here, I have a doll named Ezekiel, who is actually designed as a biblical angel of sorts. Is that disrespectful to the Abrahamic religions? And if it is, how much does it matter? Would it make a difference if he was called something less obviously biblical?
(I mostly ask because I've had it said to me in the past that my stories about angels could be offensive to people, and I was wondering how much of that was just because they were angels in general, and how much because they were identified with specific named angels.)

 

I admit I'm (still?) a little confused about the apparent hierarchy of religious naming... as Llrael says, if you have a doll named after someone mentioned like once or twice in a religious scripture, would this be just as offensive as a main figure? I'm sort of seeing double standards here and there with the more wide-spread religions being stoutly avoided, but the less wide-spread or deceased religious figures/names being more or less accepted.

Is it up to personal preference when each name/figure passes from religion to myth? How does one decide that?

 

Some names in the Bible or religious texts are just that-- names. If there was a taboo about the name Mary, even with all its religious associations, I don't know what I'd be named. There are people walking around today named after nymphs, apostles, goddesses, flowers... so I'm not one to complain about those. Simply naming your doll Zeus or Athena or Jesus or Lakshmi wouldn't be the part that would irritate me-- it'd be seeing that name used for shock value at a contrast with its religious meaning. That's usually pretty intentional.

 

This is such an interesting debate(/discussion ehehe)! For me, I think that dolls are personal expression -- BUT if we're going to go traipsing around singing "My dolls name is Satan HAHAHAHAHAHA" then it would be rather inappropriate -- did you name the doll simply to feel cool and hardass? And obviously, respecting the opinions of anyone who was offended. Fights over things like that are unnessesary.

 

I'm a Jew who lives in Israel, so with the Holocaust and all (and especially considering the fact that both of my boyfriend's grandparents are holocaust survivors...), I would refrain from naming my doll "Adolf"... It's a nice name, really, and common enough- but I'm sure that many people around here would find it highly offensive. I guess it's the point where a name stops being "just a name". In Germany Adolf or Hitler are probably still common names, but around here they only have one connotation- you never hear those names when it doesn't have to do something with Adolf Hitler. I also wouldn't name a doll "Jehovah", simply because I would be scared to say it out loud .

 

Aye, I think it's alright to name your doll "Adolf" or "Jesus" or "Loki" (in fact, I have a character named Loki) as long as you're not BLATANTLY portraying that person. If the doll Jesus is a stoic looking mold with long brown hair, a beard, and white robes, THEN it becomes a problem. And I think Adolf is a wonderful name (and very common in Germany) - as long as it's not paired with the familiarized last name, that I won't mention.

It's simply what you make of it. An atheist could see a doll named Jesus and take nothing of it, but a Christian could see it and take offense. This is the same for everything - there are hundreds of different gods, demons, prophets, saints, and religions - you're going to offend someone eventually, and that's life. XD

 

I'm from austria, that's not germany but hitler was born in austria. And I guess the situation is similiar in gemany
I would NEVER consider to give a BJD the name adolf.
Ii WAS common name but it's old-fashioned, most likely because of Adolf Hitler. As far as I know it was prohibited for decades to give a baby the name Adolf in Austria.
Hitler, as a surname, doesn't exist anymore. People whose names were hitler were forced to alter their surnames.

//history lesson off//



I would NEVER EVER call a doll Adolf.
never.

apart from that I can't think of an name I would totally avoid.
I probably wouldn't name a doll after an acquaintance

 

This is a great topic! *jumps in with both feet*

I think naming a doll after a biblical or otherwise religious name is great as long as you aren't doing it to get a rise out of anyone. In fact I find the idea of using biblical names for dolls a great reminder of ones faith. I'm considering using a biblical name (at least for the middle or sir name) for my doll when I get him, if it fits.

Although, I don't think I'd ever name a doll Jesus, simply because I've never been particularly fond of the name itself... Don't get me wrong; I like the guy, but the name just doesn't strike me as sitting right with character I'd have. Otherwise I have no problems with it.

The name Lucifer on the other hand, while I hate the guy, I love the name (seriously one of my favorites--what a great ring). Unfortunately the damn devil ruined it for the rest of us! He was once considered the most beautiful of angels...and I don't think a name should be corrupted because of the bearers actions, so maybe it depends on the context. He does get called "Satan" after his fall, so I like to think he lost the rights to "Lucifer". What do you all think?

As for other biblical names or those from other religions, as long as it's done tactfully. (And/or broken up; I don't think taking a full name of another character or person is very polite.) I'm cool with anything really. Names are, after all, just names. I don't think anyone has the right to own a name exclusively. Although for certain names I wait until the character, author, etc. dies, finishes the story, or gives it up, before highjacking part of an uncommon name for one of my characters (or dolls as soon as I'm able to be in that category). If that makes sense.

 

I dunno.. as a writer, I find the idea of different interpretations on things very interesting. I might find some interpretations of characters with religious names to be really weird or completely off the mark, but I don't find any of them offensive, even when they are using the name of the god I worship.

I can see where it might be offensive to some, but the way I see it it's just one person's take on it and it doesn't impact the 'actual' god or whatever that it was named after. I view it sort of like a "what if?" scenario. In some other version of the world, ____ deity has lived a completely different life and therefore turned out entirely different.

 

Over the years, I've created many characters, and finding names for all of them can be a problem. I'll look through name databases, and sometimes just pick names that I like the sound of... for instance, Melchior.
I've always liked the name, but does that mean I'm making my character into one of the wisemen from the bible? No. Sometimes names are just names. Sometimes I'm just looking for a name that's unusual.
Sometimes I'll pick a name that has religious connotations, but is also used by millions(?) of people as regular names. Sometimes it's just for irony's sake.
I DO have characters who are biblical characters- Arch Angels to be specific. It wasn't done to offend anybody, while I'm not christian, I do have a certain love for them, and the characters are sort of my own take on them. While I do have fun with them, they're still handled with respect.

I think so long as you're not using the names purely for shock value, it should be fine. Most of us who use these names probably aren't intending to offend anybody... Usually... it's just a name.

 

Thanks for that! I've been to Austria, but I actually didn't know that people felt so strongly about it. It's good to know! I know someone who called his fish Adolf. Apparently he found that hilarious . I guess that's what people in this thread meant when they said that some people give their dolls certain names just for the shock value. I think it's kind of immature.

 

I dunno, because i can, here goes. Maybe it's the horribly sacreligious side of me that finds the idea of a Jesus doll completely histerical. Could he be emo? Or a hippie? As a personality quirk, does he wash people's feet if they track mud in the house? Sackcloth Tuesdays? *chortles*

As for other dieties, i myself have a doll named Ambika after the Hindu goddess. I read on Wikipedia [oh, foul twister of web information, you!] that she was the "Goddess of Destruction." Finding that the perfect name for my little terror, it stuck, and she now destroys my bank account! The nerve. But i'm not sure if calling her Ambika would be disrespectful to someone who acctually practices Hinduism. I'd rather like to ask one just for curiosities sake.

Other than afore mentioned names like Adolf [for the purely modern ick still attatched to it] i don't have a problem, although my inherantly Christian beliefs do make me look sideways at people with dolls named things like Satan. I just... believe in not calling attention to ones self with Names. But that's a personal thing, i suppose. Completely to each his own.​

 

Personally, there aren't any names that I would avoid. If I like a name, I would name my doll that... and no disrespect would be meant by it. I think people have the rights to name dolls what they want and do with them what they want, but if they're going to be controversial and name a doll Jesus (then do weird... stuff with it...) they should probably be prepared for the backlash that probably WILL happen on some level.

I don't think it's a big deal to name dolls Jesus or God or anything like that (though a lot of people might), I think the intentions behind the naming is what really matters.

 

Hmmm. As a person actually named after a goddess 8V I don't find that I am sacrilegious. Given, the goddess I was named after is not highly worshiped in my part of the world. My mother meant to bless me by giving me such a name with a good meaning. I don't think that there is any harm done, in such a case. Where the original source of controversy is well respected; I believe that naming a doll the same would not be an issue.

However, there are always those ignorant people who would simply name their doll for the shock value, etc... Obviously are in it simply to get a rise out of folks. The best option would be to not give them the satisfaction of having it.

As for those caught in between, imho, I don't think it's offensive at all if you realize that not all people belong to your religion or share your beliefs. A person should not be so quick to be offended, as a person should be careful not to give it easily. With humility in good check on both sides, I don't think any offense would be taken.

 

As I'm not a religious person (in the senses of deity-based religion) I wouldn't find any name off limits. One of my characters is actually a personification of a very minor Greek goddess. I wouldn't even find it taboo to make an actual Jesus Christ doll. I wouldn't do it, but I wouldn't be against it either. Everyone has right to free expression whether one finds it offensive or not. The key is to not be riled up by someone's expression, even if they are doing it just for shock value. It's their choice and we, as humans, should respect each other's choices. What someone names their doll doesn't effect anyone else directly and as such, we shouldn't allow ourselves to get upset over something so minor, even if they are doing it strictly to be disrespectful. Feel free to voice your opinion about it (in a reasonable manner) but one mustn't allow themselves to be terribly hurt or offended. There are far bigger things in the world to get angry about.