Controversial Locations - Where do YOU draw the line?

as far as cemeteries go... i would be hesitant to take a picture on/around any grave that wasn't one of my own family or something. that's it, other than using the graveyard in the background or something.

definitely agree with this ^

 

i actually think a graveyard photoshoot would be cool, i wouldnt go to any random stone though. I think i would maybe go to my grandma's because she always loved dolls

 

Graveyards freak me out. I don't think any of my dolls would want to be photographed there. But I could see it if a person had a doll that was maybe a vampire or something. Taking photos in a graveyard would make sense for the character, you know?

 

I think that graveyards are pretty creepy personally... but I do have a doll I think would photograph well in one... >.< but as far as the issue stands... I really don't think that pictures in a graveyard should be much of an issue at all, but interacting with a grave that is not in your family is in bad taste, if only because you are messing with something that doesn't belong to you without first getting permission. I wouldn't really want someone walking up to my stuff and touching it or posing with it for pictures without asking... so I imagine that the owners of said graves, even without the sentimental value, wouldn't be so thrilled. Do unto others... you know?

And... as for the "dollie porn." I really don't see the problem... maybe it is because there is only so far it could go lol. I mean... with kids around, probably no... but some other public places, meh.

 

I have a couple of pictures of one of my dolls by a grave, specifically one of the graves at King's Landing, which is a historical site for tourists. My doll happened to be dressed in a black dress that day (total coincidence), and even had a rosary... So when I passed by the graves, it seemed appropriate. *shrugs* I did ask the caretakers first if it was okay, and they had no problem with it. And anyways, I never posted them online.

I think that location wise, there's nothing that's really inapropriate so long as the picture itself isn't disrespectfull. As others have mentioned, a picture of a doll sitting by a grave looking mournfull is completely different than a doll making rude gestures to the gravestone or posing sexily or something.

 

This thread is so long, I wish I could read all of it but I haven't yet... I have been thinking about this lately.

I live near a lot of historic graveyards. I absolutely love old graveyards, I always have. I enjoy going to them, taking pictures of them, seeing pictures or them ect. and I'm about as far from goth as anyone can get! I think they're beautiful, calming places where you can reflect on life. Do people really think that just taking pictures of graves is disrespectful? Because that's the feeling I got from some of the posts I read. I always figured that graves were there so you could remember the people buried there and in my mind there is no better way to keep something forever than to photograph it. I personally thing grave rubbing is MUCH worse, that actually destroys stones.

Ok there's that but this is about dolls sorry Yeah, this is where I get conflicted. I do feel kind of iffy about doll shoots in graveyards. But honestly, I don't think there is too much of a problem as if it's a very old stone and you're very respectful and careful. Chances are their family isn't around any more caring for the grave, it's sad but true. I should think most people would be careful, after all they don't want to hurt the doll either...

As for where I would draw the line... I don't know maybe a place with dirty things...

 

Does it? It's a very common practice in genealogy circles. It just involves laying a thin sheet of paper on the headstone and making a rubbing with charcoal. Seems that set would be pretty opposed to practices that make finding one's ancestors even harder.

I can't think of any place that I think should be an absolute. We all have different values, and it's not up to me to tell someone else that they're in the wrong. I guess that if someone wanted to pose her doll on my sleeping head and take photos we'd probably have to have words...

 

I think it depends on a lot of factors really. For the most part, if it were me I'd prefer to stay on my own family's grave sites if I decided to do a photoshoot. However, as an art history nerd, I can see the visual appeal in a lot of the sculptural graves and I think that if the photographer takes a picture out of respect and reverence for the grave, then I really don't have a problem with it.

Also, yes there could be problems of getting caught depending on the type of persons both doing the catching and taking the picture. Personally if i found someone taking a picture of my family's grave I don't think i'd be that upset. Especially if they found them to be pretty, intriguing, artistic, etc. I think to some extent it could be considered flattery, but once again, it depends on the people involved.

 

I don't know if anyone else from my area has posted (I haven't made it all the way through the thread yet!), but I have a very mixed opinion on this topic.

As far as some cemeteries go...well, I live very near New Orleans. If anyone has been there, they would know that the graves are actually mausoleums that are built above ground. They look like cities, which is why they are called The Cities of the Dead. Some of them are as old as New Orleans itself. (Living below sea level does that.) Many of these are gorgeous and unusual, and I've taken pictures of them because they were just amazing to look at. That kind of thing, if done in a respectful and tasteful manner, wouldn't be off limits for a photoshoot with your doll.

Smaller, more personal cemeteries (ie the one my grandmother is buried in in a small town) would make me less inclined to do so. Maybe if I was taking pictures of my doll near her grave, that's one thing. But I don't think I could bring myself to go traipsing around other people's graves and taking pictures near or on them. Not at all. Hell, I don't even really like walking too close to other people's graves, much less use them as props for a photoshoot, especially for the whole "OMG GOTH DOLL IS GOTH AND DEMONY AND ALL THAT JAZZ" idea. :/ I think I would actually have to say something to someone about that.

This is a tricky subject, but a very interseting one to bring up.

 

Well truthly, I dont see anything wrong with posing and taking pictures of your dolls in a graveyard. But that doesn't mean just because the person in the grave is dead they have no feelings, I never said that and I don't think most people do. I think that a spirit would like to be remembered and thats kinda one way to preserve the memory of the person who has passed on. If they have a problem with it, well...... they are dead so you couldnt just ask them. But I do see what your saying, respect the dead. But I dont see anything really wrong with it and if the spirit in the grave doesnt want you to take pictures of its grave then I'm sure it'll try to give you a sign of some sort to stay away.

 

At one of the graveyards I go to there are signs asking people not to do it so I'm guessing it does. Probably only on very old and popular stones but still...

 

I personally have no attachement to graveyards. I mourn and greive quite personally and don't see the point in visiting a monument.

BUT.

That's just my feelings. A lot of people see things very differently and I can understand why the idea might be hurtful- your husband, wife, sister, brother has just passed away and there's some stranger is using their gravesite as a prop for a doll... Yes, I can see where that would hurt. And in some religious beliefs it'd even be considered sacralidge

I used to do part of my still life drawing in graveyeads- my whole class would go down, but we were given a rule by the Uni. Old graves only. 100 years and back, not only were they beautiful, they had very very little chance of having some freshly mourning relative coming along and getting quite upset by us drawing.

So all I can say is- YOU may think it's okay, YOU may not get offended if someone did it to you or your mother, grandfather's, husband's grave, but other people will. Be respectful of that.


On the note of contravertial places, i refuse to take photos in a church. I'm completely agnostic, so I really have no attachement to churches, but, like graveyards, I know other people do. To some people, they're intensely important. I'd never trivialize that importance by doing something as bogoise as taking photos.

 

My thoughts exactly. I try to respect peoples' beliefs with the hope that they will also respect my lack thereof.

 

Totally agree on the "nothing recent" statement! I mean its very easy to check a date and realize "Oh snap that was last week. Moving on." And if you just went and looked and walked away. Well you could just be looking for someone with only a vague idea of where their grave is. It's not gonna offend someone and if it does... Well personally I think that would attest more to their problems then you doing anything wrong.

As for churches. I really try to understand this but. I guess with all the TV shows, movies and what not that film in them they just don't mean anything to me anymore. Granted, set or actual church you're still taking the space, the idea and ect and kinda... Making it worth a lot less to me.
Oddly enough if I go into a Temple I don't feel nearly the same. I mean, sure it's another place thats kinda had TV and movies brush it off and use it as a set but churches seem so much more popular that the worth as a set seems to be growing while the worth as a place of worship shrinks.
Granted these are my personal thoughts but it's why I don't see pictures in churches as bad.

That and my sisters in laws. Blabing on your cellphone mid church when you claim that is where you worship and blah blah blah? Yeah that shat on it big time for me as well.

People ruin everything.

 

I love photography of old tombstones and such, but I don't think that I personally would ever take my dolls into that situation.

Another one that comes to mind would be a hospital. Can't really see why anyone would want to, but that's another situation I would not take my dolls into for photos, and not just because hospitals freak me out.

There was a really gorgeous set of photographs that I saw on DA yesterday, where someone had found a dead otter on the side of the road and posed her doll with it. When I first realized what it was, (my first thought being , wow how'd they get an otter to lie still for a photoshoot!?) I was a little grossed out, but then I actually looked at the photos and the story behind them, and ended up thinking they were a pretty beautiful statement on the loss of the wildlife. Still, I can imagine some people would be pretty icked by it.

 

I draw the line with anywhere I can get in trouble for photographing in.
Therefor, Malls not OK. Public Cemetery A-Ok.

I don't feel that it's disrespectful. The person is long dead, and getting some extra use out of their tombstones (which aren't cheap) isn't a bad thing. As long as you don't leave garbage lying around or disturb anything during your shoot, I don't see how it hurts anyone, be they living, or otherwise.

 

Rubbings can be damaging to old stones that are too fragile or damaged to withstand the surface pressure; stones can also be damaged by overly enthusiastic amateur cleaning attempts using harsh tools or cleansers. The Association for Gravestone Studies' FAQ page goes into more detail on the issues, explaining why some cemeteries ban the practice and giving some basic dos and don'ts for responsible rubbings.

Gravestone photography is also very popular among the genealogical set: while it also sparks ethical debates about privacy, copyright, etc. (as noted in further material on the AGS page), it at least has the advantage of being a hands-off, non-damaging way of recording the inscriptions.

 

I've taken photography at old cemeteries and some newer ones. The ones I've photographed have been from the missions in California. The last people to be buried there were over 100 years ago (after California became a part of the US the missions fell into disrepair and many of them had to be rebuilt after earthquakes). It's not so much about what's written on the tombstone, but the aging of the stone and such. I will even go ghost hunting in old cemeteries, especially missions because of their tragic histories and sometimes mass graves (I have an orb pic from Mission San Jose... which has a mass grave from a small pox epidemic killing off the indigenous people in the area). But basically my ghost hunts are my asking permission of the spirits to show themselves. At Mission San Juan Bautista there are lonely crosses. You don't know who's there, just that an old cross is losing to the elements. Something beautiful and sad about that.

As for dolls... If I really wanted it, I would recreate a fake place for them to be in.

 

I try to respect others beliefs but I just never thought of a cemetery as being a problem. Maybe because when I was a kid I visited a cemetery on a tour out West, or because in college the popular place for outdoor picnics was the local cemetery. I do know that I don't understand "visiting the gravesite of a relative". I would hate to think they were still around waiting on my visit, and if I want to remember them I would prefer to do it thinking of things they had done in life, not after their death. But then my parents were cremated and I plan on the same thing so maybe that indicates a different way of thinking.

 

I think as long as you use a little common sense and be respectful, any place is fine for a photo shoot. As other people have said, photography is art. If you're worried about offending someone then, in the graveyard for example, either use a grave of someone you know (and believe wouldn't mind) or find out who looks after the grave you're interested in and ask permission. Same for other "controversial" locations. Also be aware of where you are posting your images. Some groups are gonna be all for it, some will be open minded, and some will not. So it's just a matter of being aware and responsible.