Controversial Locations - Where do YOU draw the line?

I love that this was brought up. I think photographs can be taken in a respectful manner in a graveyard but I think we see alot of people who aren't being respectful about it. I find the BJD community seems to be alot more respectful in their antics in public locations vs the EGL community I was big in for a long time. I think unless you're invading private property etc, and you're being respectful and behaving appropriately for the location you are in just about anyway is okay for photographs.
PS I apologize my vocabulary is terrible and I kept saying respectful over and over. :X

 

Speaking as someone who is both an (amature) artist and a (likewise) philosopher, I think that including graveyards, houses of worship, memorial monuments and other such locations worthy of reverence in one's photography of dolls or people can be extremely reverent, provided one appreciates the reason for the art. Aesthetics are, ultimately, meant to stir our senses and inspire a certain response. I see no reason why a beloved object is inherently irreverent and harmful to such an atmosphere. If you feel that it is, then, you're right, because it offends and distracts you. But, we all have different responses to such places.

Now, having your doll scale a tombstone like Mt. Everest or "striking a match" on it to "smoke up"? A little iffy. But, displaying a doll on a memorial bench or lighting a candle at a grave, imho, is a symbolic regard for the memories there.

*/twocents*

 

Interesting topic, I think as long as your not damaging anything then its basically okay. I'm very interested in family history and in the holidays spend alot of time in graveyards with my parents, brother and uncle. As well as photographing our own family's graves, if something catches our eye, thats photograhed too. There are countless amounts of photos in my computer of 'artistic grave scenes'. Surely its not so different if you have a doll in the photo, much worse things can go in in graveyards than photography of dolls.

 

It's hard to say how appropriate/inappropriate something like that is. I suppose, ultimately, the only one should matter to is the photographer. :'c If you (as the photographer) don't feel it's an inappropriate place to take a photo, why would it matter?
I personally agree with an earlier comment- a grave is an art in itself. Unless you take serious stock in what a grave stands for, it will continue to be simply a prop on the horizon. If you, as the photographer, feel you can give it your own meaning by taking pictures on it it's definitely better than pissing on it.

 

I wouldn't take pictures of my dolls in graveyards. For me, it would be very disrespectful, because a graveyard is a very special place to many people. If I went there to visit any of my grandparents graves, I wouldn't be happy to see someone using the place simply for scenery for pictures, and even less so if they used it for a modelling shot, be it with humans or dolls.
I understand that a graveyard can be beautiful and seem like a great place for photos, there are some really pretty graveyards and there are some very dramatic sculptures in some of them. But you have to consider the people around, even if you don't have any religious beliefs, or any belief that there is something more to graveyards than some buried skelettons and nice art, someone around you might have.

I do feel that it's a different thing to take pictures in a very old graveyard though. If the graves are like, 300 years old or something, it's not the same thing because there wont be people there who know the ones that are buried. But I still wouldn't like it.

 

Im right there with you on the grave yard thing. But then I know of people who've done worse in them with little to no regard for the loved ones of the deceesed. I think another place that shouldn't be violated are hospitals unless of course you and your dolls are visiting a person who is ok with it. But in all honesty you should probably just visit and leave the photo taking and dolls out unless specifically requested. Oh and anywhere confidential. If it says no pictures, then be respectful and don't take them. If it's a holy building while you may not be religious, have resepect for those who are and don't dessecrate their religious buildings or icons. I would like to think it's commons sense and that most people are respectful but sadly that's not the case. I think people need to mind their peas and ques and think "would this upset me if this were my religious space etc."

 

I think both sides have brought up very good points here.

Personally, I'm not very religious, but I'd still get annoyed if people were messing with my gravestone. Even if it was just for artistic purposes.

 

i don't think graveyards are an appropriate place to photograph one's dolls in general, and an unknown person's grave in particular. to me it seems very insensitive and disrespectful. i also think going on other people's private property is a no-no.
there are so many lovely places--parks, lakes and even city streets--noone should believe that a cemetery is a grat place to take pictures of a doll--fantasy story or not.

 

I honestly believe that if one is going to take a picture in a graveyard just possibly take the persons name out of the picture if its seen on the grave. I would be fine with someone taking a picture on my grave or my families but just make sure that the names on the grave are not put online. Yes others may see it in real life publically but I would like for my family to not be placed on line, art or not.

Otherwise I think it would be fine, and artistic to take a picture in a graveyard. I would myself do it but I would respect the names of the people there and take them out of the picture.

 

For me, the more I think about it, you're making art with the head stones and such, and I would be almsot honored if my head stone was part of that art. xD If you were defacing it somehow, and just taking pictures to mock the person or any such thing, sure, I'd be pissed as hell, and sure, it'd be disrespectful, but for the most part, you like the head stone, you like the composition and so on, and it gives the kind of motif you want, go for it, I say~!

Of course, I'd be careful and respectful if I were to take pictures in a cemetery, but it's art, and you can only make the cemetery look better...

And as for places where I draw the line for photos.. Probably a place with a LOT of people and where the pictures could be distracting and so on.

 

I actually like the graveyard photos I've seen and until this topic I never thought of it as disrespectful. I'd like to take some with my dolls sometime, I just hope there won't be any people around!

 

Plus how must it make the family feel! I agree with you, cool locations are well and good be we should all have respect for somethings.

 

As long as the process is respectful, I see no place as off limits. Now, being respectful includes having the permission or well wishes of those most closely concerned: Ie, If it's a church, ask the priest what he thinks. If it's a hospital room, ask the occupant. On the grave of someone you know, ask the family's permission. If it's someone you don't, Simply tread lightly and film carefully. Treat any locale as someplace that is special to you. Also be aware that when people say 'no', it means you're not going to do it. Not just waiting until they're not looking.

Specifically on the grave Idea, it seems very common for people to assume that the family will be offended. Remember that the opposite is just as possible.
for instance, my mother often tours cemetaries in Louisiana. Not the famous ones, but private ones, or sometimes forgotten ones, and she photographs them. Sometimes, if the picture comes out well, she'll post it on her flikr for awhile.
Recently, She recieved a comment on one of her pictures from a cemetary we were fairly sure was completely abandoned. It roughly equated to:
"That's my grandmother's Grave! I don't live in the state anymore, so I don't get to visit her. I'm so glad to see that there are still people who do!"

So my advice overall would be: be VERY careful around newer graves, the families are more likely to be offended. But don't let that scare you away from a shoot altogether. Especially with the much older graves, Your photos may be the only memorial these beloved people continue to get. And this makes it all the more important to always be respectful in your shoots.

 

In all honesty I think if you're going to take photos in contriversal places either get permission or in the case of a grave yard, make it someone you know. I say that because I know there are cultures that don't find it disresepectful to have a picknic in the grave yard. They'll do it for a loved one's anniversary or some special family event. There's nothing wrong with it as long as they're doing that with their family member. I know though that if I came to the cemetary and and found people having a picknic, doll photo session, other photo session on my loved one I would be very upset. I know the cost that I put into upkeep for (in this case my father)a headstone and having people trample all over it or do whatever to it adds to that cost. I'm sure that people who take photos at the cemetary don't really think about that. Most cemetaries don't have a person take care of individual graves it's too expensive and is left to families to maintain. being all over a grave can just add to its deteriation and really should be done with permission.

 

My family has a tradition of having picnics in graveyards. We've done this since I was very small, and my parents gave me this reason for their habit of photographing beautiful or distinctive graves:

People pay a lot of money for these monuments, since it is how the world will remember them once all who knew them are gone. After a while, most people stop visiting them, which is sad because some people still linger near their bodies, confused. We go to appreciate the art and to leave flowers and have fun, because it really is a dreary place most of the time and everybody involved would benefit from a lightening of mood.

I see no problem with gallabanding about a cemetery, and I hope there are people like my parents and I who visit when I myself am buried.

 

I don't really see what the problem with using a graveyard is. As long as you don't get the writting from the tombstones, then i don't have a problem.. If you are still nervous about it, then use a family member's grave. You are doing it for art.

 

This is an odd subject but as someone from the UK, a tiny and over populated island, you would be hard pressed not to walk over someone's resting place every few days, wether it looks like a cemetery or a field. Why would anyone want to take photos in a regimented municipal graveyard where people are still being laid to rest. Of course the families of the recently deceased would quite rightly be offended by someone with a camera and a doll larking around on a tiny plot of land that they have dedicated to the memory of a recently lost family member.

There are older and now full (if you'll pardon the term) graveyards everywhere, so much more beautiful and evocative. These places have become almost public parks and some are even heritage sites. These often overgrown places are so much more appealing as back drops for photography and even eating your lunch, too many are being torn down for "redevelopment" and this will happen more and more. I don't think you are disrespecting those long departed unknown souls by taking photographs of dolls among their tombs, you are in some ways, helping to keep their memory alive... and the bull-dozers at bay, hopefully

 

To be honest, I myself definitely wouldn't do it.... I don't know, it just seems strange to use a place where people are mourning and having special moments as a spot for photoshoots... it just doesn't seem right. But, it's not like I'm going to go up to someone and scold them if I see them doing it. XD

 

I think that as long as you leave it as you found it, there's no real problem. Call me callous, but I think graveyards can have a really great aesthetic for photo shoots so I can't blame anyone for wanting to take advantage of that.

It probably wouldn't be a good idea to take photos on a very new grave, or one that is obviously being regularly tended to (i.e.: fresh flowers left there or something) on the off chance that the relatives happen to spot you there and get upset, but there are plenty of very old graves that could make a really nice backdrop.

 

Middle brain thinking again, MY grave, Disrespect? Pretty sure when u die u dont care if a dolly is havin her photo taken on a bit of stone amongst other bits of stone! The world belongs to all of us, to photograph or map or enjoy in any way we see fit! Just pick up your litter when you leave!!!