Controversial Locations - Where do YOU draw the line?

I've done several photoshoots in a cemetery near my house. I choose not to show the names on the headstones if they can be seen in the shots; I don't usually put the dolls with a headstone, just the low stone walls that border the graves. I use it primarily because it is a wild place with no people around a lot of old, broken stone. It's an old Masonic cemetery that is pretty much abandoned, and most of the headstones date around 1900. Weeds run wild, headstones are knocked down, ovegrown with brush, and weather-worn so badly that some are un-readable. I always thought it was a little sad, and had a very empty feeling. When I bring my dolls there, I often walk around the plots (it's very small) and read the names, wondering who they were and what their lives were like. I know it might sound weird, but I quitely ask permission of the resident spirits. I'm often answered by black butterfies (mourning cloaks mostely), or the little hawks who drop feathers between the graves. I've grown to have an affection for this old graveyard that no one remembers, and I feel that being there photographing my dolls brings at least some acknowledgement to the place. I have a great respect for the place, and I think it needs a little love.

I guess it's the attitude you have when you're photographing a place. Everywhere is sacred.

 

I don't think anywhere is off limits. Well, anywhere that's legal. Graveyards are public property and as long as you aren't destroying anything... What's wrong? It's just earth. D:

 

I understand your feelings about graveyards. At the same time, my first photoshoot, I plan to take my Cecilia to a local 17-18th century graveyard.

I understand the disrespect thing, but at the same time...it doesn't effect me. I DON'T plan to shoot the name of the headstone or anything, just the beauty of the masonry. It's an architectural thing for me.

I do at the same time find it disrespectful, I wouldn't want someone tromping over my father's grave for a photo, but people do gravestone rubbings and that is widely accepted. Literally copying the text from the headstone to display it god knows where. Why is that accepted and yet, general photos found controversial?

I don't know. I hate double-standards, and though I find both to be full of disrespect, I plan to be a hypocrite and do it myself. :X Kinda sucks. But graveyards are beautiful things.

 

I really only think graveyard shots should be taken in a respectful manner, as long as the grave belongs to someone you knew or were close to. It could be a very meaningful experience. For instance, if I took one of my dolls while visiting my best friend's mother's grave and took some very beautiful and serene pictures I think it would be alright. (My BFF likes my dolls and her mother was like my own)

I think an inappropriate place to take doll pictures would be at any type of formal event, whether it be a funeral/burial, religious gathering, or anything ceremonial.

 

I've been to historic cemeteries such as Highgate and they have guided tours all through it with people taking photos. I can't see that people with dolls would be anything more disrespectful than tourists trampling all about posing for photos.

And I've stepped over and on graves before. It was nothing disrespectful--there are cemeteries where you can't make a move without trodding on graves. I felt bad, but I had a right get get to see where my grandparents were buried, after all! And when I've attended burials, I've stood on graves because it just happens when you're grouped around a gravesite.

I think if people behave reasonably--if they are aware of their surroundings and respectful of others around them, things should be fine. It would be best not to prominently feature recent headstones with identifiable names. A photo couldn't really HURT anything, but it's best to try and be as sensitive as possible--because people all have their own ideas of how things should be done. Personally, I've never done a doll shoot at a cemetery, but I have taken photos... but I totally prefer monuments that are over 100 years old. The recent ones don't interest me at all. So people fearing for the graves of their loved ones shouldn't need to worry, unless they are also touchy about ancestors who have passed centuries ago, anyway! In that case, I'd hope people would learn to deal, since there are tons of tours that go through old cemeteries (and I've been on quite a few) and that means photos and people tromping around... and perhaps the odd other object--such as dolls.

Churches, too, get the same treatment. I've toured through tons of 'em! Cathedrals. Even Mosques (which have quite a few restrictions). If I'm touring through taking photos as a tourist in a big group, I don't see how having a doll would be any more disrespectful or disruptive...

Of course, if areas are closed to the public, then that's that. But if places let the public in... and they don't kick you out if you have a doll, then it should be OK, I'd think.

 

Well, as long as you don't stomp all over the graves, it should be okay. I'd love it if someone would take pictures of their doll on my grave!

 

Okay, beat me over the head because i'm new here, but uhhhhh, after 30 pages I see that quite a few people take their dolls to cemeteries, and i'm just sort of wondering....what is the big attraction with graveyards?

 

@ deco_droid:

Some people really love graveyards, be it for the trees and plant life, flowers, architecture/statues, or just the graves. They can be really beautiful places, so why not take your doll there? Idk.

 

I think graveyards are beautiful in there own way. I have done photo-shoots at graveyards, there is one across the street from my house, and the photos are gorgeous. I think if the photos are done respectfully (no names showing, rude photos, etc.) then no harm done. Movies and such have graveyards in them all the time......like I said as long as it is respectful.

 

I didn't think I had a graveyard problem until I actually went to one for ghost-hunting in the middle of the night. I couldn't even drive my car up within ten feet of the entrance stone (it was a pretty old - earliest burial 1892 - graveyard, and didn't even have a proper entrance, just a winding, tree-covered path that scared the bejeezus out of me). Sure, the path there was scary and everything, and I was going there to BE scared, but once I actually got there, I just couldn't stand it. It felt so wrong. (And to make matters worse, I backed out of there so fast I ended up in a gully, and my friends were screaming bloody murder because they thought I ran over a grave.)

I went back a few days later when visiting with my dad, and we walked around and looked at the graves (which are really mini-tombs, since in Florida a 6-feet-deep grave would plunk you down in seawater). It was a really sad place, especially with the hanging tree (yes, this is Florida, it was once that kind of hanging tree, sadly). I did a little more research on that particular graveyard, and discovered it was a black graveyard, and hangings had been done there. To add, my coworker's mother, who I later found had been my brother's 4th grade teacher, small world, was buried there.

So yeah. After that experience, I've decided that ghost-hunting in a graveyard is iffy, but taking pictures of dolls on a stranger's grave is more than just a little iffy. I'm all for awesome locales, but graveyards are something I wouldn't mess with, out of respect for the dead and living left behind. If family showed up and found me taking pictures of a doll on their grandmother's grave, I would be completely and utterly ashamed of myself.

Personally, for me, if the death was still fresh in my mind, I'd be horribly offended. If it had been a long time and the people were apologetic and nice about it, I might even start up a conversation with them while I'm there. It's not worth taking a chance on which reaction you might get, though, in my opinion.

For the record, I'm Catholic and I believe in supernatural phenomena, as long as every single scientific explanation has been explored and proven not responsible for said phenomena. Doesn't happen often, obviously, but I believe it.

 

Personally, I don't see what is the big problem with graves, but its has to be done respectfully [like, no names, no distasteful photographs]. So long as you respect the dead [which taking photos or the lack of photos does not have anything to do with], I should think its alright.

 

This is interesting. My cousin grew up next to a very large labyrinthian graveyard and we played in it often. If we saw people coming our way we moved to a deserted area and continued on. When I say play I don't mean screaming or throwing a baseball, we knew better than that. Mostly we told exploration stories and prowled around scaring each other. Because of this I never thought of Graveyards as a controversial location. I don't think I would have thought twice about someone photographing dolls on a grave even if it was my family Weird I guess.

I can understand and respect (after reading these posts) why people would be upset about it. However I would not be offended if I saw a doll posed by a grave in a photo story unless the photos were just super disrespectful to the dead person's plot.

 

I am more afraid of cemeterys then anything else. If I did take pictures of my doll in a cemetery I would do so around either really old graves or artistic graves or the graves of my family members. I'm not disrespecting them. They are gone and now they art thats how I see it. Maybe I'm wrong but I won't really know for a while.

 

As a photographer I have taken photos in many places, but I have always been careful not to offend people. I have taken chances when photographing nude people outdoors, but always keep a blanket close, gone to places where there is minimal chances of meeting people, or photographed at night using flash. Artistic people think differently than normal people I think... but at the same time, I would be greatly offended if I found a photo with my fathers grave in it... I took some photos at a graveyard once, but it was incredibly old, none of the names in the stones were visible and it was overgrown in weeds so it was apparent that no one goes there any more. I believe one can take photos at graveyards, and if I want to take a photo with my own fathers grave as the backdrop it's really up to me. But to many people graveyards are sacred, and even though I don't share that belief I respect that others feel that way. As long as no names are shown in the photo and that no specific gravestone is in focus, it's O.K. by me.

 

Whole feature films are shot in veterans' cemeteries and famous churches. as long as you leave the place the way you found it and not use the image in to defame them, i don't see a problem. and yep, the no-name showing thing is I guess the fine line that someone could cross...

 

When I was doing cosplay modeling we went to several locations for photoshoots that could be considered controversial. Cemeteries, condemned buildings, military bases--you name it. The trick is to ask permission first. All public (and private for that matter) have some kind of groundskeeper. As them if it's okay to take photos there. Sometimes they will shadow you to make sure you don't "cross the line." That way you can use people whose profession it is to maintain the integrity of the location to be a legal and moral compass for your project. Oftentimes their only concern is repeating names, photographing security systems, bringing weapons (we always had lots of weapons in our shoots) and last but not least, how much money you make off of it.

In the Bay Area especially, a lot of these gorgeous landmark locations are often used by the film industry as well so I think people are just used to it. In other locations you never know--but it's always safe to just ask.

 

Photographers of humans models also sometimes take photos of their models at cemeteries. So why shouldn't BJD owners?
But yeah, you have to know when going to far is going too far. Moving plants around and such would be a big no-no, but I guess any sensible person would know that.

And yes, maybe I wouldn't be too glad to see someone taking photos over one of my relatives gravestones either. Without asking first, that is.

 

I agree the whole graveyard issue has been done to death (pardon the pun), I've already said my bit on that subject, but Hominivorax makes a good point about the scenes of tragedies or murders. I used to live in Willesden Green in London on the street where a "famous" serial killer murdered and disposed of his victim's bodies. I didn't know anything about the case, despite this madman having only been caught a few years before I moved there. I had lived there maybe 6 weeks and became very puzzled by the constant "tourists" and people taking photographs of a house further down the street, and asked a neighbour.

I cannot understand some people's ghoulish curiosity and almost relish for crime scenes and would definitely think it was more than disrespectful to take a picture of your doll at such a scene when living relatives of the victims are still likely to be hurt by your thoughtless actions. That would be more obscene than disrespectful to my mind.

 

I know I'm a little late to the party, but since I feel I have a unique perspective on the sort of site in question, I'm jumping in. *splash*

In my family, it has been a long-standing tradition that people are still part of the family even after they've "passed". I remember growing up going to the cemetery on Easter Sunday, putting flowers on my grandparents' graves, and then sitting on the benches with my family and having a picnic. Seriously. We'd visit the cemetery other times, too--Mother's Day, Father's Day, and my grandparents' birthdays. We wouldn't always stay for lunch, but we would definitely bring flowers and pray at the graveside. I was always taught graveyard etiquette--don't walk across or step over the graves, don't run in the cemetery, don't sit on the headstones, don't shout or make a lot of noise...etc.

I've had photoshoots at cemeteries, though not with Chae-ri--there are a lot of lovely cemeteries here in Mobile, and Magnolia Cemetery in particular could rival the Old St. Louis boneyard in NOLA for sheer beauty--but if and when I do, I would follow the same rules as I did myself when I was growing up. I wouldn't sit her on a headstone or a grave, though she might sit at the feet of a freestanding angel, for example. I might shoot her putting flowers on my grandmother's grave, too. That kind of thing.

 

I've just read the whole thread at once, so I may be lumping a few comments together, but I think back on page 11 there was a good point about respecting the living-in-mourning as well. With older 80+ year old graves there's probably no worry beyond the basic no-defacing and your own personal belief system, but with anything newer there's always a chance that the buried's child/partner/parent might still be coming by to pay their respects - and that's where it gets tricky.

I think cemetaries can be beautiful, beautiful places, but I'm always wary of getting too close to the memorials that look like they're still tended to just because I wouldn't want to hurt someone who's there to visit their dead rather than to admire the look/feel of the place.