Do you have a right to feel offended?

Gender issues. Ugh. I try never to get into these because it's a touchy subject (for me since I go through this everyday). But depending on the situation, I might just let it slide. So with that, yes, you have the right to be offended, but you have to remember to just let these kinds of things slide once in a while. After all, these guys aren't living or breathing and what we refer to them as (male, female, he, she, etc.) will not affect them.

Also, people tend to get sex and gender confused. Hopefully you meant gender.

 

I wouldn't count out the possibility that there are people who dress their male dolls in feminine clothing or style their male dolls extremely effeminately who intend to have people question the gender of their dolls so that they can make a big deal about schooling the person who made the comment.

The reason I don't count that out is because I've seen this in action. Not just in the abjd hobby, but in other hobbies as well. Parading something in front of people so they will misidentify the gender and get a subsequent talking to. I guess it's a form of attention-grabbing (to avoid the w-word).

Of course, displaying your doll at all is a form of attention-grabbing whether you intend to school someone or not. And if that displaying prompts someone to say, "Hey, she's pretty!" when your doll is actually a boy, well, that's just how it is. And if your doll is pretty obviously male, then write that person off as being a jerk and move on with your life. And if your doll is pretty effeminate, with long hair and frilly, girlish clothes, then just accept the compliment and move on.

I guess at this point I see taking offense at mistaken gender (of the cross-dressing/androgyny variety, or the infant variety) as making a mountain out of a molehill.

 

Here's something interesting to throw into the mix... In French Polynesia familes who had only sons by tradition raise their youngest son as a "girl" Meaning they are raised to be effeminate, dress and behave like a woman - traditionaly called a ReiRei... In my personal experience with this culture I've seen many an Australian male totaly blustered for chatting up an extremely attractive woman only to discover its a man. They are not trans-gender as they are still completely male with the exception of their clothing and mannerisms. Given the amount of time I have spent in FP, I know never to assume that if they have great legs a very pretty face and wearing a dress that the person I am talking to is a woman because chances are I am wrong - lol

In relation to dolls and the OP I'm out of fingers and numbers to count how many times I've heard "what!!??? Thats a boy!?!?!" Initially I was offended but eventually got used to it.... Anyone has the right to react how they chose and no-one can dictate their personal reaction. Its truly each to their own and I for one am immune to gender confusion umong my dolls however I wouldnt think less of someone who is upset

 

...this is one of the most intelligent and eloquent repsonses to this thread and I could not agree more. This has summed it up perfectly... Well done!

-LW

 

It's just like with a baby :3 A baby can wear pink clothes, but still be a boy. Why? Because the mother likes the pink, and the baby doesn't have an opinion in it, because a baby doesn't care about clothes. Why is a dress only for girls? It's like pink is a girl color. And lots of boys wears pink.
I think they have the right to feel offended, if people keep calling their dolls for girls, if they already told them that they are boy.
I dislike people who thinks dresses are only for girls D< I hate dresses! Then, are pants only for boys? Noo, 'cause we wear them too. So they should be allowed to wear dresses too, if they want to. xD

 

I agree with your sister. I don't think anyone is generally in the mindset that they should consider a doll is a boy when that doll is wearing a dress. If you tell someone that you did that on purpose and that the doll is a boy, and then they proceed to tease and/or continually call that doll a girl to be malicious, then yes, you can be offended.

But what's important is to look at the other person's intentions. If they aren't trying to be offensive, why be offended?

 

If you dress a baby in pink people are going to assume the baby is a girl, which is the whole point. It doesn't matter if the mother likes the colour pink, if she is touchy about people mistaking her son for a girl, she shouldn't dress him in pink because it isn't the bystander's fault for assuming a baby wearing pink is a girl. If she isn't touchy about the subject, happy to politely correct people and let them know that the 'she' is actually a 'he', that's fine...but I don't think that you should get your knickers in a twist over a situation you created.

In the western world we know that in traditional baby colour-schemes blue is for boys and pink is for girls, it doesn't matter that in the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries this was reversed, at this current time, those colour schemes are pretty standard. It's your call to dress your child in whatever you like (be prepared for them to be annoyed with you when they're teens though ), but you can't yell at people for assuming your baby is the 'wrong' sex when you've dressed them in the traditionally accepted colour for that sex. Same goes for dollies.

If you want to break the mould and change the colours and styles, then go ahead, but don't assume everyone knows that you're trying to break gender barriers and especially don't get upset and angry with someone who is only making a logical assumption based on the existing culture! No one wins friends by getting mad at people!

 

I totally agree. It's one thing to take offense when your boy is wearing jeans and a t-shirt and someone calls "her" cute. But if you dress him up like a girl in dresses with beautiful pink blushy faceups and long flowing hair, it's completely natural to assume it's a female. Most non-hobby people assume all dolls are girls anyway, regardless of what their wearing so it's even MORE likely to be called a girl when in a dress.

 

Simple response... pull down the pants/flip up the skirts.
Don't get mad, just shock them straight...

I've done this a number of times, as my U, despite only every wearing pants and tight shirts, frequently gets mistaken for a girl. The first time it happened was with one of the girls I used to babysit... after I explained that he (Niko) was a boy, she flipped him over and pulled down his pants to check for herself...

People also used to think I was a boy until I was 7 or 8, simply because my hair was cut in a short bowl-cut and I didn't really like to wear dresses or skirts... Like me, a lot of BJDs have very androgynous features (esp. the boys) so it's easy to mistake them for something they're not.

If you're going to dress your boy like a girl, then you have to expect that people will mistake them for one... hopefully when they see the lack of boobs/tiny peen, they'll figure it out, but if not, just brush it off... imho, it's kinda silly to get worked up over something relatively small. (Also, some people might be like my aunt and refer to everything that's not human as one gender... she owns two female dogs and still calls them boys or him/he all the time...)

*Disclaimer: These are my opinions and mine alone... I am aware people will not/do not agree with me, but I am making no attack on you. Just simply stating what I think*

 

I don't think its a big deal when people confuse boy bjd as girls. The minifee Shiwoo looks pretty effeminate! But guess what? Haven't you noticed that as well w/ Eastern Asian guys? Gackt, Miyavi, older visual kei, Mana? We are just used to seeing this, so we can tell the difference. With people unfamiliar w/ this, they're wierded out, or shocked. Thats natural. But if you throw a hissy fit and you dress your boy bjd as a girl, uh, why are you so shocked the person thought he is a she??

 

i totally agree, if you dont want your male to look girly then dont make him look girly...
simple.

 

I feel like i commented on something similar to this somewhere, but i might have been talking with someone. XD;

I feel like if a boy doll is in a dress, or even wearin gsomething frilly/girly, yes, its asking for gender confusion. After all, said doll is crossing societial gender lines on purpose, and if the kid is just wearing a girly./frilly top of some sort, or wearing full blown lolita or anything in between, most people will see it and think "Girl". If you're offended by this, then why do it? I know it may be a cultural thing, but as far as i can tell, (if we're not talking kimono or other traditional asian style garb) if someone is in a dress or wearing girly clothes, generally they want to look like a girl...and i'd imagine it'd be a compliment to be called such.


now, if a boy is wearing a shirt that shows his chest (or no shirt at all) and there are no skirts or frills involved and STILL gets called a girl, then kay, be a bit offended if you want, but dont jump on the person. Throw in a nice set of sculpted abs, and you can really confuse people with a pretty face. XD;


on the flip side, since dolls of all sorts are normally/tradtiionally girls and dressed in girly things--even here on doa, most girls are in skirts/dresses/shirts that clearly show off their chests/other girly things-- a girl can easily be mistaken for a boy as well. Especially here, with the onslaught of girly boys, a girl mold on a very girl body wearing jeans and a baggy shirt can easily be called a boy.
...which has actually happened to one of my girls IRL by a non-doll person. that was just weird XD; Someone i know is familiar with my 'odd dolls', and i brought in one of my girls, who she thought was a boy due to her jeans/baggy shirt/short hair. i was confounded, but very amused ^^


tl;dr: Dolls are traditionally female. Skirts/dresses/frills are traditionally female things. If you combine a doll of any gender, plus any combonation of girly things, people will assume its a girl due to past experiences and social norms. Just face it, its hard to have a boy with a pretty face, nice hair, and girly clothes that DOESNT look like a girl to most people.

unless youre trying to pass off a unidoll Ark as a girly boy in a dress. I think that might be scary. ^^;

 

These dolls are quite adrogynous and as an owner, putting them in skirts is like asking for it. Now if you had a really masculine doll and they said it was girly then yes, you can be offended.
but even if you did have a standard "boy sculpt" its to be expected if they are mistaken for girls or described as girly because Thats how they look.

 

I kind of agree with your sister...making the mistake at first is inevitable, because some dolls are just so "girly" that there's nothing to point out whether they actually are a boy or not. If you tell someone your doll is a boy, and they refuse to believe that, well, that's another story. But otherwise, there's no way for them to know. Altough, they must be some pretty flat chested girls :/
I get very amused when people mistake my girl doll for a boy! Her bust is 26cm around, it really isn't that easy to miss.

 

At this point, I find myself mostly amused by the confusion. I have two very girly-looking boy dolls, and one not-so-girly. I pretty much expected it with the first two (and so far no one has guessed them correctly) but I just got home from the dentist where they've seen the first two already and this was Kiyam's (DZ Chen on DG body) first trip. And sure enough, he got the feminine pronoun. He's currently wearing tight leather pants, boots, and a very see-through black mesh shirt. The only thing 'girly' about him, to me anyway, is his hair which is bright blue and about shoulderblade length.

I didn't bother to correct them, since I made a private bet to myself that it would happen just that way, so I'm just sort of amused, if a little bewildered.

 

I once had a few ladies complimenting me on my pretty girl. I was carrying Derrick who was wearing a very short wig, jeans and a black shirt without sleeves. I admit that he's a girl head on a boy body, but I face-upped him with a boyish look, bruises, cuts and as non-girly as possible.

Ladies: "Oh my, she's such a pretty girl."
Me: "Thank you, he's pretty and he is a boy."
Ladies: "Yes, she's really pretty."

I could have gone all "Are you deaf? Are you blind?!" *pull up shirt* "He does not have breasts." *pull down pants* "Look at his resin penis!", but that would be far beyond the point. Those ladies said he was pretty and they only failed to recognise him as a boy. That still means he's a pretty doll.
I'd be offended if they had called him a girl on purpose to insult me. Still the concept of a boy doll is pretty strange or unlikely for the ley person. Doll = girl. To switch from that idea takes some time. Time a random stranger I meet does not have.
Even my sister's Unidoll Ark has been mistaken for a girl doll, but he has a long wig.

Even my boyfriend has been mistaken for a girl and he's 2,07 m (that's 2,5 times a Soom Mecha Angel. ), has huge hands, wears normal jeans and T-shirts, and does not shave often so he usually has days old stubble or even a beard. But he does have long hair, so he must be a girl.

It's human to make a mistake based on general conceptions. If I had told those ladies that my doll was a boy and I really don't like it if they continued to call my boy a girl and they would still call him a girl, I'd be offended. Not because they called my boy a girl, but because they ignored a request.

I think you have the right to feel insulted if people try to insult you on purpose, but very often people just really think your boy is a girl.

This reminds me of a time when I unpacked two dolls from my suit case and my other sister who's not into BJDs asked if the first doll (a CP El) was a girl and I said it was a boy. Then I unpacked my large bust Unidoll UH-14 (a girl) and she said "Ah, then that's a boy too." The doll was wearing a men's suit, though.
It's not unheard of that people around BJD collectors start to over compensate and call the girl dolls boys too.

 

I think that you as a doll owner do have every right to feel offended if someone mistakenly calls your doll a female when they're male but you certainly don't have a right to be angry because I mean... you are putting them in 'female' clothing. >>; However I think it'd be worse if you had a girl doll... dressed as a girl doll.. that someone assumed was crossdressing. XD; then yeah, you could be offended and kind of angry because that would just be silly.

 

if the doll is intentionally dressed girly, then the owner shouldn't feel offended (just: err... its not a girl... ) but getting all: OMG its a BOY!! c'mon ppl! he has a dick!!
yah, but we cant see it and those dolls (most of them at least) have a feminin face and U make him wear pink stuff and long hair and girly faceup. -__-''
but if the doll isnt meant to look girly and someone comes and say: shes pretty! then i think the owner have the right to be offended a bit. but at the same time, dont take that too srly either. ucan be: D= its a duuuude!! TT_TT but dont get mad
and the same goes for girl dolls called ''boys''...

 

I have a hard time being offended.

My dog Dojo is constantly called "she", "her" all the time at the puppy park because he's "too cute to be a boy." and even when corrected they continue to call him "she". and he has a wee wee hanging there for all to see unlike a boy doll whose wee wee is covered by clothes.

Look, some of these dolls wear more makeup and lace than I do. you can't really be offended when people mistake them for a girl. It's kind of like J-Rock. My aunt Mary thought I was joking around when I said Mana from Malice Mizer was really a man.

I mean, he's pretty, wears more makeup than most women, has prettier hairdues than most women, and wears fancier dresses. As a REAL woman, I'm jealous at how much prettier than me he can look at times. And it's a hard feat to be prettier than me. LOLOL

can you blame someone for being confused? You dress your doll in pretty dresses, long hair, with their long eyelashes and makeup...

how are they suppose to know it's a boy? it's not like they're looking at a boy doll dressed as a boy doll and sarcastically saying "What a pretty girl". They see a doll with a beautiful face, beautiful locks, and a pretty pink dress... and they THINK "what a pretty girl"

when you come across people like that, even if you're a little offended they couldn't tell the makeup wearing, long haired, dressed in a pretty dress doll was a boy... just say "thank you" and go on your way if you don't want to deal with explaining it.

Just be happy they think the doll is pretty. My family think my doll is freaky because he's too realistic looking. lol

I think my mom was even more freaked out when I opened the box and she saw that he had a wee wee. lol. that was a first for her. lol

 

Id have to agree with your sister too, a doll in a dress usually points to a girl. I hate it when people do that too, but somethimes i think its kinda funny. This one time i took my Dollzone Mo-2(default facr-up) out to wall-mart, and the man at the register was all like your doll she is very pretty. I kept using masculine pronouns like oh yes HE is. the man never caught on and continured to say "she is pretty. She looks like pretty German lady." That made me giggle. Oh BTW male dollie owner here ^_^