Dollzone Originality - Discuss it here.

Exactly. Personally, I think the fact that Dollzone blatantly copied other artists before, means they should have been banned from here from the start.

Even if they have legitimate heads now, they should have thought about the consequences BEFORE they ripped people off. The only difference between DZ and Foreverdoll is that DZ used better quality materials.

I think that Dollzone went legit just long enough to gain trust and supporters so that they could pull something big like this and hope to get away with it. It's sad that it looks like they might.

And here I am. I'm 100% certain that I could modify an SD16 body to look almost exactly like the large Dollzone body. There would be a slight difference in my sculpting style, but that's a given.

The height difference would be no problem at all. After all, 90% of the height difference is in the legs. The other 10% is in the middle torso piece. The arms are the exact same, as are the upper and lower torso pieces, and feet.

There's no way their body is an original, or even "inspired" by Volks. It's a blatant copy and I can't believe that so many people are defending Dollzone in this.

I honestly think that it's mostly because the DZ dolls are so much cheaper than other dolls. It saddens me that people really care about the price that much, to defend a company that is so obviously copying another company, for not the first time, but a second time.

For those people, I just have to say this:

If you're looking for cheap dolls, BJDs probably aren't the best dolls to go for.

*EDIT FOR REWORDING*

And because people are a bit jumpy, I'm not saying that EVERYONE wants DZ because they're cheap. If you genuinely love your doll and bought them because they were the one you wanted, that's great for you. It's the others that I'm addressing.

 

Wow, uhh... I think that went beyond the rules of this thread, like completely.

I have no comment on the new body that hasn't been released yet because I do not have enough knowlwdge to say something one way or the other. As far as their new 1/4's go, it's pretty obvious that they are originals. I like them. I didn't decide to get a Mo because he is cheap. I decided to get him because out of all of the other minis out there, I liked him the best. I researched about the company too and decided that it would be a fair place to start. I know some people have a problem with it. I'm ok with that. I just want to see where this thing with the body goes.

 

Yukinojo is tall, muscled, oddly lanky... Hmmm I wonder where I've seen this before.

Oh yea. Dollshe's harem of Berman and various dog-named beaus.

It's damn hard to be 100% original when you're catering to a niche clientele whom have shown that they'll shell out for a certain aesthetic. You can only pull off the slender-yet-not look but so many ways before they start to blur and look alike.

 

I feel it's not fair to link people who would like for there to be a "cheaper" doll on the market with people who support copying and stealing from other artists. Yes, I agree that many people are attracted by the lower price Dollzone offers, but to suggest that all people who would "want cheap dolls" shouldn't be in the bjd hobby and if they are, they would support dishonest company and have no morals, I find it unfair...

 

The jointing system the Dollshe boys have is completely different than the Yukinojo system.

The only difference between the DZ body and the SD16 body is that the DZ has slightly longer legs and the middle of the torso is a little taller.

It also appears to be slimmer, but I believe that's an illusion because of his height. When you overlay the DZ and SD16 images, they're the same width.

And just my opinion, but "lanky" is one of the last words I would use to describe Yukinojo.

Just FYI I edited my post, but before I didn't say anything about people who genuinely like the Dollzone moulds and buy them for that reason. I think that's fine, but even if they love their original dolls, I still think that they shouldn't support Dollzone copying Volks or any other company.

 

I don't agree with the idea that, there are only so many ways to do things, to make dolls.

Excuse me if I've misinterpreted what has been said, I've read this whole thread in one night and my head is spinning. People look different. Look at people, there is so much variance between people, how their bodies are, how heavy they are, ethnicity, gender... When they're made into dolls, joint choices, skintone can make things look different sometimes even... Possibilities are so vast.

And the thread isn't made targeting people, it's talking about the dolls in a civil manner. I didn't just read 10 pages to have the thread locked in the end.

kiskalla, usagi has as much of a right to talk as you.

DZ's dolls do have a very unique look, the original ones they created are beautiful, they're so talented. I hope they stick to their creativity...

 

Which is why I was arguing that I *don't* want the Dollzone original molds banned because they made some past mistakes. Yes, ban the ones that very viably could be copies, but leave their originals alone. I won't be buying any of the ones that, from photos, I personally think could be copies. Don't support the copies; do support the originals. DON'T buy the ones that are very likely copies, DO buy the ones that aren't. DZ will follow the market and if the only market is in original dolls, they'll stop copying.

BUT, I know the Dollzone dolls I want are originals, and I want to be able to share how great these dolls are without the wonderful original dolls being banned for the fact that they unfortunately happened to come from a company with a shady history.

 

But the thing is, Dollshe had the taller, more mature doll out first and Volks decided to take their spin on it, obviously inspired. Could be the same case here with Dollzone, but they might have taken it a couple of steps further. But while I see the similiarities, there's a lot of differences too. I also have a slight problem believing they ripped off Jo's body because of the height difference- if I want to get nickpickily nasty about it, I could always say that they lack the necessary skills to design a body on their own ( from all of the evidence gathered from previous investigations ), so how on earth could they possibly do such a modification as advanced as stretching out the height, but making it fit?

 

Other people have 'Well, they should be sued too!" I don't think that~

There is a HUMONGOUS difference between copying and influence.

Foreverdoll copied some of Volks' moulds. Serendipity was inspired by Shinydoll's rotated thighs. Shinydoll are 60cm, and SerendipityDolls are 43 cm, and are put together differently.
Serendipity did not copy, because they sculpted their own legs and body,ect. They were inspired. D:



Yukinojou looks nothing like Bermann to me. There's only so many ways you cna joint the human body and make it work. But if you put Yuki next to Bermann, do they match up like DZ and Yuki does?
In my opinion? No. DZ looks heavily inspired by Yuki, while Volks saw bermann's joints and made them their etcown in Yuki

 

This weekend I had the opportunity to see a Yukinojo totally naked. I've owned and fiddled with a DollShe body. They're utterly and completely different from one another ^^; Yuki is much, much more solid and muscular than Hound, and doesn't have the same lanky look to him at all. Yuki looks like he could break a Hound in half despite being a head shorter XD Also, Yuki has a much, much more advanced joint system >__>; He actually stands on his own without much effort.

I actually hadn't heard about the new DZ controversy, and I have to say, it saddens me :/ I've looked over the photos, and it's really very suspicious. I've played with several different brands of minis, and they're all incredibly distinct from one another, even if they're the same height. Volks especially is... pretty distinct, in my humble opinion. SD and SD13 bodies look very different from a lot of other similar-sized dolls, and SD16 is different from everything else on the market. (Other companies are the same - Luts MNF are vastly different from most mini-sized dolls, for example) So to see a doll that is so similar is very suspicious to me.

There are actually a lot of ways to sculpt and build a BJD body. That's why there's such diversity among dolls, and why people have issues sometimes with pairing sculpts from different companies (like wanting a MNF and an MSD to appear the same age). So DZ's similarities seem like more than a coincidence or a matter of standard sculpting techniques, to me.

 

I completely understand that point of view, but I also think that it would be way too hard to regulate which dolls ARE allowed and which dolls AREN'T allowed.

Foreverdoll copied once and was banned. Dollzone shouldn't have been allowed back in the first place, original dolls or not and for this exact reason.

 

Please to be making sense, comrade. Nowhere did I say she didn't have the right. Merely pointed out that her most recent "evidence" of copying left much to be desired, and seemed as though she was trying way too hard to prove a point.

The Yukinojo bod vs New DZ bod, sure. That's debatable. But the DZ head? First thing that came to mind was CP Moon. And most that replied felt the same way. That was the point I was making. She's free to harp on though, she just can't be shocked when everyone else has to squint and tilt their heads to even get an inkling of what she's saying.

 

Sorry if I sounded like I'm taking it too seriously, I'm just a bit hurt. I don't have a lot of spare money now, it's a normal part of life and I'm okay with it. But to save so hard for a doll, to know my parents disapprove (although they don't really say it), and to debate with myself on whether I should spend so much just for my own pleasure, then to have someone say that the mere act of thinking, "gee, I wish the doll I want doesn't cost so much" would mean that I shouldn't be in this hobby at all, well, I guess I did take it personally there for a sec.

But really, even the cost of Dollzone dolls are too much for something you do not love. I think we all have the dolls we love, I don't see anyone paying a couple hundred dollars for a doll they do not fall for, just for the sake of having a bjd...

I did not decide on a less expensive doll because to me, I would not have saved the difference between the prices, but rather, I would have wasted what I have paid because I do not love what I get. But I see nothing wrong with someone simply wishing that there would be less expensive bjds around.

 

Like I said before, 90% of the height difference is in the legs. It takes rolling up some apoxy into a tube shape and adding onto the existing leg. Then poking a hole in it. Then recasting.

I could do that with my eyes closed, and if they can cast resin, which I hear is VERY difficult, they should have the skill to do such a basic mod.

 

Adding height to a body is not advanced at all. Rudimentary knowledge is all you need to do it, as most of the height is in the legs. I don't have a degree in sculpture and I am positive I could make a doll taller all by myself with maybe one or two walkthroughs, all of which you can easily find online. It doesn't take a lot of talent to hack up a doll and add some quick mods to it to try and cover your tracks. You don't have to make it fit, you just need to add several cms in a shin and thigh, how hard is that? They obviously know how to cast, so why wouldn't they be able to do that?

Dollshe did have a taller, more mature male sculpt before Volks, but when you compare the Dollshe body and Yukinojo's, aside from double joints, there's nothing in common. They look nothing alike and it is obvious they were created seperate from each other.

The DZ body is not in question because people think it is inspired by Yukinojo, it's in question because it was directly ripped off.

I really do not understand how anyone could see Armeleia's comparison pics and not see the obvious copying in the feet, arms, hands, shoulders, pelvis, and legs. It's crystal clear. Those are Yukinojo's arms and hands on that body, and his feet on slightly longer legs.

 

I don't think Yuki and Hound look really anything alike at all, as someone posted before me. It looks slightly insppired by in the joints, but other than that... no, not really.

And as for the modding: please see Omichao's posts.

There isn't that much talent in adding to the legs and torso. A modder with maybe a year of experience can do it. It's not that advanced of a modification.

 

Ahh, omichao, I think that's a little strongly worded for the tone of this discussion... I too think the Dollzone doll is at least a partial copy, but the Dollzone dolls aren't even *that* much cheaper than other BJDs on the market. After a faceup and shipping, the minis are still around $300, which isn't cheap, and many dolls in the Marketplace go for the same price so it's a bit unfair to say that price is a deciding factor in this issue. Other than the CP Woori copy that was withdrawn, I don't think we've seen definitive proof that any of their other headmolds are copies, and even the Yukinojo business is not 100% clear. The fact that they've hired a lawyer (presumably to go against Volks) means that they may have the support of their parent company, Aike Green. They obviosuly know that BJD fans will recognise a direct copy because it's happened before, and that head was promptly withdrawn. The current legal action makes me think that they can somehow prove that their heads for sale now are all original sculpts... the Yukinojou body is very suspicious, but if I'm right, it has not yet been released for sale? Or has it? If it hasn't been sold, there's not yet a violation. Certainly Dollzone is suspicious... but this is not a reason to condemn owners, or China, or anything else.

 

Because when people wish for things like that, they get companies like dollzone and forever doll and polystone for materials (it was in the past..i know...im making a point)..

and then there are the threads on DoA with 10+ pages of controversy with defenses and whining from both sides which is basically just a big organized argument....that doesnt sound enjoyable to me...threads like this wouldnt make me proud to own a doll from dollzone..

and whats wrong with it is that people (and companies) who spend the money for good, nice quality strong dolls (both in manufacuturing and physical build) are given a bad name and its a little embarrassing IMO.

 

Hiring a lawyer means nothing until the case is actually in court, and DZ is 'going against' Volks on a court record. You need a lawyer to settle cases, not just to fight back. They might just want to get out of this without too much trouble.

I could be wrong. Just pointing out - if they're being sued, they'll need a lawyer no matter what happens.

I do agree that we shouldn't be condemning China or DZ owners XD That's just silly. I really feel bad for DZ owners, actually :/ Stinks to be in the middle of such a huge argument. Personally, if I found out my doll was from a company that was still blatantly copying another company's dolls, I'd feel a bit ill ^^;

 

Okay I have kept silent through this entire fiasco because I own two DollZone dolls and no others. I just figured anything I said would be dismissed, but now I feel like I have to speak out. I own my dolls because of the moulds not because of the price. I could have afforded any doll out there when I bought my first one, but I wanted a Xi. I just want that to be clear.

I have looked at the pictures. I have read all the conjecture and there are moments I really feel like there are people here who want nothing more than to cruxify a company and it supporters. Some of what I have seen and read is people looking for any reason and stretching for any similarity between DollZone dolls, any DollZone doll and other dolls. Yes I know they copied in the past. No I didn't know that when I bought my first doll. Would I have still bought him knowing about their past? Yes, because I believe people deserve second chances. Plus the dolls I bought were not copies. Though the fact that they are not copies matters little to some people, because they are still DollZone dolls and therefore should not be allowed.

Okay now that I have said my peace I will disappear, because I really shouldn't be here, at least that is how I now feel. If that is harsh and the mods want to delete it that is fine but at least for a moment or two my feeling were out there for people to see.