Elitism - How much is perceived?

I do feel like a lot of this elitism is perceived... But there is this one video that sticks out in my mind. I saw it a long time ago and this person doesn't seem to make many videos anymore. Not from what I have seen on youtube.
Anyway, the girl was talking about "white trash dolls" (she was talking about dolls with beginner faceups, a crazy fuzzed out wig and sock dress). I'm not sure if this is "elitism"...But it is definitely snobby and just...MEAN!

 

Honestly, I've not experienced it at all so while I'm sure it exists; I don't think it's happening as much as claimed. And I'm in more of a double (or triple) whammy type situation, in that I have both a Volks-Vinyl doll AND a Soom.

With my Dollfie Dream I will admit that yes I do tend to feel "left out" because they aren't terribly popular with the bjd crowd, at the last volks nyc dollpa Anju was one of maybe 7 DDs out of hundreds of volks dolls, but not once did I come across any "ew that nasty anime pron doll/That's not a real bjd!"- stuff that is supposedly said about these dolls. I've also never seen any of the supposed "volks elitism" being applied to them either, but that's probably due to them being more of the black sheep of the volks family or that many don't know volks makes them. *shrug* Though I suppose within the DD relm itself, there might be some- primarily regarding those who want or own any of the Saber sculpts. I know I do sometimes feel some people are more elite than I for having one or more Sabers, but it's definitely more in admiration than spite. I'm sure there are some people within the group who might be snobs and think you're not a true DD collector unless you have a Saber, but again I haven't seen it.

And regarding my Soom, while she's not one of the more popular sculpts or of their more common lines (at the very least not currently I believe they are gaining popularity) I've received nothing but praise for her. Heck, I've even made a few friends simply by discussing how much I like her and how I want more Sooms. I've also made others want to go and get one of their own.


I have heard DoA itself being called elitist, simply because they don't allow certain kinds of dolls- and the people saying that usually are the ones feeling oppressed because their "baby" is not included. Even my mate said this when I originally told him that my little Dollfies were "off-topic". It's not like DoA is deliberately trying to be the end-all-be-all of the dollie world, but some people do seem to feel that that is true- especially when they come here looking for ideas for their next doll and appear upset when one they like is OT. How much of this is actually true? I'm not sure. Perhaps I'm reading into things. Maybe that's where this perceived "elitism" snobbishness is coming from, people reading too much into what is likely a simple comment on one's own tastes- inferring a personal attack from what was actually a general opinion. There might be some jealousy there too. Maybe it has something to do with the age of a lot collectors- being mostly in the highschool/college crowd?

Personally I don't get it. I don't get why some people need to feel better than someone else by putting down what that person has, and I don't get why some people feel they're being persecuted just because they like a certain thing even though no such persecution is really happening- or happening as often as they say. Can't we all just get along? Who cares who has what, just look at all the pretty dollies!

 

I don't know about eltism in the community but maybe that is because my first brush with the community was genuine and people where generally rather nice to me and wanted to know about my dolls at the meet ups...for me its away to discover other companies and things I like and don't like but I would never ever say something was ugly or not to my taste because one that's just not me but two...sometimes I think well one day u might like that doll and how would u feel......I still feel a lack of confidence. But that is a personal issue of mine feeling insecure not an elitist thing.

 

This was stated that Volks isn't the true source of elitism out there, but that always cited as the greatest example of it. Read any debate of preference and elitism and Volks comes up... a lot. Volks elitists are the urbanlegend monsters of the dolly world. It's just the sheer number of times Volks elitists are brought up.

When, I definitely have to remind people that Volks is a single company that produces unarguably good quality dolls, and have a large number of them available in their arsenal. This is why many people collect Volks almost exclusively. There are a lot of Volks sculpts out there, even if a good majority are limited or FCS-only.

People make a point of stating how Volks isn't their style, or that someone isn't an elitist as long as they say "You should like Volks and only Volks, your doll is crap," or even having once met these Volks elitists of nightmares... Volks volks volks volks volks volks. *pulls out hair*

I hope I made sense now. I say all this as a Volks collector who notices that Volks is brought up a lot, and I feel it may be disproportionate to the company's just rewards.

 

Memory serves of a long-locked thread within the debate section where someone asked "Why do people by cheap doll after cheap doll?" and many noted the particular thread as evidence that Elitism exists on this forum. I admit, the OP of that particular thread was rather snobbish in behavior, but part of me always wonders if they really were an elitist snob or just a troll trying to get a rise out of others.

I have never met an elitist in person, but I have met a "Dollie Snob" ( her own words, not mine.) She refers to herself as the Doll Snob of our meet-up group, because her tastes for dolls are very particular. However, despite her own high standards for her own collection, she has never been rude to anyone for owning whatever she likes. We all joke that everyone who collects dolls is a little snobbish, after all, that are certain dolls that some love seeing pictures of, or love seeing at meets, but would never own themselves for one reason or another.

 

Elitism exists everywhere, it's a fact of life. But, I agree that what most people perceive as elitism is just someone stating a preference (which they are allowed to have) and the individual who perceives this as elitism is actually just taking a personal offense. I know this from experience. When I first joined the hobby, I let people stating their dislike of the company my first doll come from get to me personally. I even made a video about it because I just felt so persecuted. Looking back on all that, I feel embarassed. I've been in this hobby a year now and it took me a long time to realize that everyone is allowed to their preferences. I have preferences so why shouldn't everyone else? People are also allowed to state these preferences in any way they want, we all have that freedom. How we deal with it is on the individual. Now I could care less what people think of the brand of dolls I get. I like what I like and feeling persecuted because someone else doesn't is, honestly, a waste of emotions. Also if someone states not liking my doll for aesthetic reasons that I could change (i.e. a faceup or clothes), I don't take that as this huge personal attack anymore, I assess the situation. Are they right? Am I right? Regardless, I don't fling myself on my bed and cry about it anymore because I love my dolls or I wouldn't have bought them. And what I think of my dolls matters way more now than what others think about them.

 

I wholeheartedly agree that Volks gets the lion's share of the "elitism" stuff, and it is too bad that they do. Most Volks dolls are very nice. But so are most Soom dolls, and most Elfdolls, and most Iplehouse dolls, and most B&G dolls, and a huge variety of other dolls.

The thing that I just can't get over, and yes, I've had everything from a bargain basement 26cm tiny to a fullset Hijikata, is that I see nothing about Volks dolls that I, personally, find worth twice the price of the next doll down the line. Now that is a huge generality; I've seen some of the Volks fullsets (Hijikata being a great example) where the clothing was outrageously perfect and worth every penny. I've also seen fullsets that cost $400 that you could say the same thing about.

The other thing about them that prompts a lot of the criticism is that they make it ridiculously hard to get their products, which prompts cries from some that you're not a real collector if you're not willing to do whatever it takes. Um, really? No, I'm a real collector allright -- I will do what it takes to jump through all of their silly hoops to get something that will really add value to my collection, but as a general rule, well, I'm too old and tired to play games over buying dolls.

They recently did an incredibly *smart* thing by having a time-limited but open to everyone order period for DDs. If they did that more frequently, and for the resins, maybe the attitude of their being overpriced for the quality and too difficult to get would diminish. I don't know, I'm just thinking aloud here.

ETA: I'm not saying *anything* negative about their quality, btw, lest anyone misunderstand. They are lovely dolls. There just isn't anything that much MORE fabulous about them than anyone else's.

Generally speaking, and having owned dolls from all ranges of companies, I seriously do not see any difference among the vast majority of doll companies that can account for the enormous price differential between them all. (Note that I said 'vast majority' -- I have unfortunately found some that are kinda pitiful, and no, they're not the companies everyone instantly assumes).

And thus, all things being reasonably equal, I don't think anyone should be accused of *anything* for going for the dolls they like most, whether they be inexpensive but super appealing to the person in question, or high-end price point (which, I will stress yet again, does not automatically mean high-end quality).

(Seriously, I'll save a few hundred dollars to get a doll I genuinely prefer, any day. But you'd have to shoot my leg off to get my School B head from me )

 

I frankly don't care how much elitism is perceived or real. I'm too old and have been in this shit for too long. I just go about my own business, with the dolls I like, and let others stew themselves over how to perceive me.

If someone's blood boils just because somebody else likes a lot of Volks or Iplehouse dolls... if someone freaks out because they think someone else's brand of doll is overpriced... what do I care if someone is that unstable? It's their own blood-pressure they're ruining. They can sit there and do the math from brand-to-brand, and quote sociological studies, and tighten the twist in their own knickers. I go play with my dolls.

1. Your doll is not you.
2. Brands are not you.
3. If someone doesn't like what you own, you'll live.

 

GFE, my dear. Truer words couldn't be said.

 

Double post?

 

And yet, Jen, -- and you know how much I truly admire and enjoy you and your collection -- you were the source of the "not real collectors" statement and the "bargain basement 26 cm tiny" statement. *shrug* Sometimes it is hard not to perceive things like that as anything other than either 1) elitism (which I don't, just to be clear); or 2) a lack of caring for other people's opinions.

And yeah, I fully expect this to get yanked. I just felt it needed saying.


Some people don't give a crap whether their words will hurt someone else or not. I just happen to be one of those who believes you should at least take a second to realize that the other names on that screen ARE in fact real people, some of whom aren't as capable of shrugging it off as others. Common courtesy.

 

While I do believe that we have to form thicker skins, I do believe that you are right. Sometimes a person comes across something they can't shrug off. It may be something they haven't learned not to. Such as, I can't shrug off discrimination against disabled individuals who use service dogs -- it makes me very reactionary.

 

'Zactly.

I'm glad you get that. I personally used to be one of the people who got my knickers all in a twist because others didn't like my group of DZs. Now I think "ok, that's fine. I like 'em and that's what matters." But I do *try* at least not to say stuff that I know, from experience, people with thinner skins of the type I used to have might be hurt by.

You can still get to me with a librarian shushing people joke, though.

 

Woah, the double-post gremlins are hard at work today.

 

I wasn't replying to your post; yours came in while I was composing mine. You need a nice wine spritzer!

Of course everyone should be nice, but they're not, so it's just best to assume they won't be. Sorry, that's just what the internet boils down to.

 

While I haven't experienced it myself, I would argue that there is definitely elitism in this hobby--and all others for that matter. There will always be that person who thinks they're more entitled, or better because their doll has a higher price tag or a lower number produced.
While that's true I think, as a whole, our community is, albeit opinionated, but welcoming and friendly and open to the many varieties of BJDs that are out there.

Jenny the truth in your comment made me a little sad... That's one of my biggest pet peeves: people who suddenly grow a pair because they have the guise of a computer screen. People shouldn't act any differently than they do in person. If you (generically speaking, of course xD) wouldn't make a comment to someone's face, doll related or otherwise, it shouldn't be made period.

 

Internet? Oh no. It doesn't stop there. That's what life is about. Guess some people feel maybe if we can stop it on the internet we can stop it in real life. But that's in a perfect world, which we all do not live in. (But if you do happen to live one, canya invite me plz? )

Perspective is how people view the world. But how people view the world also has a great deal to do with how people view themselves. I just wanted to throw that in there. I'm not insecure about my dolls, so I don't really take anything about them personally. But I'm insecure about other things in my life, and it's with those such things that I may take something personally. It all boils down to the individual, really.


Also, I just wanna say... I think we're getting the terms "elitist" and 'jerk/@$$hole' confused. I also think this has been stated many times, but I figured I'd put it in here again

EDIT:

Girlwholived: I just want to clarify, I only used volks because you stated that your collection was mainly volks. I wasn't trying to make them into the mother of all snobbery. I apologize if it came off that way.

 

I think most of the elitism is perceived. I've never had anyone outright attack my dolls or anything. Now, I know that there are some elitists in the hobby that would try to tell people what dolls to buy and so on and so forth (I have encountered this outside of the hobby in relation to it)... but everyone has different tastes.

Personally, I know that Volks will be dominating my collection, but it's not because I perceive their dolls as being "worth" more. I like their aesthetic and quality, so I tend to gravitate towards them. Maybe that makes me a "snob" but I don't care. I like what I like regardless of who or where it fits in.

I've had my dolls critiqued when I didn't ask for it. But instead of engaging the person, I ignore it. What I do with my dolls in none of their concern unless I ask their opinion. I buy my dolls for me not for anyone else. I'm not trying to impress people or seek out their praise. I honestly think that's the mentality most people need in the hobby; I think some people seek out attention and get disappointed when the reaction to their doll/s is not what they were hoping for. Stop caring what other people think. It's hard to do for some people, but it's a lesson best learned. But if you're in the hobby to get glorified, you may want to find another hobby.

 

I didn't say you were replying to me. I just found it striking how your post was rather contradicted by some of the other posts you've made.

And I've been using the Internet since there was an Internet (not Arpanet, that was rather before my time, although few things are any more). It actually is designed to be a platform for sharing information and occasionally still manages to perform that function pretty well! (case in point - our wiki.)

And to Zexious: sadly, you're correct. Fortunately I am not one of those. I'm stupidly WYSIWYG.