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How do you feel about more joints and larger dolls?

May 2, 2007

    1. I didn't put this in the "large dolls" section since it's about joints too.

      It seems like a lot of companies are coming out with larger dolls (sabik, senior delf, sd17, etc...) A lot of the newer larger dolls have more joints or double joints too... and then there is domuya's flexibody with lots of very unusual joints.

      Do you think this trend will continue?
      How do you, as fans, like it?
      -- how do you feel about the larger dolls in general
      -- do you like more joints (like sd16 and domuya flexibody, etc...)
      -- does how the larger doll fits into your existing doll family effect whether you are going to own one? Or do you just appreciate the larger doll separately? or?

      Personally, I really like the advances in joints over the past year or so and I hope that the sd13-sized dolls (and all other size ranges like msd, etc... too) will see similar advances in posing and joints. I want my sd13 boy to be able to touch his face and sit more naturally like some of the newer dolls do! :)

      I'm really intrigued by many of the larger dolls coming out... but sometimes I don't want a larger doll to out-man my sd13-sized dolls. :) (even so I have an sd16... I haven't decided how he fits in to my existing doll family yet, I just love how he looks and how his joints function)
    2. I LOVE having more joints.... for the most part. But I think in some dolls there's a point where the aesthetics are compromised for the posability, and I'm not always a fan of that since naked dolls are nice too.

      But at the very least, I love it when dolls have double jointed elbows. I really love being able to have them make more dramatic poses with their arms. Second to that would have to be jointed thighs for crossing legs, side saddle style sitting, or suwarikko poses :D.

      I really wish more of the bodies would have at least this amount of posability. With all the time invested in making a doll body, I think a few more hours could be spent to improve the range of posing and not have to go back and make a new body to do this later :/.

      As for the question of how larger dolls fit, I'm not sure. I started off with them and decided they were much too big for me. But now, I have two large girls on the way again... I really hope they work out ^^;.
    3. As a hobby artist I can definitely appreciate the trend of more joints, as *for the most part one would think* that means more posabilty.
      Generally as far as larger dolls go, the only thing that I DON"T like about them is that many (even hounds and model dolls) seem to suffer from "skinny arm syndrome) and though I understand its more than likely so they can better slip them into shirts and what-not, it does bother my eyes a bit.
    4. Well, I love having extra posablity. Double jointed elbows and knees lend themselves to really great poses that are next to impossible to get with a "normal" body. The look of so many joints doesn't bother me in the least- actually, one of my favorites is the Domuya Flexi-body. Something about that just looksreally neat to me. It's far from being the most realistic when not covered in fabric, but I still like it. Maybe because I enjoy seeing how things work.

      I think it's great that the companies are making larger sies now- I'm sure there's many people who want a taller doll to suit a character, and with a specific company's look. I'm thrilled that CP has started making larger boys.

      But, Sabik seems too big for me. He towers over most others, and while he looks nifty, he also looks a little like he'd topple easy. Like Hounds, I love the look, but I'd be really nervous about moving one.

      Most of the taller dolls also seem to get really skinny. They look fine in clothes, but if, for example, they weren't wearing somewhat baggy, long sleeves and long pants, it bothers me a bit.
    5. I LOVE lots of joints on my dolls, even if they may take away a bit from the esthetic appeal. To me it is totally worth it!

      I'm also loving all the taller dolls being released. My SD's are all supposed to be younger/shorter characters, which left me in somewhat of a quandry when I decided I wanted some characters that were older and/or significantly taller than my current dolls (not by just a couple cm!). But I really like them to be less than 70cm, since any taller is pushing NBA player height, relatively speaking.

      If my SD's were meant to be older though I could definitely see what you mean about taller boys out man-ing them. :lol: As it is, I'm considering making my Shirou a girl so he can "keep" his age of 16-17 without looking like a midget next to my future 63cm boy, who is supposed to be a 14-15 year old of short-average height. :|

      But -- lots of joints on larger dolls can sometimes make them a bit ungainly to handle. :sweat
    6. I'm not particularly fond of either trend. I love the 60 cm size, but even then they're quite a handful due to the space they take up and their weight. I can't imagine dealing with larger/heavier dolls without doing more of an upper body workout than I already do!

      As for joints...I am also an action figure collector, and in that world it's always been a compromise between poseability and sculpt. More joints don't always make sense, as there are some action figures with joints that don't even make any sense (jointed hair?) just so they can have a larger number on the packaging.

      While I don't see BJDs getting anywhere near that silly right now, I am seeing the same tradeoff where the joints are starting to make the sculpts look clunky. Since I don't expect my dolls to pose exactly like a miniature human (they're DOLLS, after all), more joints is not appealing to me. Less joints aren't, either - I think there's a balance to be struck.

      While neither trend appeals to me, I know better than to say I'll never buy a doll that fits either criteria - because the minute I do, someone will come out with an irresistable doll!

    7. One of my favorite examples of large doll with more joints is the SD16 Olivia/Amelia from Volks. (And you can swap her legs out for jointed ankles so don't start on her having less joints) The backs of her knees are as lovely as the front, and I LOVE love love how her knees pose, the way they lock seems to work more smoothly and with less of a break in the look. I also love her body torso joint and the way her elbows are very smooth. The way her hands are strung make more movement possible as well. I don't believe there was any sacrifice on how she looks for her extra movement. A lot of the larger male dolls have some kinks to work out like the floppy bellies on the hounds. I'm very anxious to see a SD17 boy in person to see how he looks naked from all angles. I'm wondering what changes overall they had to make to his joints for some of those wonderful seated poses.
    8. I don't think there need to be much more joints beyond what an SD13 boy has. As long as the limbs have single joints and there is a joint in the middle of a torso then I'm fine.

      Also have to take in account how most doll clothing isn't made to really accommodate a ton of joints. It's restrictive just like it is on humans.
    9. I don't mind more joints, as long as they don't look bizarre.

      Odd-looking joints can put me off of a doll body almost as fast as bad body sculpting, ugly hands or very limited posability... I'm just picky about that kind of thing. Even though my dolls tend to be dressed in ways that hide their joints completely, it would still bug me.

      I've learned that the hard way with my Hound. o_O
    10. I really love how new doll bodies can pose so well, I just got my darling Eien a new body from Bobobie and it poses super well! Eien can actually sit on his knees without ahving to come-out of his leg sockets! it looks very natural!
      -- I really like larger dolls since they seem to be easier to handle...
      -- Like I said I love lots of joints!
      -- Not at all, larger dolls have just as much placing in my family as my others do.
      I like all doll sizes, from 5" to 70cm! it's really about how you handle them along side your other dolls, I guess? I want to have one of each size someday! =^_^=
    11. how do you feel about the larger dolls in general

      I prefer the larger dolls. I only have a mini and although i luv him very much i would luv to have a large doll. Tho under 70cm is better for me. If i get a 70cm it'll look slightly odd and hard to carry. a 80cm Sabik is half my size so it's intimatating.

      -- do you like more joints (like sd16 and domuya flexibody, etc...)

      Actually that's a yes. I really like the SD17 joint system but it's a real shame that i really can't afford Reisner. I definately had the urge to buy him really, perfect for my twins but alas he's limited and i just don't have the money right now, plus saving to bring a CP home at the moment too.

      But the joints are cool, they pose much more naturally. I get annoyed with the dislocated knees that Rae has and his leg twisting the other way due to the dislocation.

      -- does how the larger doll fits into your existing doll family effect whether you are going to own one?

      lol i answered that? I've always wanted a large doll. When i saw Rae he's pretty tall for a mini i thought it'll be ok but i like them large. Tho as i've said it depends on the doll itself. I might like one doll for it's height but not another one of the same height. I mold my characters around the dolls so family members don't effect me.

      Or do you just appreciate the larger doll separately

    12. I like double-jointed elbows, knees, and the extra poseability by the "cap" system (if you learn how to use it) on the minifee thighs, and big CP shoulders. But when they get the joints too strange, so the doll looks deformed unless it has clothes on all over (those arm and leg caps of the Domuya bodie creep me out, frankly), that's enough for me.

      If they'd put a double knee and elbow joint in my minifees, I'd be in hog heaven!

      Height - aside from the minifees, I find the 60-63cm size best for posing, stability, and general haulage. I like the clothed look of the 70cm Dollshes, but their gangly arms and the too-low-placed knees really bother me. (I also don't like how after Dollmore made a 70cm male leg with the knee in the right place, they then went and made the arms even longer! The Jack Skellington approach to things?) After hefting a Jace, though, I can understand the appeal of minimizing the weight of the bigger boys. (And I would very much like to see a smaller version of a Saint or Hound head on a 63cm doll too, though I doubt Dollshe will reverse the trend and come out with a smaller doll than their 70cm.)
    13. I honestly love the idea! I love big dolls, the bigger the better! But with the height the price does in crease as well as the body advancing.. everything gets more expensive. I love the idea, I just dont think Ill be able to afford it. $1,300 for Reisner @-@ Ill never be able to get him.. even though I want him so badly T^T I love that theyre becoming more and more realistic. :)
    14. I think that it isn't really a matter of esthetic OR poseability, because the joints can look really neat. I like the joints showing in pictures, so that's no problem with me :'p As long as the bodies are well-made, not too skinny, natural looking and poses well, I am just happy if there are more joints for better poses ^^ Though I never expected any doll to do all the humans can do. I like them being dolls ^^

      And about the bigger dolls - I think that my 60cm boy is enough to handle x) Later I might buy another boy that I want to be more mature-looking and maybe around the Luts Senior Delf size (I am pretty sure there will be more of this size around by the time I can afford one), but something taller than 65cm - no.
    15. I think the dolls with higher posability are just gorgeous! However, I don't think I'd want to start out with a doll that was so articulated. My next doll will probably be an MSD, and even though I'd probably love to see a larger range of motion... I dunno if I"m ready for something that has so many points by which to pose. I am aware of my DD2s limiting factors... like she can't touch her face, or cross her legs (boo). I don't know. I suppose I'd like to start with an MSD, get used playing with and maintaining a stung doll, and then in the future I'll move to a larger much more agile doll ^_^. I certainly am glad that they are available, but I don't ever want to see the little ones completely vanish, either!
    16. I like having a range of height options to choose from when planning my doll family; the only downside I see to the larger dolls is that when they get to a certain point (Sabik is an example of this, in my opinion) they would just look out-of-scale to the rest of the crew. While if I saw one I absolutely loved I might get it, even if it didn't quite fit in, I'd much rather keep everyone as close to in-scale as I can.
      ETA: Also, one thing that bothers me with the larger dolls is the arms. Lots of stick-like arms, which seem incongruous on dolls that are generally meant to be more adult-looking or "manly". :\

      Joints, though, I adore, especially the arm joints, as some have said. Realistic posing is a big plus with me, and since my dolls don't spend a lot of time naked, the slight loss of "realism" (I guess) is okay with me. ^_^
    17. I love the bigger dolls! The smaller ones are cute, but they don't have the "heft" that the big boys and girls have. ^.^ THough, Sabik is too tall for me... >_> He's quite literally over half my (admittedly not impressive) height! Too much doll. He just wouldn't fit with any other doll I have/plan on having. I think 60-70 cm is just right. ^.^ A nice armful without being the size of my little brother. o_O

      As for joints, all I have to say is: YES PLEASE! Poseability is one of my favourite parts about these dolls, so the more the better! It's really frustrating, now, that my CP doll can't touch his face or anything. v___v Or look down as much as I would like...
    18. i generally prefer larger dolls...there's a few D.O.T's i've got my eye on but i like dollshe and sabik alot >.> i think having more joints is a good but bad thing. with more joints you get greater posability but also lose stability and sometimes aesthetic appeal. so i think it's a two way street and it may take awhile to find a balance between posabilty and ridiculous-ity. though...i'm pretty happy with the amount of joints saints have...
    19. It really depends on how the doll is engineered whether more joints means a loss of stability - Some of my best standers have been dolls with lots of joints. Both my Arashi and the Yukinojo I used to have stand like rocks unless you have them in bad shoes no doll will stand in. >_> Whereas the CP body one of my Isaos is on(Ephram) has the traditional CP kickiness and isn't as easy to get to cooperate despite single knees

      There are some things I've noticed playing with dolls that lead to less stability which have nothing to do with number of joints - For example, every doll I've played with that had rounded ankle ball slots as opposed to slits had trouble standing because the ankle wasn't stable enough.

      Some single joints aren't very pretty either, and some double joints are, so I don't think it's necessarily a case of 'more joints = less aesthetics'.

      I quite like the trend towards more joints. Less posable bodies are beginning to frustrate me because they don't do what more posable ones do - It bothers me that I can't, say, sit my SD13 boy body-equipped Isao crosslegged like I can my Arashi. So double joints, swivel thighs, that sort of thing I really like. I'd like to see more swivel-type thighs over suwarriko ones - The suwarriko slots are big, slightly ungainly to work with and only really allow for the suwarriko pose, whereas swivel thighs are nearly unnoticable, especially in photos, and allow with enough range of knee movement(Which most dolls that come with suwarriko legs already have) for both the suwarriko pose and cross-legged sitting. Pretty much the kind of jointing already present on SDC boys and SD16 boys is what I'd like every kind of doll to have.

      Ah, yeah, I'd also like the gap between male and female to get closed - Like how the SDC and SD16 *girls* don't have the posability of the boys.

      I'd also like to see more smaller dolls with more joints. SDC bodies are great, let's see more minis like them. Also more Yo-sized tinies like that.

      Onto larger dolls... Well, I *owned* a Yukinojo, past tense. :< I loved his posing, but he was just plain too big for me. Big, heavy, difficult to cart around as easily as even a SD13 boy is. About 62cm like long-legged SD13 boys is my limit, anything else and they start being difficult to cart around. And he was only 65cm. :lol: Well, he also didn't suffer from the same syndrome most taller dolls seem to. SD16 boys are built and they're heavy suckers. XD Most 70 and the 80cm ones are unappealing to me due to being too skinny, and many seem to have limbs that are too long or have joints in the wrong places and it's just not attractive to me. Plus, well, again with the same problem as Yukinojo.

      So I'd love for Volks, or any other company, to come out with a SD13-sized boy body with the kind of posing you get out of SDC/SD16 boys. With an appropriately SD13-sized neck. Other than the size, head scale would prevent me from putting any of my SD13 boys on a SD16/17 body - Both Isao and Link have small heads and wear 8-9 wigs. (Well, that and Lukas is whiteskin... XD) Neck size would keep me from using a male domuya flexibody as it would be too small. I'm also not fond of the flexibody as it goes a little too far with the jointing and doesn't have anything to really keep it stable. I've played with them a few times and it just doesn't do it for me.

      So yeah. More joints as long as it's not ridiculous and they're properly engineered so the doll can still stand without being worked for five minutes first. XD And more normal sized dolls rather than bigger ones, preferably with better posing.
    20. I love big dolls! Maybe it's because they seem more lifelike, I don't know, but I seem to be drawn more to the bigger models than the small ones.