Importance of doll certificate?

Mar 24, 2017

    1. so I had recently bought off a Customhouse Ai Cebee off a local doll marketplace but I was not provided a certificate because the seller had forgotten about it. Nonetheless snapshots of the certificate was provided for me so I know it existed, just that I did not receive the hard copy of it. I had also confirmed that the doll is authentic.
      I was just wondering to fellow doll owners; how important are doll certificates to you? And also how important will it be when you intend to sell your doll? I have no intention to sell my girl for now but due to rumours from Customhouse and Aidolls it might be harder than usual to sell without a certificate.
       
    2. I'd say 80% of the time I will not buy a doll if it does not have its CoA. Exceptions include: the company doesn't or didn't make CoAs at the time of original purchase but I can see receipts; the head or body was part of a split and the CoA went with other parts but I can still be shown proof it was legit; the doll is not known to be recast.

      If the CoA is listed as included in the sale, and I did not receive it, I would be a very unhappy camper. To me they are part of the doll. They are assigned to that specific doll only, so I want it. In the instance of split items, I do prefer it have a copy of the CoA (bodies commonly have a photocopy of CoAs while the real one stays with the head sculpt in a lot of splits). Personally I view lack of CoA as a decrease in value, I wouldn't pay full price for it missing.
       
      • x 8
    3. I second @Cuteasadoll.

      So far I have only bought second hand dolls, and it's very important to me that I get the certificate. I don't want to get scammed and end up owning a worthless recast. Most of the time, if not always, I will not buy the doll if it doesn't come with a CoA.
      Also a doll without a CoA is, in my opinion, a lot harder to sell.

      Regarding your problem with the missing CoA, can't the seller send it to you? Like in a letter, but maybe one of those really durable plastic ones in which you get small stuff from eBay etc.
       
      • x 1
    4. Yeah I agree! I was really disappointed when I realise that she had forgotten the COA, but because she it's a secondhand market there is nothing much I can do other than leaving a negative feedback, but this is also after I've made numerous attempts at following up. Nonetheless I Guess it's pretty much part and parcel or secondhand dealing, and given the fact that I got it 130USD for the doll I supposed it isn't that much of a loss either :/

      She did send me pictures of the COA before I agreed to purchase the doll off her so back then I didn't really think that something like this would have happened :( I tried asking her to send it over to me, and even offered a meet up at her convenience (we live in the same city) but her lack of replies was really disappointing. But since it was a secondhand market there's nothing much I can do but to leave her a negative feedback :(
       
      #4 musashii, Mar 24, 2017
      Last edited by a moderator: Mar 24, 2017
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    5. Oh darn :( That sounds like a difficult situation, but at the same time it sounds a bit sketchy to me. Why refuse giving the CoA to who it belongs? I don't understand.

      Have you tried contacting the moderators on your local doll marketplace?
       
    6. Her reason for not meeting me is because the certificate is at her mother's place which is probably another city and she wouldn't know when she would return from there. And she probably thought that since the transaction is over she no longer has the responsibility in handling over what she owes. A few apologies from her was given but other than that, nothing else :( I didn't really try reporting her to the morderator because the most they could do is just to ban her account, but that will only happen if the case was big enough :(
       
      #6 musashii, Mar 24, 2017
      Last edited: Mar 24, 2017
    7. I never thought I would ever buy a doll without a coa, until I ended up buying a doll without a coa. I snagged a yellowed, boxless, coa-less darak doll Remy off eBay for $150. If it was any other doll I'd laugh at the obvious scam and be on my merry way. (Can you imagine seeing a boxless yellowed Minifee on eBay without a coa!? Even if it was legit I'd doubt most people would even bother clicking on something so fishy!) But what really sold me on her was the fact that she A) had the companies original faceup (most recasters aren't talented enough to give even halfway decent faceups, let alone replicate a legit companies faceup that even has tiny freckles) and B) the fact that she isn't on any known recasters list. I think that when it comes to purchasing without a coa you should have AT LEAST 3 of your own personal criteria of what makes a coa-less doll a possible purchase. For me it's the state of the doll, the current recasters list, and the sellers reputation. For someone else it might be screen shots, the sellers buying history, or the companies own verification. It's different for everyone.
       
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    8. I think the certificate is the important things... Because You need it to proff that your doll is legit. But if You didn't want to sell your doll and keep it yourself I think its okay if you didn't have the certificate.
       
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    9. Dang that's really a bad experience! I'm so sorry you had to go through it. :(

      If I forgot to send the certificate with a doll I'd resend it to the buyer at my own cost because to me COA are very important especially for works of art like these beautiful dolls and it's proof that the doll is something authentic that is the result of hard work, sweat, tears, blood (???) of the makers.

      However, I do realize that not all companies give out certificates. In fact, my Fairyland dolls, brought directly from their website, doesn't have certificates, and my DIM Ace, bought in their "last" sale, came with neither the certificate nor the official box would you believe that. But I have asked FL and DIM about it and I have their replies to me as well as screen shots of the orders and receipts to them to prove the dolls' authenticity should I decide to sell them in the future. I imagine I'd expect the same of any second hand dolls I buy in the future.

      I think it depends on how much you trust the seller, but IMO you should push for the COA if you know she has it, and especially if there's a possibility that you might sell the doll in the future. Just my two cents though! :)
       
      #9 Galileo, Mar 24, 2017
      Last edited: Mar 24, 2017
    10. I agree with @Galileo My DF-H practice head didn't come with COA too, I think because the head just the practice head. But, I respect the sculpt even it is just practice head. But as long as you trusted the seller its OK.
       
    11. That's actually helpful! Thanks! But does it cause you any sense of insecurity if you ever want to resell her without a COA?

      Ahaha yes that's true! I'm having second thoughts about selling her in general but then since I got her off at a below average price for a legit 60cm doll I supposed I can't complain much either XD

      Yeah I do heard that usually COA won't be included if you just get the head or the body, which makes it abit challenging for beginners to identify its authenticity unless the seller is known for being trustworthy or they have to go an extra mile to research on it hahah
       
      #11 musashii, Mar 24, 2017
      Last edited by a moderator: Apr 28, 2017
    12. I lost the COAs of my three boys when I moved house... which makes me glad (er, gladder) that I never plan on selling them-- I definitely wouldn't put a doll up on the marketplace if I didn't know exactly where the COA was to send onto the new owner, just knowing how important they are for a buyer. I haven't yet actually bought secondhand, but there are dolls on my 'wildest dreams' wishlist who could only be obtained secondhand, and certification would be very important to me in that case.
       
    13. I would only not insist on getting the doll with a CoA if the doll isn`t known to be recasted. Otherwise I always ask for a CoA or else I do not buy the doll.
      But if it has never been recasted then why not?
      My girlfriend lost two of her CoAs when we moved but she still has the original paperwork and the original boxes so she doesn`t really bother.
       
    14. I know recast dolls is a major concern, but almost none of my dolls have certificates. In my collection of 15 dolls I believe only 2 came with certificates- my Souloid and my Kaye Wiggs (which is just a tiny business card with signature) . My dollzone might have one, and I don't remember if I have the Soom since I only kept the head. None of the pukipuki, Bluefairy, or Dollclans came with one, all received directly from their companies.

      My second hand dolls are a littlefee, another Peakswoods, and some pukipuki.

      So no, a lack of certification will not prevent me from buying a doll. Perhaps if all companies agreed to send one every time I'd feel different.

      However, in your specific case where you were sent a picture but didn't receive the hard copy I'd be mad.
       
    15. I've bought second hand dolls without a CoA but part of what made me feel safe was seeing the owners box opening videos and the doll had a face up from a well known artist who refuses to work on recasts. Well known face up artists usually have a very distinctive style that is difficult for other artists to duplicate.

      I would echo everyone else though in that it's crummy dealings when you purchased the CoA along with the doll and didn't get the CoA. Certainly at the very least leave it in the review.
       
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    16. Personally, I just want some sort of proof that the doll/body/head is legit. a COA is a good way to tell, but it is not the only one. There are many cases where a COA cannot be provided, such as if the doll is split and the seller only decides to sell the body or head. Then they usually only send a copy of the COA.
      Or a seller might have lost it. In these cases, I am generally very careful and look for the following additional points that can prove a doll is not a recast:

      1) Original Box with pillow (recasters usually don't bother making those)
      2) Original Faceup (recasters usually fail to replicate those)
      3) Original Clothes if provided
      4) Check on recast lists to see if the doll is on there
      5) Copy of the transaction with the doll company (if the seller is the first owner)
      6) If a doll is cheap, like MiroDoll, Resinsoul etc, then most probably it won't be a recast, because what is the point

      If None of the above criteria can be met, I go my merry way and buy elsewhere.
       
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    17. When you buy a second doll or intent to sell your own doll, doll certificate can prove that the doll is not a recast one. It's really important to me.
       
    18. Yap, but I think it's legit as long as the stamp on the back head same and the shop is the shop that just sells legit doll.
      The detail is different and The weight of the legit head is heavier. I can say this from my experience, even the head is not from the same company, the weight indeed very very different the texture too.
       
    19. Of the 18 or so customhouse dolls I've bought used, maybe 3 still had the certificate. There are other things that make me feel confident that they aren't recasts: marks inside the head, colour, texture, even the string they used to tie the hands and feet on with. I can even tell when the doll was made based on the colour. At this point I'm not even expecting plates on the back of their heads because I've lost a couple myself when they fell off and slid under my walls.

      I am more cautious when buying from eBay - if they don't have the certificate or original faceup there I will look at other things the seller is selling/has sold and sometimes ask how they've acquired the doll.
       
    20. Thankfully, most of the dolls I'm interested in have NOT been recasted, so I'm not terribly concerned about COAs for those ones if they do come up on the second hand market. I keep all my boxes and paperwork for my dolls, because I know it will make buyers more confident if I decide to sell or trade in the future.

      As others have said, there are other ways to confirm the legitimacy of some dolls, especially those who are not issued COAs by the manufacturer. Volks for example has headplates with a stamped code; I avoid buying the ones with missing or suspicious looking plates.

      If a COA is promised in the sale but not included when the doll arrives, I would be upset.