Including cost of faceup on sale price?

Feb 17, 2021

    1. Well. I put up some of dolls for sale and I do include the cost of faceup, if the faceup are in good condition.

      And personally I feel it's kinda a pity to wipe it off specially some artist hardly open slots.

      P. S. In other market it seems like its a normal thing to do. So I'm just wondering.
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    2. I think since face-ups are to the owner's taste, it's not common you'll get a buyer who wants the faceup. It's different when it's factory default, but when you commissioned an artist to suit what you want the doll to look like, there are likely not many others who have the same concept for the sculpt that are interested in buying. I think if it really is a sought-after faceup artist, like Tianba or Koala Krash for example, then for the first price it is fair to include a fraction of the face-up cost. However, I think if no one is interested at that price you listed including face-up price, then it's wise to decrease the price. In all, it really depends. All dolls I bought secondhand came with face-ups that I wiped immediately upon arrival.
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    3. As someone who doesn't do faceups, sometimes a good faceup can make me look twice at a sculpt I never would have considered or see a character I might never have envisioned, so I personally don't mind paying more for a doll with a good faceup. Faceups really are a matter of personal taste, though, so I could see it going either way.
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    4. I can definitely see why someone might pay more for a nice face up!

      But I'll say in particular, when I'm purchasing heads in particular, I'm *personally* purchasing a head because I want to work on the face up myself. So to me, a head with a face-up has no more or less value than a blank head, and actually will require more of my time to prepare for how I want it to be for my own work!

      It really is just buyer preference in the end, I think! I guess that's why pricing can be an art in itself - and willingness to haggle if you have room for it can be beneficial as it allows both parties to understand and come to a compromise based each others goals :)
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    5. If it were me, I’d offer the doll with the cost already factored in - the faceup is already there, and taking it off is actually extra work for you, so it wouldn’t quite make sense for it to be less if we make you remove it first. But that’s just me? Normally the faceup WOULD make it cost more but that’s because you have to add the extra materials and time putting it on.
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    6. I have a controversial opinion on this one. To me a custom faceup (commissioning someone) is an expense a person, as the collector, incurs to make the doll according to their taste, so I don’t find it reasonable to ask a future buyer to pay for it so that the seller can recuperate costs. This is why I don’t buy dolls where people charge extra for the faceup since I will wipe all dolls anyways. And why I don’t order company faceup since I want all my dolls to look how I desire. There are exceptions to this, like Volks—I tend to like to keep their default faceups, but it’s more a legitimacy thing when you buy/sell second hand. And also I hate shipping very expensive or limited dolls, so that holds me back from getting them custom painted.

      This is also why -I- don’t charge for faceup when I sell because it was my choice to spend money to get that doll to look how I wanted. I don’t care if I commissioned a famous artist for it, I would never charge what I spent customizing a doll. I take the loss and if the future buyer likes it, well I just take it as good karma. I would prefer to save the buyer that expense so they can put it toward hiring someone they like to bring their vision to life. I also don’t put pressure on the buyer to keep the faceup because it’s “special.”

      Furthermore, if the faceup was unique—as in very specific to a character I designed—I always wipe the doll before selling since I don’t want my characters to live on in someone else’s house.

      With that said, I think each seller has a right to charge what they want for a doll, including for the faceup. That’s their call. There’s nothing wrong with that.

      As a buyer we have the option to say no if the sales conditions don’t satisfy us. Just because I don’t find value in it doesn’t mean it’s wrong. And someone who does find value will have the chance to buy the doll instead. It’s a win win.

      So, if you’re a seller and your terms are you do want to include the faceup price, stay firm. You have a right to charge that and the buyer can always look elsewhere for a doll that meets their needs and condition.
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    7. I rarely shop for second market dolls, I only ever purchased two blank heads from here about ten or more years ago. I specified I didn't wanted the heads painted, because by default the ones I got came unpainted and having them painted (to me) meant they were used. I personally wouldn't purchase a doll second market today, and I wouldn't pay more for a face up.

      Having said that, in the past, I did read people purchasing dolls or heads for a lot more than the doll or head were worth, due to who had painted the head. I don't know if that is a thing anymore, because I haven't read/heard anything regarding "highly" sought after face up artist in a long time (but maybe I'm not looking/reading the right places). It's up to the individual purchasing the doll or head, if they are willing to pay extra for the face up, and up to the seller if they want to make that an important part of the sale. I personally wouldn't do it, because I have no interest in it, but I know that for a while, it was a thing people were willing and able to do. (:
    8. Honestly, I'm considering to buy my next doll second hand. If the face up were by an artist i love, i wouldn't mind paying extra. But most face ups look pretty generic, so I wouldn't want to pay extra for it. I'll most likely have my artist wipe it to create something new anyway. So yeah, i wouldn't think that's a good idea. Then again, the price of a doll is just a number the seller came up with, so we don't know how you got to the price. If nobody wants to buy it, then obviously the price is too high for the demand. So do what you like, and find out what the market does. ;)
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    9. Personally, I wouldn't because I do most of my faceups myself and the ones that I have commissioned are completely tied to my own original characters. I would wipe the faceups before selling them anyway. And from experience, unless the faceup is like super gorgeous, the high prices don't really allow for the head to move quickly. The point of customizing a doll is to put your own spin on it. So if I'm looking for a doll I'll be more likely to buy a blank head than one with a faceup from the previous owner. However, there are exceptions to this but it's only happened a couple of times but mostly it's just not in my budget to pay for a faceup that I'm going to wipe anyway. That goes for default faceups too. I usually only keep them on the tinies because it's difficult to do such tiny details. bigger dolls I'll wipe them.

      You as a seller as someone stated before have the right to put a price on your doll how you want. If you want to charge for the faceup, then charge for the faceup. There's no right or wrong, really. It's mostly a matter of how quickly you want the doll to move. If the faceup is gorgeous it will likely move, but if it's a pretty generic faceup, mostly it'll sit a while until you drop the price down.

      These are just my opinions and values so take it with a grain of salt and go with your own judgement. The worst that can happen is that it doesn't sell for the original list price.
    10. As a buyer I look at if the total price meets my budget before deciding if the price is worth what it includes to me.

      Personally I am more attracted and tend to desire face-ups for future purchases. As long as I like what it looks like. I do not have experience with selling bjds but I think you have to be happy with what you sell it for.
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    11. If I'm buying a doll second hand I don't expect to pay extra for the faceup - it's probably not to my taste and will need wiping and redoing anyway.

      I'm buying it for the doll, not the faceup the previous owner happens to have had done on it.

      Yes, occasionally I keep the faceup a doll or a head comes with, if it's to my taste and close to how I'd have had the head painted anyway.

      If the seller is insistent that the faceup is extra, I'd ask them to wipe it and sell me the doll or head for the blank price. I wouldn't expect to pass on the cost of the faceup on any of the heads/dolls I sell - it would be unfair on the buyer AND would narrow the market to buyers who happen to like the same sort of face-ups that I do.

      EDITED TO ADD: It's comparable to including the price you paid for shipping the doll to you when you bought it in the sale price. You can't expect the buyer to pay two lots of shipping costs just because you want to recover what you payed for shipping when you bought the doll. So you shouldn't expect the buyer to cover whatever price you chose to pay for a faceup.

      Just my opinion. You are, of course, perfectly entitled to set the price wherever you want to

      #11 Teddy, Feb 17, 2021
      Last edited: Feb 17, 2021
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    12. When I shop for a pre owned doll, a faceup I like makes it more desirable for me. If I didn't like it I would not consider it.
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    13. I think if the artist is well-known I can see bumping the price up a little, but maybe not the full cost if the head was sent out to another artist.
    14. I never include the cost of a faceup in my sales threads. Personally, I would never pay more for a faceup, since all of my dolls are shells of particular characters and I want custom faceups for them. I've tried keeping gorgeous artist faceups before but I always end up wiping them because they never feel like they're "mine".

      I don't think charging for a faceup is going to make much difference in the long run. You'll have buyers like me that won't be interested at all, but there are also buyers who don't have a set idea in mind and would rather buy a doll who already has a pretty faceup than have to commission someone else to do it. I think the most important part is whether the price reflects the quality of the faceup. I've seen some people charge $100+ extra because the doll has a "OOAK faceup" that is actually very amateurish. I would think those sellers would have a hard time selling those dolls at increased prices.
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    15. Twice in my collecting career I purchased a second hand doll with a face up that had hidden unrevealed discolored areas in the face. In one of these cases the seller didn't even know it because the discoloration had developed during the time the face up was on; they did nothing wrong, it probably was a fault in the resin itself. So I won't buy a doll again that I can't check for discolorations first, and as I would wipe a face up in any case to paint my own, I would not want to pay extra for it anyway.
    16. If it's a default face-up, as a buyer, I would expect a doll in good condition to include that face-up cost in it. I've bought dolls like that before. It's always a nice surprise when the cost doesn't include the cost of the face-up, but I don't expect that. I've also been happy to buy heads with artist face-ups, sometimes because I know I like the sculpt but don't have a character in mind yet, and I can let the unique face-up inspire their new character. The ones I've bought like that usually don't charge extra for the face-up, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't have been willing to pay more for it. There was once a doll I was willing to pay the extra for because he had an amazing face-up, but the seller hadn't been active for a while and by the time they got my message I'd already moved on and no longer had the funds.

      I guess the tl;dr for my take is, it depends on the person if they're willing to spend the money, but I wouldn't fault a seller for charging more for a good face-up.
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    17. If I paid for a face-up and then put the doll up for sale, I would charge for the face-up. I consider it an addition to the doll like eyes or wigs.
    18. Generally, I see no issue charging extra for a faceup if it's unique—especially if it's done by a famous/popular in-demand artist (especially if that artist is no longer taking commissions). In a sense those faceups are special, and faceups in themselves can be considered pieces of art.

      For me personally, though—each member of my resin crew I have a very particular vision for. I've passed up on purchasing a sculpt I desired for a specific character because I didn't want to be the one to wipe off an artist faceup. I wouldn't have any desire to keep it if I bought it—even if it was extremely detailed. They just wouldn't be my character, and I just haven't been able to bond with bjds not tied specifically to one of my OCs (I only have one exception to this, and he's more exception than the rule). I'd feel bad about doing that—especially if somebody else fell in love with it and I go and essentially destroy it.

      So, yeah—no, I won't pay extra for a faceup. I generally don't like buying dolls second hand with fancy faceups. It's just personally specific for me that way.
    19. But if the buyer doesn't want the eyes or wig you chose to include, they can at least sell those on to recoup the extra you charged them - they can't do that with a face up they had to pay extra for even though they didn't want it in the first place.

      But the buyer may not WANT that faceup, no matter how famous the artist is, or unique the faceup, or how much YOU liked it. They wouldn't be buying a piece of art, they'd be buying a customisable doll, and you'd be charging them extra for something that YOU chose to customise the doll with, but which they are going to wipe and redo anyway.

      The fact it's by a "famous", "popular", or retired artist is irrelevant, and doesn't make it worth the anything to someone who's having your choice of faceup foisted onto them as part of the sale when they don't want or like it. That's like selling a used car and raising the price because you chose to have it resprayed green when it was blue to start with.

      #19 Teddy, Feb 19, 2021
      Last edited: Feb 19, 2021
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    20. It's really very subjective; a faceup's value is in the eye of the beholder. You could have Picasso do it but if the buyer doesn't like Picasso they wouldn't pay you extra just because.

      Then again it's a free market. You can price what you want and buyers are free to decide what to do with their money, there is no right or wrong.
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