Modification Ethics

About the only thing I would draw the line at would be a YoSD size doll with an erect penis.

 

That ideology is very subjective as you imply, it obviously varies
from country to county as well. Obviously I was over exaggerating,
as just the concept of owning an actual piece of that nature would be
kind of near impossible for most of us (regardless of wealth).

My point was that regardless of what the doll’s value (even sentimental)
or its rarity is, if you own it then it is yours to do with as you please.
Even if it seems “disrespectful” to some, it is not unethical/immoral,
because it is yours (even if it was an actual museum quality masterpiece).



- Enzyme

 

Let us stick to the subject shall we? I'll borrow Cymorill's original post so I don't wander. This was not meant to be about LE's or, any specific doll, those have been gone over with a million fine-toothed combs. Lets just stick with General BJD H for a moment, hmm? ^-^

I really don't see where there is a 'line' to modding, ethical or otherwise. Let us take General BJD H for now. It comes in a rainbow of colours, but very basic shades. You want a shade not offered so you buy a white doll, and dye it oh... Orange. Sure, it was offered in a sort of orange-tinted 'tan', and in a bright day-glo 'orange' but you wanted a mellow, sunny orange. While being a mod, this isn't too drastic, but it is a mod when this is already a colour offered. Is this unethical? I don't think it is, modding has nothing to do with ethics and all to do with personal taste, the doll itself is not different, you've just coated the resin with something. Same with bigger mods, you've not changed the doll itself, its still what it was, you've just added or taken away until it suits your taste.

Next part! ^-^

If it comes to aesthetics, everyone's vision is different. I know there are certainly dolls out there I would love but I could see opening the eyes (A bit or a lot, depending on if it's dreaming or truely a 'sleeping' sculpt) making it better for me. Let us use General BJD H again. Assume that you have bought General BJD H and he is lovely, just as you imagined, he's a nice colour, say.... Normal skin, a bit of a warm yellow tone too it, but that is the normal colour for the company.

The only thing wrong is that this sculpt with it's gorgeous mouth, and lovely jawline is a dreaming sculpt, and the character you have in mind has open eyes. So you take your knife and sanding papers and you go to work. After several hours of effort and time you have adjusted him to 16mm eyes and he is absolutely the vision of perfection you had in mind! However, it is now a modified General BJD H. Was it sold to you with the condition that you change nothing? No? Well then, everything is fine and dandy, as the rest of it is still recognisable as the same doll with those distinct lips and the lovely jawline. After all, if the sculptor hadn't wanted you to enjoy it, they would have put conditions on it so that you changed nothing.

Anyone who sculpts something to be customised would probably be glad that you chose General BJD H as THE DOLL you wanted to work on. After all, you picked General BJD H instead of Regular BJD L as your subject.

This I find particularly interesting as I have a doll I personally want to adjust the elbow joints on. Lets get on to the end here. XD

So, we have opened the eyes on General BJD H, the sculptor has emailed you back in their lovely Engrish (because you enjoy reading it, it's so cute!) to tell you how much they like your addition and think that it was nice that you chose General BJD H for it, as it looks fantastic. But you are finding the the elbows, while being 'supposedly' double-jointed, are not functioning right. The joint doesn't slide out like it should, the hold the arm folded up to the shoulder. It just pops back in and the arm snaps into a 45-degree-angle. So, you take the doll apart and carefully work on the joint piece until there is a small catching notch there, so that when you bend the arms, the parts catch on the notches and the arm stays bent.

And it works! Is this wrong? The product itself was not defective, it just wasn't working the way it was displayed too. You've fixed it, and now it does. Yay! Is there a problem with the sculptor, did he not have a Dolly Engineering Degree? Of course not, there isn't one to be had. He did the best he could. So he managed to make it work for him, you managed to make it work for you, who cares? No one will notice it unless you point it out.

~~~

Honestly, modifications are in the eye of the beholder, if it looks better, works for you better, what does it matter? The company is happy because you bought General BJD H, what do they care what you do with it then? They got what they wanted, verification through purchase that they have a product that people like. Ethics has nothing to do with it. If it did I wouldn't have dyed my BBB Sprite purple, I wouldn't be considering adding notches to my DollFamily guy's elbows to make them bend the way the images showed they should. What they have working for them isn't working for you. So mod it until it does. At least they know you like their product enough to work on it until you're happy, instead of throwing it on someone else and buying something different.

 

Oh, let's not get into that tired old American-Consumer-Bashing dreck again. Bad behavior or disrespectful attitudes have nothing to do with nationality, so let's stuff that notion right back where it belongs. It has no place here.

What does have a place here is the question "who gets to decide what's a treasure". That's the question we're after!! Who gets to decide which modifications may be performed upon which doll? -- You? Me? Leenah? Sarah Palin? Damien Hirst?

It'd still be art. Whether or not any one specific observer personally finds it ethical or unethical, in intent or execution, is another matter. (cf. Mr. Hirst above, as many people do not believe his forays to qualify as Art because they personally find his methods unethical or his execution distasteful.) But again, it's subjective, so anybody's votes of "yes ethical" or "no unethical" don't matter hypothetically, either.


Every other day on DOA I have to look at some doll that was once lovely, & has gotten a hideous colorless faceup and cheap outsized accessories and bad clothes-- where's all these Ethics flags whenever those come around? XD But who the hell am I, anyway? Who gives a crap from my opinions? I'm nobody; I'm just some stranger on the internet. So, just because somebody else's mods makes my eyes hurt, doesn't mean that I have any right to say what its owner does to it. It doesn't change the fact that that owner might love that doll within an inch of its life, & might be having a proud moment for finishing that modification. The only thing that would be unethical would be for me to swoop down & tell them they did something wrong.

 

Not the bad behaviour assumption, but instead of looking at it as consumer-bashing, what if it's a reference to cultural differences in collective versus individual freedoms? That's something that does have very deep cultural roots, so it's an interesting question (maybe for a different debate though!).

And really, even beyond a general cultural thing, it's interesting to separate the issue of person vs. social morality too - If I think you've made your doll ugly but feel that it's wrong to hurt your feelings then I won't tell you. But what if I talk about your doll on another board? Or PM another member about it? Or ask a friend to look at over my shoulder? Is it different if it's in a place where you might see it? If "ethics" can be taken as upholding a social agreement, then all of that ties in together.

This is another interesting question - it comes up when artists use religious or historical/cultural icons, and there's always talk about creating offense being part of the artistic intent. I wonder if it changes if it's aimed at the BJD community. The intent could be the same, of course, but the scale would be smaller, and the community isn't unified in the emotional/financial value of any particular doll (although your example is probably as close as it gets!), so I wonder if that would dilute our theoretical artist's message? Or maybe that would be the message? Interesting example!

 

What do you think crosses the line of ethical modding?

Well, I don't really think you can call it 'crossing the line'. I mean, stuff that I think makes no sense may make everyone else happy. We'd had a post about a "robot BJD" a while ago, and I wasn't crazy about that -- then we realized it actually was just a robot. But there are mods I flat out don't like; I remember going to a site yesterday, and seeing a lot of mods that made no sense to me. I really didn't like them, at all. But that's me.

Is there an ethics to it? I can't say. I mean, it's not my doll, it's theirs - plus it is a doll, and not a pet or a kid. If I took my poodle (I don't actually have a poodle) and dyed his hair pink, then we could delve more into ethics, but these are resin dolls, after all -- you could say resin was modded to make the doll in the first place.

And I get tweaking a mold to fit certain standards of a collector -- like a nose is too wide, or too big, or too small. But I also don't really understand taking one doll, and making it totally unrecognizable from it's original mold. For an example, I don't get sanding the bust, with the exception of what I hear about Dollmore Kid nipples being way too 'out there' to seem realistic. If it's a lack of realism that makes you sand the bust and stuff like that, then I get it, otherwise I don't. But no one has yet to explain it to me - if someone does one day, I may change my tune.

But as I said, I think it's really difficult to determine what sort of ethics go into a doll. We can't get into each person's brain to see why they decided to do this or that. And while we try to be as neutral as possible and say to each his own, I think everyone of us has some sort of bias. We may think it terrible to do any type of sanding of a face even if they don't match our expectations just so.

But you can't go calling someone a bad owner because they wanted to tweak a mold a little. It's like ostracizing someone who gets a nose job because we like our noses and would never go under the knife, ourselves. But you do these things because it's natural to be like that sometimes.

I've actually never heard of doing some of the things mentioned to help doll mechanics, but I don't think this totally unethical -- like, if you could do a surgery to help a person see better or at all, would you deny doing it because this isn't how they were born? Or would you do it to help better that person's life in the long run?

I think the only things I'd honestly get out there and condone 'unethical' is outright abuse of the doll - like being super careless, and allowing it to be left in all sorts of very risky situations; or if you treated this doll as simply a means to an end - like a 'product' of sorts. Instead of something to treasure and appreciate, they use it as just a means to get money from others.

(OMG, my post is huge!)

 

I think I would feel a little bad changing the look of the sculpt. >_<;; It feels like going onto a museum and carving on one of the statues. ^^;; I buy a doll because I think it is beautiful, and I respect the artist who makes something that beautiful. To me, that means accepting all parts of the sculpt, even if I wouldn't have made some of those choices if I were sculpting it. (Part of art, for me, is trying to understand the POV of the artist through their stylistic choices, some of which may seem strange at first, but which may reveal new ideas when they are contemplated, and may present new opportunities when you work WITH them instead of opposing them.) It's not my sculpt, it's theirs, even if it's my doll.

But I guess I don't feel the same about helping out the mechanics. Mechanics are less subjective and there's actually sort of a real goal which the artist may or may not be able to meet. This is different from the aesthetic part of the sculpt, which has less of a goal and is mostly dictated by the artist's personal preferences. Sooo it's not so much a jab at the sculptor's personal style to work on the mechanics. It just is kind of helping the body do what it's supposed to, but better.

 

I still stand by the argument that "It's my money, my doll. I'll do what I want" to an extent. I mean, I don't see the point of buying a $1000 doll if you're just going to mod it beyond recognition. I would think that sculptors realize that their dolls don't precisely fit every customer's specific vision.

As to mechanics, I wish I actually were a bit better at sculpting, because I would go to town on improving the joints on my dolls. I don't see anything wrong with this. But in general, I find it hard to apply ethics directly to treatment of a piece of resin.

 

(For all purposes, I'm considering 'doll' to be one of those extremely rare kinds, that they only make so many of...)

I'm not a fan of destroying dolls for art. Sure, art is subjective, but I think common sense would come into play for a super limited edition doll. Yes, modification is a kind of art, but that's not what I'm talking about here.

If someone bought a doll that was very limited (as in only 5 in existence) to smash as a form of artistic expression, I can't stop someone from doing it, but I wouldn't understand why. Especially if the intent was to really destroy it - as in bang it with a sledgehammer until you could almost see it was a doll - then I don't understand why someone would choose a doll so rare in its existence if the point was to not show the beauty of the doll in any way.

As I said, I've seen a lot of art with messages that were just lost on me, though.

 

Yeah, I think it's a little tacky, also. I mean, if I make something, I don't expect my buyers to come to me and say, "I loved your product, but I thought to... instead." I'd take it as a little insulting, that my product wasn't up to my buyer's standards, even if I had their money. I'd feel guilty.

But maybe for doll companies, like others said, they expect modification. Like, Volks sells tools for modification, so they'd be cool with it. I think it depends on your product.

 

I think that, once you have bought a doll, the community has no say it what you are going to do with it or not. Even if it is a one of a kind, very sought-after doll.
And though you might not like it, as an artist you will have to keep in mind that people will not always treat your work the way you want them to. When you (general) sell dolls, you can't force people not to mod them, if you do, you're out of line.

Now personally I would probably crinch if I saw a very limited doll cut up and I certainly wouldn't do it myself, but I wouldn't feel offended because the owner didn't think of me - and how much I wanted that doll - when she modded it.

 

IMO it has got a lot to do with how BJD's are viewed in this community. Even though they are just pieces of resin, prettily shaped though, most people in this forum see them as something more, be it a part of their family, or a friend, as a person with a soul, etc.. So when someone mods a sculpt, or even a LE they (naturally) take offense. As far as it is considered disrespectful to the original sculptor to heavily mod a doll, I don't think that's the case either since they work commercially. As such they"re not much different then, say car designers; they also start with a clay sculpt, refine it and produce it in very large numbers and also release some more limited runs. And the majority of customers who buy them keep them in the same state, but a minority customizes them, sometimes beyond recognition. And some car owners view a particular LE design with the same reverence as some BJD owners view a certain sculpt. As such they're subject to some of the same criticism as the modders over here. It all comes down to a person's opinion and believe based on their own values, that will never change.
For me a BJD is just a pretty piece of resin, whose primary function is interior embellishment in the same way as pvc figures, but they come with the added bonus of being {much} bigger, being able to be customized and modified.

 

And this is entirely why there are some people I won't sell my art to. But I have the luxury of researching potential buyers and if I think they won't appreciate or treat my work with the respect it deserves I won't sell it to them.

Maybe the community has no say in what happens to the doll in question but neither can anyone hold it against the community if they shun the type of owner who would go to some of the described extremes. Modifications are one thing, but outright destruction. . . ? If that sort of person believes it's art then maybe they should sculpt the doll they plan to destroy themselves. Anyone with the money can throw it around and take a sledgehammer to their purchase. There is no talent required. Whereas ethics may not come into play, unless the doll is an antiquity, shallow attention seeking (as the extremes described seem to me) will still provoke disgust in me. But then I'm rather old school about art being more about creation than destruction. Notice I didn't say it had to be beautiful, since I find myself drawn to things others would find ugly.

 

Hey, I'm an American consumer myself, thank you very much. I'm just trying to make the debate interesting (hopefully, without trolling). So tired of the old "How do you tell your parents about your doll?" stuff... Whenever the subject gets a bit controversial, a lot of really intelligent people come out with interesting opinions, making the debate truly a fascinating and educational read.

Back to the debate: I firmly believe in the freedom of the artist, but I also believe in the concept of cultural icons that require preservation and should be off limits. I honestly don't know how to reconcile this.

 

You are right, there are a lot of different ways that people view dolls, and for myself they are more than just pretty chunks of resin. However, I've seen a lot of people treat modding as a bonding experience and as something that allows them to love and enjoy their doll even more (and I would agree with that sentiment). For people whose doll represent characters, modding can be especially important as it allows the doll to look physically closer to the beloved character the owner wishes to portray. One of the big pluses to BJD and one of the things that makes them very personal is the idea that you make your doll your own by making changes. I don't think modding is at all at odds with sentimental feelings towards ones dolls.

A lot of the negative response that I have seen to modding seems to stem from either company loyalty taken too far (it's disrespectful to the artist) which makes no sense since companies expect people to mod their dolls, or because they themselves wanted the particular doll in question and couldn't get one.

A number of company sites have galleries for owners to uploads pics, and I don't think that would be rude at all, as the companies sell customizing supplies, and make dolls with the understanding that they can be modded. It's not like the companies are anti-customization -- they really aren't. People seem to forget sometimes that the companies themselves sell dolls with the intention that they be changed. When it comes to actually makng requests of a company it really depends on how it's handled.

 

Maybe it depends on your product? People do stuff to cars all the time - that's when you get shows like "Pimp My Ride". Something mass-produced probably has a lot less sentimental value to a company than an individual's craft or things not mass-produced.