Petition to get Little Jr. know as a Mini

I am going to wait for the mods decision and then I'll update the mini list accordingly

 

it "making sense" is not fact, it is your opinion. Little Juniors being considered "tinies" does not make sense to us, as they are more like mini's to us... hence this entire discussion.

 

1) I don't think anyone has said they don't want to own a Tiny, if that's what LJs are classed as. I don't think the original owner meant to say "I hate Tinies" more "They aren't proportioned like Tinies."

2) Discussing anything about dolls in this forum can hardly count as 'absurd'. There'd be no one in this thread if it was.

3) Seeing that the LJ boys currently don't fit into the Tiny size range, it doesn't 'make sense' they are labeled as Tinies.

4) There is no 'burning need' here for Little Juniors to be reclassified. However, I bought my LJ boy as a mini (ebay auction) so that's what I classed him as. I didn't think of him in any other way. Many others have posted in the mini section, believing that because the LJs are the middle size of the Custom House range they are MSD-sized, to be told to go to the Tiny section. The boys don't fit into any sub-forum at the moment, due to the gap between sizes and most people would feel better if this was cleared up and there was somewhere definitive to talk about these beautiful dolls.

 

If LJ are classed as Tinies, then it would make sense to close the gap and say that anything 39cm and under is a Tiny. That way, when you get to your 'standard' MSD sized dolls at 40cm you can clearly draw a line and say "These are minis". But then that leads to other debates, such as where is the cut off point between MSD-sized and SD-sized?

 

Re sizes - In the tinies section, one thing everyones does is to help people find clothes and shoes that fit their tiny because they are all different sizes. They do not have the benefit of having just a couple of common clothes sizes (like MSD's have). But Little Junior and Liebchen seem to wear slim mini clothes and all of the information about those clothes is in Minis. Little Juniors have 16cm chests and 16.50 to 17cm hips.

However, that is not true of all tinies above 30cm. 33cm Jr. Leila from Minoruworld (unlimited girl was recently released - not a Little Junior) has a 14.5cm chest and 15.5cm hips. Although her legs are longer than most 28-30cm tinies, her body measurements are much like tinies in that range.

Regarding height, this picture of from Karin Bussman's site may be useful (I don't want to hot link it since it is not mine)
http://www.krbussman.com/Misc/ZionSweetRaeDioneLiebchenShallTtory.jpg

Included in the above picture (l to r) are these dolls (I have added their sizes to my list). I added arrows <--------- below where other discussed dolls would fit.

24cm - LTLine Zion
25cm - old Leeke Sweet v1
28cm - CH Petite Ai
<------------------ MW Jr. Leila 33cm and body girth like Petite AI
35cm - Little Junior (girl size)
<------------------ Narsha same height as 35cm Little Junior
38cm - Liebchen (already considered a mini, and her threads are in minis)
<------------------ 38cm Little Junior boy same height as Leibchen
42cm - Serendipity Shall (very slim mini)
42.5cm - Kid Delf (immature mini)
57cm - CH Soo (sd size)

My point is that 38cm Little Jr. is indeed mini-like except for being 2cm below 40cm. It would not make sense to split him from his 35cm sister who has similar girth. Narsha at 35cm also possibly would fit better in minis resource-wise even though her chest is a bit smaller. But Minoruworld Jr. Leila at 33cm has a much smaller body and is only 33cm tall because of her long legs. I think she belongs in tinies.

I think the split might work best as 40cm+ for minis with listed inclusion of Little Junior, Liebchen, and maybe Narsha. Not a fixed height division since we have no idea what else will come along between 35cm and 40cm.

Carolyn

 

Carolyn.S - You've spent rather a lot of time analysing this and I don't think anyone could have worded it better or more clearly. What you've presented makes more sense than anything yet put forth on this thread. I know I'm biased, but even if I weren't, I couldn't possibly come up with a reasonable objection to your position here. You've certainly removed some of the more emotional aspects of this discussion with a logical solution. Hopefully, having read this, there will be enough agreement to finally make a decision on how this forum will place Little Juniors, Liebchin, Narsha and similar dolls.

 

Carolyn.S's points are hard fact... Probably the least biased comment placed so far... Definite food for thought, which ever way the axe falls.

 

I think Carolyn is right that it shouldnt be based on height completely. The 35-40 area is really split. To me Little Jrs seem more like minis in proportions but then they are smaller than minis. Narsha seems too childlike to be a mini but maybe she is.

And no one has mentioned, but where does the Classic Ai fit?
Her measurements are
Height 36
Chest 17.5
Hip 20.5
Foot 5.5
Her measurements are close to minis or even SD's, but shes only 1 cm bigger than the current division of tinies. Her discussion thread was in the mini section, but she just doesnt look like a mini.

Customhouse really needs standard sizes...

 

I think that the variety in size is quite nice Plus, wasn't Customhouse the second company to produce resin BJDs? So wouldn't it be kind of like saying "I wish VOLKS provided sizes to match SOOM"?

 

Wow Lopmon - Yes, there are actually 2 AI's between Little Junior and Petite AI that are quite large but do not look like minis.

Classic AI (the girl I saw sold out there) is listed as 37-38cm tall and has very large measurements (like 18cm waist that is larger than her chest, 20.5 hips, with 20cm eyes and an 8-9 wig size!). She is actually a scaled up Petite AI in every way and has a nude photo next to a nude identical but much smaller Petite AI.
http://www.ainai.com/renew/en/product/01.php?code=15&subcode=0000

Vintage AI is 35cm and from the measurements she seems to use the same body as the Little Junior Female but their heads are very unusual.
http://www.ainai.com/renew/en/product/01.php?code=14&subcode=0000

Carolyn

 

It's hard to divide dolls into groups and height alone. Carolyn's analysis is very good! I certainly class my Narsha boy and girl with my MSD's. Until fairly recently, the MSD size range was more childlike. The mature mini's have multipied recently, but are not the only dolls in this group!

 

I had one of the Classic AIs because she was so adorable looking but she just wasn't the right fit. Proportion wise, she could fit in a volks family (sort of). I honestly wouldnt know where to put her in the sizing. Adorable doll though.

 

And that is what it is, a discussion. It's really a drag that the originator of this thread can't seem to bear anyone who dissents from her/his opinion, but that is what a discussion thread is for, my opinion as well as yours.
As for the "opinion" that there is no meaningful place to discuss your doll, I disagree as I have had many discussions about mine, which include LJr, Narsha and Liebchen, in thier appropriate sections.
Of course I will abdie with anything the moderators decide, but just as you are allowed to talk about your bright ideas, so am I.

 

um, I'm not the OP. I am her roommate, but we're not the same person. but in any case, I find this to be much more of a personal attack than opinion regarding the topic. I said that "it making sense" wasn't fact but your opinion because you have been coming off to me as if you are saying your opinions are stone-cold fact. anyway, I will no longer talk about this to you unless you really want to catfight through PMs, as that's what you seem to want to do here rather than come to a conclusion.

back on topic now. I agree with what Carolyn.S has said about not splitting Little Jr betwen the minis (males) and tinies (female). if raising the tinies limit to 40cm and including both genders of LJ into tinies, that makes sense. however, I'm sort of somewhat concerned about the huge amount of tinies that there already are. the tinies sizes now span at least 30cm, while the minis are stuck between around 10cm allowance. it also makes some sense to me that 30cm and below be "tiny" and 31cm to 50cm be "mini", just to make it somewhat even and prevent over-cluttering of any respective forum. (51cm[?] and up are then obviously "large".)

 

33cm Minoruworld Jr. Leila cannot benefit from being in minis. Her body is the size of many 28-30cm tinies. And I don't know if the two unusual AI types I linked to above should be automatically classed with minis.

My suggestion was that the low end of minis be 40cm with a listed special inclusion of Little Junior (male and female), Leibchen (35cm but always considered a mini), maybe Narsha. The unusual AI's would be a judgment call by the mods.

If there was a division by size I think it should be 35cm and up (though you may end up with some unusual doll like Vintage and Classic AI's, and unknown future non-minilike dolls).

My preference would probably be either 40cm cutoff plus special cases as the mods decide, or a general 35cm and up mini-like dolls.

Carolyn

 

a general 35cm and up might be easier than trying to include specific dolls with 40cm and up, as some may be missed. I think, so that this kind of thing doesn't happen again, we should refer to 35-40cm as "petite minis" (not neccessarily giving them their own forum or even subforum). this way, there won't be any kind of "but Leila (example) is more like a MINI than a TINY" again. :X it will be understood that 35-40cm minis are the low end of the mini spectrum, hence "petite minis".

how does that sound to everyone? mods?