Resale Overprice (foreal)

I'm currently selling a Dollfie Dream Rei Ayanami Maid Limited on layaway. I'm selling her for what i paid $600. I would never make another person pay more then i did for an item. But that is just "ME".

 

I agree with others mostly who say if you can sell something, no matter what the price, then its fair. I've seen certain "overpriced" LE dolls/heads sit a really long time in the marketplace (one for almost a year now) so if its really not worth the price it wont sell (the item has since been marked down a couple times from what the owner wanted). Although the term "overpriced" is really subjective, because even if someone would be willing to pay 2 grand for a dollshe that doesn't mean that they don't think its overpriced it just means they want it really badly. Honestly I would love a dollshe and would pay 2 grand for one (if I had it), but would I be a bit sore about it? Pretty much. But when it comes down to it you really cant let it get to you cause its just the market of supply and demand. Especially auctions thats the whole point, getting as much as you can for an item that's in demand.

The only case where I've seen/it was pointed out to me, where it looked like an item could be unfairly "overpriced" was when 2 LE editions came out (spaced out from each other), each with very very similar (if not identical parts) and just because the part which was being sold came with the new LE (again identical parts) its price soared wayyy higher. A few sold like that until I guess people realized and stop buying because others like it had to decrease their prices to that of the old LE.

edit-- forgot to add, While I personally wouldnt buy an LE just to jack up the price if someone did end up buying the inflated price I dont think its wrong of them to turn around and sell it for that much. People usually state in the thread if the price that they are selling it for is what they paid or not.

 

As others have said, dolls are a luxury item and the market value is set at what consumers are willing to pay. It's as simple as that... if no one is willing to pay an inflated price, the doll won't sell until the price is reduced.

I haven't sold a doll at a higher price than I paid, but the dolls I've sold were standards, not limiteds. The one discontinued head I sold was put up for auction and still sold at a very reasonable price. (No more than a standard head from the same company would have).

If I ever had to sell my Beryl, I'd likely just put her up for auction and let the market decide the value.

On scalping... while I personally find it distasteful to buy a number of limited dolls just to flip them soon after at a large profit, it's not technically "illegal".

 

Yes, you're right--it's not a good comparison. Luxury items and actual necessities are two very different things. People should have the right to the things necessary to sustain a healthy life, people should not automatically have the right to all the luxury items they want. It's two completely different things, so why bring it in to the discussion?

People can be annoyed by prices or frustrated--we feel what we feel. However, it is possible to be frustrated but still recognize that the basic situation isn't actually unfair. In a hobby that involves collecting supply and demand will always come into play--and you know what? If I had a rare LE that I decided to sell and the going rate for said LE was much higher than the price I bought him for, then yes you better believe I'd price somewhere closer to the going rate than the original price--that's not scalping, that's what those dolls happen to be worth at the present time. If you want to talk about fair and unfair, how is it fair to expect the sellers to not charge the going rate?

Also, there is a lot of talk about the motivations of the seller--did they love the doll but have to sell it? Bonding issues? Or purely profit motivated? More than one of the above? Well, honestly it doesn't matter. Unless you personally know the seller, you don't know what exactly is going through their heads and it's beside the point anyway. You the buyer control how much money you're willing to fork over. If you feel ripped off, then don't pay the price and hope the doll will come up later for less. If the seller really was overcharging, then you may very well find a better deal if you're patient. However, the going rate for certain dolls is high, and you might not be able to find the kind of deal you're looking for. Before buying LEs on the secondary market, people really need to do their research--that's what will tell you if you're getting a good or bad deal (or if the price is average).

What is annoying people in this thread is the fact that that when some people want a doll that costs more than they can afford, they start complaining about how unfair it is despite the fact that fair or unfair really doesn't enter into the picture. It's an expensive hobby, it's still accessible to people on a budget, but there will always be dolls that will be hard to get or difficult to afford. Most other hobbies are the same way, and it's really not the end of the world.

 

I can't say I appreciated shelling out so much for the two limiteds I have but I wanted them, so I bought them. I don't think I'll resell either (as I'm so in love with them I "overpaid") but if I did I suppose I'd ask what I paid. That perpetuates the "scalping" I suppose. This hobby isn't about collecting limiteds or making money for me, I just happen to fall for limited molds at times, which is unfortunate. A doll that was $500 from company, if I paid $900 because of it's rarity, I wouldn't sell it for $1200 just because that's the going rate. I certainly understand why sellers might and that's fair, I'm just interested in my money back and not turning a profit.

For normal dolls, I always find it odd sellers will charge more because the doll has a faceup or a tattoos or something. That was the original owner's choice and usually such modification would decrease the value. I personally wouldn't feel right about doing so and wouldn't pay more for a mold just because it's customized. It's not in my best interest, I'd end up customizing the doll myself in the end.

 

Taco said it very, very well. :] I agree.

 

I can't blame people that need the money and sell a doll for a price mark up. If one day I am desperate for cash and need it badly, I would try to get the most cash out of my dolls. However, some people use community forums, such as DOA, with the sole purpose of selling dolls that were originally bought to flip. I have issues with that. I feel if they want to use an online medium to ran businesses like that, they should probably use ebay, which charges for that.

For those of you who expect LE's to be sold at original price: I think a lot of you wait to see if the doll is going to become popular or not. If they do, then you want to buy them? There will always be LE dolls, wait until you are find a doll that matches your character. If you cant afford an expensive doll, or is against paying too much for a doll, go for the doll that best suits the character.

~Gus

 

I agree with this, especially given the level of customization and originality in this hobby. If someone wants to pay $100 + for a faceup, they certainly are welcome to do so, but I'm not sure why they try to recoup that when they resell. Unless someone is buying a head/doll specifically for that artist's faceup, it's just going to get wiped anyway.

 

Sometimes the face-up is absolutely drop-dead gorgeous, though, and is part of the value of the doll. Sometimes you want the doll because of the face-up. For example, I never really wanted a Goldie until I saw one with this beautiful, flawless face-up. I bought her for much more than I would pay for any other Goldie, and I have never regretted the purchase.

If I ever wanted a blank doll, I'd buy it from the company -- I'd wouldn't buy a painted doll second-hand with the intention of wiping the face-up. The main reason I shop second-hand is to see if there are any dolls out there that already have great face-ups. I'm willing to pay extra for that, so of course sellers will charge extra for that. Of course, I would only pay more for dolls with good face-ups. I would pay less for a doll with a poorly executed face-up.

 

I figure companies charge for faceups, so there's no reason I shouldn't also charge for the high-quality faceup I shelled out money for, especially if it's nearly new, completely undamaged, and will be good for years. It was part of the cost of the doll, in the end. My presumption is that someone may not want to wipe that faceup. And honestly, if they do want a blank head they can either order one from the company, find another seller with a blank head, or suck it up and pay for a faceup they're going to wipe.

 

Because having a high quality faceup or mods will naturally impact the value of the doll, and why shouldn't it? You're paying for that artist's skill--some people send out their dolls to have work done on them anyway, this way they're getting what they want upfront. Not everyone wants to do/can do all the work themselves, hence all the artists who take commissions.

I've bought dolls off the marketplace rather than getting them new from the company because they had beautiful custom faceups. I enjoy doing faceups, and for some of my characters it's better if I do them myself, but occasionally it's nice to have a faceup of a higher quality than I can do myself.

 

... And some faceups are worth more than the head they're painted on.

 

In all honesty I think it's cheating to overprice things just because you can. The example that comes to my mind real fast is Kurumi/Miruku from Volks. For example sake I'll use the most recent release of her at Dolpa 20. Her price with tax was 87,150 yen which roughly equals around $880-$890 plus the shipping cost. Now I've seen her on sale here in the marketplace, on ebay, and YJ for double or even double and a half (YJ I found a Miruku for 198000 yen). That's just sad in my eyes. It didn't cost that much to get and to charge over $2000 for her is taking advantage in my eyes. Sure the argument of "she was limited from Volks and you didn't get her so I can charge what I want" can come up, but is it right in my eyes? Heck no. Recover your costs and maybe a tiny bit extra (like no more than $100), but doubling the price is just wrong.

 

It's fine if people will pay that price for what they want. This kinda comes off as a thread that is in response to not being able to find something within one's own price range, and being upset about it.

It's fine as long as it's the going price. If there are only 2 dolls in the world of a specific mold that are being highly sought after the one for sale will go to the highest bidder on the second hand, and that price probably won't be anywhere near retail. However, you can guarantee that something like a RS Mei or CP El going for auction won't get much higher than the retail unless it's something so freaking awesome that surpasses anything ever created out of either of those sculpts.

People are only going to pay what they want to pay. There's little to no gouging going on, imo. People will pay what they're willing to pay for the dolls they want. Those with patience to wait for their higher price tagged item to move will do so. When their price becomes synonymous with supply vs demand theirs too will move.

 

I think the question that comes up though, is what is overpriced and what is just the going rate. I'm going to speak generally here, rather than about your specific example. It's more your first sentence "it's cheating to overprice things just because you can" and your last about recovering costs and charging a "tiny bit extra" that got me, because sometimes raising the price more than $100 isn't actually overpricing.

There are certainly some people that can price things higher than they should, but then again they aren't holding a gun to anyone's head forcing them to buy and if nobody is willing to nab the doll for that price, the seller will be forced to lower the price. They are within their rights to charge whatever they want, but they aren't guaranteed a sale for that much. If the doll is worth X amount, then it's not cheating to want somewhere in the neighborhood of X amount--and it's really the buyers who decide what things are worth rather than the sellers.

I love this hobby and the community, but at the same time while I don't want to be ripped off, I don't expect people to always sacrifice their doll sale profits for the sake of their fellow hobbyists either. The amounts of acceptable profit that people try to assign are really very arbitrary, and I think that it's unfair to expect sellers to always keep the cost down close to what the original price was even though the dolls maybe worth far more. I understand why scalpers frustrate a lot of people, but that doesn't mean that everyone should charge as little as possible.

 

I an tossing in my 2 cents here..

First I see issues with "SOME" of it. Its one thing when its a doll thats an LE and been long gone. its another thing when its the the crazy stuff thats been going on with the Soom Monthly dolls. People are just buying them to turn around and resell them once they are here and in some cases try selling them before they ever arrive!!! I have issues with whats going on with them because over time it really will HURT our hobby as a whole even if you dont see it now. Yeah these are "limiteds" BUT when a TON are ordered and even OVER ORDERED like some have been and the Market is over whelmed with them whats the point in having them be limited?

I have seen some OUTRAGEOUSLY priced SMD out there. I saw a Berly for $3000!! Thats almost 3 time the price she went for on the site..That is overpricing I dont care how you look at it. I knwo many of you will say the hallmark reply to that of "if someone is willing to pay it them" The issue with it is the long term affect it will have on the hobby. Just like the housing Boom here in the USA. Homes were selling for quite the premium for about 3 to 5 years depending on where you lived. NOW they can barely give them away and people are really hurting over it and losing their shirts. If the person who bought that Beryl for $3K tried to resell it do you think they would really ever get that much? No they wont...they will loss money and in turn not put that money back into the hobby and may all together leave the hobby due to the loss of that much capital.

Thats just one example.. it happens alot and I have spoken to a lot of people who for lack of a better way to put it just dont know any better. The join the site.. look around find a doll that they LOVE and want and buy one in the Market place thinking that we all have each others best interests in mind only to find out that they have been WAY over charged. NOT everyone is Computer savy much less is well this will sound RUDE but Smart enough to be able to find where all of our dolls come from.

I truly belive that there is a line thats crossed too far .. and its crossed far too offten. I think its one thing if your items / doll is put up for Auction and it goes for what ever amount you sell it for becasue someone is just willing to offer that much. But when people just list a doll at an exessive amount I have issues with it. I have issues with all the people who bought the Heliots and are flooding the Market place with them because they never planned on keeping them to begin with and are now asking $1500++ for their full sets that sold on Soom for around the $1100 mark give or take. Its just greedy...People asking $1200 to $1600 for blank and Nude monthly dolls just because is well just rude.. These people are only out to make a buck and are not adding to our community just taking advantage of it..

I am sorry if any of that was rude I just think that whats been going on is criminal to say the least. We ALL should have more respect not only for each other but for our dolls and our hobby as a whole.. WE set the standards for our community and by doing what has been going on we are just welcoming Scammers and creeps to come and take advantage of us.

Amd for the people who dont think that this is a Moral issue.. I hope that you never buy a home or a car in your life and are taken advantage of.. I am sure that you will change your song then. For some people these dolls are the nicest and most expensive "items" that they will ever own. I have a friend here in the area who is in her 60's and loves BJD.. Shes not the most tech savy but does the best she can. She does not own a computer but does go to the local library to use one so she can get on DOA after I showed her how. Shes never owned a home or a car because she never could afford one. She grew up very poor and has worked very hard her whole life. Shes not done bad for someone who dropped out of school in the 5th grade because her mother fell ill and she needed to work to help with the family and her brothers and sisters. She saves every extra penny she can to buy BJD's and the nice things that go with them. They make her happy and smile the bring light to her life. They really are the most high end thing shes ever owned.. If someone was to over price her on a doll because they want to do you really think thats very fair? Do you really think its ethical to charge someone more because they dont know any better?

Its wrong and you all know its wrong...

tell your selves what ever pretty lies you want to make your selves sleep better at night but you are only hurting all of us including your selves int he long run if you care anything for the hobby..

 

Just a quick note, a fullset Heliot with sanding, shipped to the US? $1483.30, to the penny. I don't disagree with the thrust of what you're saying here, but some of the computer savvy needs to be applied on the research angle, too, before generalizations are made about what things must have cost the original buyer. (And no, I'm not selling mine nor do I plan to at any point.) Even knocking off the shipping on that order, it was over $1400. $1500? With sanding? It'd definitely be a markup, but of less than $100. Whether that's an amount someone could live with or not is up to them -- I personally wouldn't be thrilled with it and would look for a better deal myself, but it is more palatable (to me personally) than a markup of $300 would be.

 

A general question to those in favor of factoring in faceup costs. Not meant to be snippy, just curious.

If a faceupped head/doll had been on the market for some time (4-5 months, minimum) and someone contacted you wishing to buy the head at a lower price (lower than the cost of whatever the faceup was) because they were just going to wipe it anyway, would you consider this? Or would you continue to wait in hopes of regrouping the investment on the faceup?

Apologies if this strays too far off-topic.

 

It's not that hard to research doll prices. I just go to the original site when I see a doll I'm interested in on the Marketplace. I figure from the blank price to decide what I want to pay, because face-ups are ephemeral and I can do my own. Now if you can't, then that pricey face-up might be a selling point, but it's not for me. I factor in the new price and condition of the doll and know what I am willing to pay. Anyone who can't do a minimum of research before buying something as expensive as a BJD deserves what happens to them-it's the same as any other pricey purchase.

The Soom MDs are a limited commodity, and as far as I'm concerned, the market corrects itself with them. Some are more popular than others. There have been a lot of Heliots flipped, but I'm not sure that that's so much speculators as folks who ended up just not liking the doll for some reason. I kind of enjoy watching the feeding frenzy when an MD comes out, all the splits and haggling so that everyone gets the bits they want. It seems very even-handed to me. As far as price goes-if someone wants to charge $300.00 + profit for their MD fullset that they just bought, that's their business. They came up with the money at the time and took the trouble to buy the doll. If you didn't have the money at the time, and the second-hand market is the only way you can get the doll, you have to decide for yourself if that extra money you have to pay is worth it. If it's not, then no one is forcing you to buy the doll. It's that simple. I think Sard is beautiful. One occasionally comes up at auction, but he always goes for more than I can afford. But that's OK. There's no law that says someone has to sell him to me at what I'm willing/able to pay. If I ever decide a Sard (or an old variety Saint) is beautiful enough that I absolutely have to have one, I'll find a way to come up with the money.

The things that irritate me about the Marketplace aren't the limited dolls, but the folks who price their non-limited dolls, particularly when they're the second or third owner, at full new price or better because they're determined to get back every penny of what they originally spent, even though the exchange rate has changed and new dolls cost less. They often also want to get every penny back of what they spent on the face-up as well, even though it might not be pristine any more and I might not care for the style and would end up just wiping it. But that being said, even though it irritates me, I'm not going to try to force people to price dolls the way I think they should be priced. I simply walk away. If they're content to keep bumping their doll for six months to try to get that price, more power to them. If they really want/need to move the doll, they'll drop the price until it reaches something the market will bear.

 

I agree with you mate. I mean it depens on the purpose of ur doll. If u bought it to make profit out of it, then fair enough, but that depends on how fine ur work as an artist is, the clothes, the detail. But if it is an old doll, pretty beaten up, and u want to seel it for triple the price, then no way!

I saw something like that on ebay once, they posted a very nice photo of the doll, and then when i went to see it before buying it, her face was all stained with wine! they had tried shifting the stains,etc. But i was lucky i surprised them with a visit, otherwise i would have paid a fortune for false advertisement.