Social Status

I totally agree with everything April just said.

Money comes and money goes, but we can all choose to be happy and accepting of others every single day.

 

"Bury-your-head-in-the-sand" is not what I am talking about. Making-mountains-out-of-mole-hills is closer to what my post was about. A few isolated remarks from a hand full of owners does not warrant the dredging up of the "elite" discussion. Also, owners who keep their dolls in boxes should be spared from such labels (OP). There are a many reasons why someone might want to keep a doll in a box etc...

I am truly sorry you had such a bad experience with another owner. But I need to ask, is it really so shocking that the other owner would be amazed that you would put your doll in water? I think it is really cool by the way, but some people are just scared to take any chances. While I agree that the "nothing compares to Volks" comment is uncouth and tactless, still I don't know if those words are proof of an existing "Social Status" in the community as a whole. The other owner just sounds like a person who is VERY rough around the edges and naturally it would bother you that she spoke that way! But does this incident demonstrate "Social Status"??? Not in my eyes.

Finally, I don't know if it always helps us to talk about this subject because people start to believe there exists a big problem because of stories like your own (calling out the brand name). That just furthers the unproven "Volks owners are elite" myth and I don't see that as helpful. I have even seen new comers posting in other threads "I had no idea I would be looked down on I am sad now yadda yadda" as a result of an owner sharing a one sided story about a very negative encounter. Not helpful But maybe I am tainted as I own 4 Volks Limited dolls and honestly, I am really done with reading examples of bad Volks owners. It just gets old for me because I own those dolls and I really enjoy them so very much. I also LOVE going to meet-ups and seeing all the other dolls and truly, I spend zero minutes thinking about social status and elitism when I am permitted to play with the dolls (non Volks and Volks) of other owners.

To April
Yes. I feel very much Like you do.

 

Now, you've peaked my interest. I don't know if I've ever seen a woosoo.

 

I think you make a good point here, Isenn. This is a risk, and it's something I've seen many times when topics like elitism or social status or whatever are discussed. It's just a fact that negative stories tend to stick to people better than positive ones. No matter how often people on this board say that meetups are fun and that 99% procent of the hobbyists are nice, that one post about a negative encounter is usually causing a lot of disturbance.

It reminds me of No-Face in Spirited Away. By feeding on the emotions around him he becomes bigger and bigger, until he has become this large, sinister and violent monster who eats other people. And yet, if you keep him away from greed (or paranoia in this case), he is a harmless creature.

I wonder, if we would just ignore talk of elitism and our own paranoia, if this elitism would just vanish like a ghost.

 

I see your point, but I really doubt it would just vanish. The truth is, there are elitists out there. Not just Volks elitists either. I've encountered people who actually look down on me for owning a Volks, because they assume that paying a lot for something = snob. Its like PC vs MAC. There are people to whom it is serious business and others who just want to use their computer. As long as there are people who are going around snubbing their noses at other dolls, there is going to be the elitism, whether it is talked about or not. And that can in some ways make it all the more shocking when it is encountered, and then you're going to want to tell someone about it so there really is no way to stop talking about it until people stop being snobs about who's got better stuff.

 

Okay, not vanish perhaps, but it would get a lot smaller. Point is that snobs will not stop being snobs, no matter how often you talk about it. And personally belief that all this fear of elitism is making the subject a lot bigger than it actually is. Sure there are elistists, but sometimes I also wonder if elistist behaviour comes from paranoia that someone might be snobby towards them (and so they hit first).

Instead of focusing on the snobs and our own victimized position, we could also focus on the angels and how well they treat us. Then, there wouldn't be a negative self-fullfilling prophecy, but a positive one. (don't you think that spending time with nice people is a better way to enjoy the hobby than to stare yourself blind on the possibility that someone at some point might say something mean to you?)

 

As much as I agree with the point, I think the PC/Mac thing isn't the best example. That's something you're going to encounter, full stop. You may or may not run into dolly elitism. (I say this as a life long, non-evangelical-just-let-me-work-in-peace mac user who has had to tell people who think they are funny, or plain ol' fashioned idiots who can't keep their opinions to themselves when they find this out, to STFU at least twice a week. Way different levels of prevalence. )

 

This is true, but so so far I've encountered two elitists (one from the local community and one over the internet) who were unpleasent and had to rub it in that they found this or that beneath their level. That's 2 out of over ten thousand of active DoA members plus the number of doll owners I know locally. It's not like there is an elitist lurking around every courner and I think most of the fear people have is based on the idea of elitists rather than on actual encounters with them.

 

I think people just like to pick at their psychic scabs.

 

Love the way you put that.

 

This.

People assume that it must be widespread -- so to back up the belief that it is as widespread as all the endless, endless talk about elitists makes some people think it is, we end up with 'this happened, is this an elitist?' or 'somebody said that, is that an elitist'? because there's this misbegotten notion that they're lurking around every single corner and waiting to pounce. This pattern isn't too different from the 'is this a terrorist?!' paranoia.

 

A lot of what doll owners do is being seen as 'elitist'. So I don't like limiteds; I don't think they're worth it. Who am I to tell someone to not like limiteds? I don't. I'm not rallying against those who do, and I'm not going to troll users who do, either.

A lot of opinion threads tend to have this kind of battle going on. Maybe the majority likes something the minority doesn't? It doesn't mean we are somehow ganging up on those who disagree. Sometimes on DoA, it's "dangerous" to state your opinion, because someone is going to pop up and say "ELITIST!" - and that's not fair. And then we have to go on and on about how we're not elitists, and having to justify ourselves to no avail. It's called being different, an it's perfectly ok.

Maybe it's someone's last attempt to draw attention to themselves, or something? We'll never know. We can only ignore them.

 

My opinion is the brand or price don't matter. When 'chosing' (falling in love with) a doll, I don't care about the size or price. I own a Dollzone Orlando and a Dollfie Dreams Yukino. And a peaks woods Yeru on layaway.

This is a hobby based on taste, I don't think anyone is in the position of criticizing someone elses taste. Personally I don't really like fullsets. Because of the endless possibilities I don't want to limit myself. I try do everything myself, face up, clothing, settings, I even started making my own wigs.

The strangest thing ever happened was on a convention: I was called a show off because of carrying around a 1/3 it was said by a girl carrying a basket with about 7 tinies....I'll never understand that.

 

I think we do create social status among ourselves, even if it's unintentional. Sometimes it isn't someone lording something over someone else, but someone simply being jealous that they couldn't afford a specific doll or sculpt.
Just look at this forum. Dolly Debate is filled with topics titled "Is this bad/ok?" People either looking for acceptance, attempting to look down on other owners, or even just to get a better understanding of the social interactions they have themselves observed, on a wide range of topics that are almost ridiculous to ask about how other people treat, name or dress their inanimate property.

 

I don't know if the type of brand of doll shows your social status necessarily. For an example, a wealthy person can choose to buy a cheaper, in terms of $$$, doll like bobobie over a more expensive doll. Some wealthy people choose not fo flaunt their wealth or choose to spend their money elsewhere than dolls. Whereas someone from lower middle class might be saving their money forever and decided to get an expensive doll. Some people might even pretend to come from wealthy class and etc. There's many variations and not one person is alike.

 

if you talk about dolls you can talk about other things as well as cellphones, cars, etc..
Brands and prices are all social status. If you have money you have it !

 

So I just read this entire thread and I have to say I really agree with some of you on both sides.

I have been a doll enthusiast for about 10 years now, but until recently had no dolls of my own as I was busy saving money for bills and the like. I have recently brought home my first doll (I did many years of research) and I chose to save for a Resinsoul. I could have saved for a Volks but honestly I don't like their faces. In fact most of my tastes run counter to the common but I realize and appreciate that about everyone!

I've been on both sides of the money fence in the US and there is a definite money snobbery floating around. I get the feeling that the OP was referencing a person saying "well I Haven't even shown most of My dolls yet!" Almost as if everyone else's 1-3 dolls was a lower number/lower status. We could break that one statement down but I'd like to offer you my experience.

I live in Seattle, and Seattle is well known for it's snobbery on a lot of levels. I even know a multi-millionaire who wants people to think she's broke and starving so that people don't think she married for money (which she did) But that's OT.
I went to my first Meet-up recently, as I have spent most of my life admiring dolls from a distance and (almost like a woman who decided to have children later in life) loved them when I got the chance to see/touch them but always handed them back to their mommy. (I've worked on many bits of clothing/furniture/accessories and non-bjd face-ups and mods) Well At this first meet-up as I was talking to a few people (as people were leaving) about the furniture I make and noticed a doll fell on her side as a woman sat down next to her. Well she gingerly picked her up with careful hands and turned her. When she saw it was an old sculpt Bobobie she said "oh it's just a Bobobie" and THREW the doll several feet over and to the ground! I immediately excused myself from the conversation I was having and picked the doll up off the floor and gingerly lay her on the sofa and brushed her hair out of her eyes. The whole time the other woman made a lot of snorting sounds and scoffed at me. I glared at her and said "this is someone's doll, maybe not yours and maybe not expensive, but SOMEONE loves her!" The woman mumbled a curse and walked away.

I don't care for snobbery, but I do care for dolls and the love people have for them. Whether you have one Resinsoul or 30 Volks, I will try to be your friend. But as soon as you disrespect someone or their property through whatever means, I will most likely never speak to you again.

Respect is so important! People need to understand that and get over their hate.

 

I need to ask you... what is this post trying to say?

I am sorry but I have never seen anyone act like that in the doll community. This would be a pretty rare person with no manners at all. This does not prove to me that there exists some status ladder in the hobby today. Stories like this just make people angry and honestly you are adding the the "hate" by sharing such an inflammatory post.

Having a Bobbie doll in your possession makes me suspect that you came here to start something negative to gratify yourself. Accusing people of "Hate" is a strong accusation and really you have not proven that this community is riddled with haters by posting a one sided story. Take you own advice about making peace with others.

 

Yes I see your point! This is a discussion. However, I dislike shared stories that make people feel ever worse and reinforce the idea that this community has such nasty nasty people. It doesn't solve a thing. But that is only my opinion.