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Touchy subject- (undesired) Association with "Furry" fetish

May 14, 2010

    1. ( ATTN: If you don't know what "Furry fetish" or "Yiff" is, you should probably avoid this thread. If this gets into a heated debate or becomes too touchy of a subject, I hope the Mods will move it or lock it, but I do not intend for this to be a Debate thread and I think we can discuss this in a rational manner.
      If you have dolls that are Anthro because you are a fan of, or use them for, "erotic furry art" or "Furry Fetish" expression, then this isn't the thread for you, and discussions in favor of or about such activities are probably better off on controversial doll forums.)

      I'd like to discuss Unwanted Association with Furry fetishism.
      A lot of people may not understand that one can like Anthro or animal featured dolls without necessarily enjoying them as part of some kind of sexual fetish interest. I think that may be one reason many Anthro dolls are made very chubby and childlike, or dressed like children by the people who own them: to emphasize an innocence and childlike quality about them.

      Has anyone ever accused you of liking or participating in Furry fetishism for having Anthro type dolls? (If you do like or participate in Furry fetishism in the privacy of your personal life, PLEASE keep it to yourself, that's not what's being asked here.)

      How do you respond to that kind of assumption if it comes up?

      Do you think that kind of assumption is more likely if anthro dolls were sculpted or dressed more maturely?
       
    2. 1. No one has ever accused me of Furry fetishism for having anthro dolls. I have just two and never once has someone asked me if I like Furry fetishes in regards to them.

      2. If it comes up I just brush it off. It's a doll and it's not even anatomically correct, like some of the other dolls. It wouldn't bother me since it seems like it's a very odd assumption, just my opinion though.

      3. If they were anatomically correct, I would expect it would come up more often. But I feel most collectors prefer a younger looking doll for anthros anyways so the likely hood of companies deciding to all of a sudden make all of their anthros more grown up is pretty slim.

      There's a lot more to being Furry than just the whole fetish thing, which is really blown out of proportion. The majority of the fandom is more into the art aspect, or costuming, rather than just the sexual fetish.
       
    3. I agree with Tashlan, Especially number three. I'm sculpting some 60cm Antros myself because I love them so much, but I do not plan on making them anatomically at this time. I love the child like quality of them.
       
    4. Has anyone ever accused you of liking or participating in Furry fetishism for having Anthro type dolls?
      I'm called a "Furry" constantly online, but the term "furry" is insanely broad now, it can mean whatever you want it to mean. Most "furries" are simply people who like furry creatures, furry fandoms, or mainly SONIC THE HEDGEHOG. Yah, Sonic pretty much started the whole "furry" thing, because of his popularity, most people created Sonicverse persona's, which hence spiraled into the whole "furry fandom". I've been a Sonic fan since I was little, and I have dozens of anthro characters (well over 100 at last count. I use them in my fiction, roleplays, and artwork. I'm not into the "Furry Fetish" the way you describe it in the least, I just like having my anthro characters to write and draw. So having anthro dolls really wasn't a big deal for me. I got bigger reactions when I starting collecting Pullips because they're HUMAN. So when I got into Pet Ari's, the general reaction was "Now that's more like you!" And my friends just laughed when I modeled my Devil Bobo's after 2 of my RP characters, Ritz & Blitz.

      How do you respond to that kind of assumption if it comes up?
      Laugh mainly. Online, I just find it funny and pretty much ignore such accusations. In the "real world", no one I know really knows or understands what a "furry" even IS. I'm just accused of having the largest toy store in my town because I have so many toys! XD; So bringing more toy home doesn't get a reaction out of people... until I tell them thew cost. :P

      Do you think that kind of assumption is more likely if anthro dolls were sculpted or dressed more maturely?
      Uhm... again personally, no real reactions, I mean I have plenty of plushies that are dressed up (Scrooge McDuck or Amy Rose, for instance), and most people who see my room just associate any of the toys with a cartoon or video game. Though on a general scale, I think if someones going to scream "furry", they're going to scream it no matter what the doll is or how the doll is dressed.
       
    5. I could pretty much quote the entirety of Tilas' post to explain my own view on the whole thing.

      Although, I know full well that I'm an oddball in that I'm delighted with the sudden advent of mature furry/anthro dolls, both by Pipos, DollFactory and the (FINALLY!!!) MSD-sized anthro face-plates designed for Fairyland's ChicLine.

      Although I don't at all feel that I have the fetish of this kind of thing, I've always been in love with the concept of anthro characters from many series and have been generally disappointing with how BJD creators treat them as baby-like and, dare I say, "chibi." This is the entire reason why I have yet to purchase an anthro BJD, but have kind of broke that with my upcoming Soom Appini.

      I'm currently working on a story where all of the characters are anthros, and adult anthros at that. The main characters, whom I am dolling in human form for the severe lack of adult and mature bodied options (again, thank you Fairyland for fixing that!). What it boils down to is that no matter what I nor anyone else does with these kinds of characters, someone will be mindlessly screaming "Furry!" in the background. It doesn't matter that it's not sexualized, it just crosses into uncanny lines for some people in great extremes, I think.

      Honestly, the association bothers me even less than that of finding BJDs or dolls creepy as a whole. :lol:
       
    6. I think the reason anthro dolls are often child-like is because it's cute! Just the same as many other dolls are child-like. :D

      There are plenty of other fetishes that could be associated with dolls- that's the nature of a fetish, it's sexualizing the mundane. 'Furry' isn't essentially sexual, it seems to be more of a hobby/fandom. That's like saying all Harry Potter fans are pervs because some of them make naughty fan-fiction and fan-art. Even if somebody has created a 'mature' anthro doll in relation to their furry hobby, is it so different from all the yaoi fan-dolls around this forum? Those seem to be well tolerated, so it seems hypocritical to flip out about pervy furries here.

      Personally I'd like to see more mature anthro dolls, because I prefer mature clothes for dolls :D
      And I'm with Ellanie, anybody that finds that creepy is probably not a BJD fan to begin with...
       
    7. I do believe Tashlan has said it all. I love dolls that are anthro, and I dont have any fetish.
       
    8. (try to use the best English possible)
      I'm furry fan and most of my doll collection is anthro. I'm agreed with others people, Furry is not just about naughty sex. My anthro dolls are not used for yiff and friends have always very well accepted the fact I enjoy furries. I have a SD sized "werewolf" and a tiny sized with mature body, and no one found in them anything sexual, including my self. They're dolls after all.

      I think so. Maybe things can change a few if the others companies see the cat-looking Chic line will be sold very well. (it would be great!)
       
    9. Even though I ship certain anthro characters in TV shows if I ever commissioned custom dolls of these characters I certainly wouldn't take adult pictures of them, seems a bit creepy to me.

      I might take romantic photos of them but not adult
       
    10. Hmm. Let's paraphrase the questions.

      Has anyone ever accused you of liking or participating in dolly fetishism for having Asian ball-jointed dolls?
      How do you respond to that kind of assumption if it comes up?
      Do you think that kind of assumption is more likely if Asian ball-jointed dolls were sculpted or dressed more maturely?


      Of course, it's not an exact correlation, and the last paraphrased question doesn't make sense. :sweat But I think there's sufficient similarity between furry fandom and the ABJD hobby as far as stigma and prejudice amongst outsiders is concerned. Sure, corners of both hobbies have yiff/fetish connections, but the vast majority of hobbyists have nothing to do with that, and their enjoyment of both hobbies are purely innocuous. It's just that stigma and shock-value get spread more and stuck in people's heads a lot more than the innocuous things. I guess the problem is that having anthro dolls may compound the accusations twice over, especially if the anthros become more mature. (And we already have them, by way of Elfdoll Catsys, the Iplehouse Noctacarna were-beasts, and the new Pipos R.Pi.)

      On my part, I think a BJD hobbyist's response to furry-fetish accusations would be the same as their responses to doll-fetish accusations - I don't see any significant difference between the two in this regard.
       
    11. There is nothing wrong with Furries
      Hell there is nothing wrong with Yiff either.
      So people hating on a lifestyle is like hating someone for being a race.
      Stupid and rude.

      So now take that to dolls.
      Why would ANYONE ever be rude to another because of the object?
      Human are so silly now-a-days.
       
    12. Umm no no one has ever accused me of that & if they did I would think they were a little off lol
      I have them because they're cute plain and simple And my username while not Furry is from my dogs I call them fuzzy feet because I have long haired chihuahuas and they have really long fur on their feet it's so cute !!
       
    13. I am part of the furry fandom, and plan on getting a few anthro dolls (eventually). However, I appreciate anthro for the art and the familiarity. I grew up on shows like SatAM Sonic, SWAT KATS, Duck Tales, Darkwing Duck, movies like The Lion King, Disney's version of The Jungle Book, The Secret of NIMH, An American Tail, All Dogs Go To Heaven...

      In short, anthro characters and artwork are very familiar to me. I never really saw anything wrong with them moving into 'adult' territory when I matured, although I personally (by far) prefer the cartoony or realistic/fantasy interpretations and simply see no sense in the vast majority of furry fetishism that seems to prevail in the fandom. I have made and gone around in a partial fursuit. It was not in any way sexual to me - I enjoyed making the little kids I saw feel like Disneyland had come to them for a few minutes. So I know and accept the sexual side of the furry fandom, but, well... I see no sense in it, myself.

      I would personally love to buy a 'mature' anthro cat doll. I would dress her up as Bastet, and go to great pains to do the proper research and make her as accurate as I can. Same with a jackal anthro! Bastet and Anubis are two of my favorite deities, and I can't see having a doll of them in any way but with a more 'mature' body.
       
    14. I wanted to quote this since it sounds like you may not understand that it is also possible to be considered as part of the 'furry fandom' without viewing it as a sexual kink, just the same exact way one can enjoy anthro dolls for the sake of simply liking anthro dolls (aka for aesthetic reasons and nothing more). Liking furries and liking anthro BJDs are both entirely different than being into a furry sexual interest.

      Anyway, just wanted to point that out, and now to answer your questions:

      Has anyone ever accused you of liking or participating in Furry fetishism for having Anthro type dolls?

      Not outright about my dolls, however I have had artwork of my doll Fyedka on Deviantart be constantlly mislabled as a furry because he has hooves, horns, cow ears and a tail. About half my dolls have animalistic features, mostly tails, fangs and occasionaly ears (though I usually prefer 'elven' type ears to show their non-humanity) and they too are at times subject to this as well.

      How do you respond to that kind of assumption if it comes up?
      I do admit that I do get a little frustrated since if I wanted to draw or create a furry BJD, then that's what I would do-NOT give animal traits to my otherwise completely human looking characters. However, just because this annoys me, I keep it to myself and while politely correct whoever was misinformed and then move on with life. Getting upset over something so trivial is no reason to completely act out like a child.

      Do you think that kind of assumption is more likely if anthro dolls were sculpted or dressed more maturely?
      No.
       
    15. Being someone who got into BJD's as a direct result from an encounter with an anthro doll, and someone who has been apart of the feared "furry fandom" for years, I'd have to say that it really is blown out of the water. And from what I've seen, there tends to even be a little hostility in the dolly world for new comers who seem to be a little on the furry side. Really it doesn't change anything, because we are the outcasts, and we smile in the face of the mundane. And I've said it before, but I'll say it again, all fandoms have their freaks and weirdos. And naturally, that is what anyone looking in from the outside will notice first. Furries aren't all about yiffing. And even that, is just a display of normal sexuality, just displayed by human shapes with animal faces. That's just the most controversial side. And apparently, the most noticed. A lot of it is spiritual, relating to animal totems, and the like, and a lot of it is love for cartoons, and with that comes the artistic side. And for some it's the appeal of being represented by your favorite animal. Or having the same characteristics as a said animal. To some, everything is just way more cute with ears and a tail. It's really no different than drawing or roleplaying your favorite anime character. To you(general you), Furries may seem odd for drawing animals that walk on two legs, and talk. To furries it's probably weird some of you talk to your dolls! But to each their own really.It just depends on what side of the looking glass you are on.

      Anime fans seem quite obsessed with their manga collections, cosplays, otakus, and hentai. I'm not going to mention all the weird one's I've seen. Honestly though, what is the tentacle appeal? They come with their share of freaks. Liking Yaoi is no stranger than yiffing to me.

      The doll fandom gets a lot of criticism for liking dolls, weather they are old or young, and the furry fandom isn't too different. Their criticism is for liking animals. I mean an anatomically correct doll is strange in it's own right to someone outside the fandom. Mo matter what fandom you are in, there's going to be people who don't agree with you. And you can't please everyone, so be yourself, and like what you like, because that's what makes you, you. Recently I discovered a LJ community dedicated to "Doll Erotica." And I've even noticed the presence of "detachable bits" and "Larger breast plates." Everyone likes sex. Sex sells. Are furries really that weird?

      Has anyone ever accused you of liking or participating in Furry fetishism for having Anthro type dolls?
      Being who I am, it would be hard not to "accuse" me of liking it anyway. I do like Furries. And not in a fetishy oh I can't wait to see some yiff, or draw some yiff, or take pictures of anthro dolls in a yiff position sort of way. I just love animals, and often times, go to them for comfort over humans. All of my friends are the same way. And most of the games I play, or role plays I do, are furry based. And it doesn't lead to, or isn't centered on yiffing.

      How do you respond to that kind of assumption if it comes up?
      Well if they assumed I'm into strange fetishes for liking or having an anthro doll, I'd first let them know how judgmental they are being. Then I'd continue to correct them, and let them know not everyone into the furry fandom has weird fetishes. After that, I'd ask them if they liked anime, and their opinion on the cute cat girls.

      Do you think that kind of assumption is more likely if anthro dolls were sculpted or dressed more maturely?
      I'm sure it would be, but also, I'm sure it would depend on what you were doing with the dolls too. For even getting a doll I was looked at weird, and criticized. It made it hard to get into the hobby. And when my friends noticed he had a penis, things god weirder. I mean, either way, what could you really get as far as fetishes go, out of an anatomically correct BJD weather it be anthro or human, or even an elf or something else? There isn't much I can picture someone getting out of it. And if you did take a suggestive picture of it, how is it different than the doll erotica out there already?

      I think if you just have an anthro doll, and your using it like any other doll, than what is the difference? Aside from the presence of cute ears, a tail and maybe paws.
       
    16. I think what people need to realize is that the furry fandom is just like any other fandom. There are people who are into the sexual side, people who are into the creative side, people who are into the general interest section, people who are on the fringe, etc. Furry fandom is far, and I mean far from being mostly populated by an erotic-interested majority.

      I also want to state that 'fetish' is in itself not always a sexualized or -related word. You can be a furry fetishist and have nothing to do with the sexual aspects of the fandom.

      As for the questions:

      No one has ever accused me of being a fetishist, in either sense of the word, in regards to my cat doll. Soon I'll have a couple of lion/cat anthros on more mature human bodies, but I'll just have to cross that bridge if I come to it.

      If I get accusations? I give them the general 'learn before you assume' response. Depending on the origin the person might just be trying to get under my skin, in which case they're not worth my time. If not, then it's either a case of being ignorant of the fandom/interest itself, or a genuine curiosity with the intent to learn. In which case I'd have to respond differently, depending on which it is.

      With more 'mature' bodies and such, perhaps the reaction will come to be more common, but only among the ignorant who actually know that furry exists.
       
    17. Hmm. One of my friends occasionally teases me, jokingly saying "You're a furry," because I have a couple of dolls with Soom MD optional parts and similar animalistic add-ons. Of course, this led us into a rather long discussion of whether or not I agreed with the statement, and why. Eventually, for me it boils down to this: I don't consider dolls (or characters) with human facial features and predominantly human characteristics to be "anthros," whether that term is being connected to the furry fandom or not. As an example, The Little Mermaid (in any of her many incarnations) may be a fish from the waist down, but I do not look at her and think, "Hey, an anthro!" Rather, she is a part of my mythology, and my worldview. In the same way, I do not consider traditional naga/lamia, fauns, satyrs, centaurs, or other such creatures to be anthros. I think that something like a werewolf (a transforming human/animal mix of some sort) certainly has the potential to trigger the "anthro" response in my mind, but it really depends on how it is presented.

      Anthropomorphism is the attribution of human characteristics to non-human creatures and beings. We see this with Catsy, the Pipos animal lines, and various other series of dolls that consist of animals with humanoid/bipedal bodies. Conversely, I see dolls like the Soom MD line and the Angelheim fantasy dolls (or the Souldoll centaur) as humans that have some animalistic parts, but retain their human nature, or are essentially humanoid.

      As I do not own any animal dolls with humanoid bodies, nor do I have any desire to do so, the rest of the discussion doesn't really apply to me. I have occasionally wished for a jointed cat that could serve as a "pet" for some of my human dolls, but I have yet to see one on the market (with a few very hard to find and OT for DoA exceptions) that seemed enough like an animal to me - I don't want a cat for them that has humanoid characteristics, I want a cat.
       
    18. I'll just preface this by saying I am a furry. Have been since before I knew what it was called. Heck, it's on my profile, for pete's sakes. As others above have said, there is not a single cut and dry version of a furry. There are facets, just like in any fandom/hobby. There are some that do nothing with thier dolls but put them in a cabinet, some people do condoll, and some create whole worlds, but an idea of sexuality is never brought up. As far as I'm concerned, anthro dolls can be given the same treatment. *shrugs* To each thier own.

      As for the questions.

      Has anyone ever accused you of liking or participating in Furry fetishism for having Anthro type dolls?
      Nope. Which is actually, to me, incredibly surprising. It might be because I own a lot of characters with anthro extras, but not really a straight anthro (haven't found one I like enough yet, I guess.) And to me, it wouldn't be an accusation, especially if you did any sort of research on me myself. Seems only that my dolls and I come part and parcel. I'm a fur, my dolls might be too. *shrugs*

      How do you respond to that kind of assumption if it comes up?
      Same thing I did up above... *shrug* It's thier assumption. I'll give them an answer if they aren't just trying to troll me. And if they are trying to troll me, I'll let them stew in thier own accusation and not dignify it with an answer. It honestly is of no concern of mine. I am who I am, and have dolls as such.

      Do you think that kind of assumption is more likely if anthro dolls were sculpted or dressed more maturely?
      It might be. I honestly wish there were more mature anthros. But that's my own standpoint. It might come up more if there were more mature anthros, and I suppose one must cross that bridge when it arrives... if ever.
       
    19. If you say you are a "furry" I assume you mean that on the inside, you believe you really have the soul/essence of an animal. I've never heard "being a furry" described any other way. I believe this is the definition of Furry the OP is using. Liking anthro characters and being a furry are not the same thing. Furries say they are prosecuted for their "lifestyle". How is a hobby or a fandom a lifestyle? For comparison, doll collecting or watching anime is not called a lifestyle even if it's a life-consuming hobby. If you like Anthro characters, you shouldn't call yourself a "furry" or be prepared for all the negative connotations that come with it.

      I really didn't like the anthro's when they popped up originally because of the furry connotation. Now... well, I think the cute chibi ones are cute. The anthro characters with animal heads and large breasts make me uncomfortable. If there were larger anthro dolls that weren't being presented sexually, I would be ok with them (example: Volks Baron).

      I also agree that characters like centaurs, mermaids, fauns, etc, to me are just come across as fantasy characters.
       
    20. I'm going to go ahead and assume that was meant for me.

      I know what I said. And I meant what I said. I am a furry. And I am more than well prepared for all the "negative" connotations of my words, considering how long I've been one. While I do understand where you're gleaning info, I think it applies to what you've said here as well. (yeah, that sentence made no sense. XD) How many anime fans call themselves "otaku"? Or "hikkomori", or "nekomimi"? For them, it may be an all-life consuming thing, so much so they put a label on it. Furries are the same. Some dabble in the fandom, some just like the art because they are aethestically drawn to it, some suit for the fun of it, some suit for the feeling of not being human. Yes, I know what you said. And yes, I do think that part of me is not wholly human, get that me flamed or not.

      It works it's way into dolls as well, I think. Some people call themselves "collectors", some call themselves "Landlord, or caretaker". Some call themselves "Mommy" or "Daddy" to thier resins. It's just a label for themselves, inclusive of thier hobby. Some people want thier dolls to represent something other than themselves, be it the animal they can never be, or the perfect human we can't be. It's escapism. Some people just dig a little deeper to escape.