Violence and depictions of abuse in the doll world?

People will make a fuss no matter what it's part of being human. I see what you're trying to say about being respectful, but it also sounds like you're suggesting that people limit their creativity just for the sake of being politically correct. If we were all out to please everyone else, we'd all be running in circles.

All of us are on a forum for hobby that the majority find disturbing to begin with, so, in a way, aren't we the specific minority? And if we don't like something we find on this forum, there's that little button at the top of our internet browsers we can click which magically takes us to the previous page we were viewing.

 

Perfectly said. It really is a case of if it's not your cup of tea then you don't have to look at it. We all have our own tastes, as is evident from the wonderful myriad of doll sculpts and owner's mods out there...and what would this hobby be without such wonderful refreshing variety?

 

Where does this come from?
Society, culture, entertainment. Most importantly, life. These things are real. I think it's always important to keep an open mind though. If there are violent or sexual themes in anything from movies and music to photographs/stories involving BJDs, it's obvious where the idea stemmed from, but that's of course not a bad thing at all. What better way to reach people through art and entertainment (Two things that should never, ever be censored, imo)?

Does viewing depictions of violence/sexual abuse against a non-human object have an effect on real people? Is this quantifiable or supported by any sort of existing research, or is this view based purely on opinion?

Opinion or not, I think it's quite subjective. Not everyone this applies to can be put in the same box. For instance, while one person who was a victim of violent/sexual abuse may be completely traumatized at even the mentioning of this subject, others may be not be effected whatsoever, or some might even see it as a means of coping. Regardless, It would be silly to not write about a "touchy" subject because you're afraid of offending someone, or you want to pretend these things don't exist. As discussed before me, you can't appeal to all parties. Personally, I find it perfectly acceptable if someone wants to include abuse in whatever artistic medium they choose. Art is truth and expression after all.^^

 

I think instead of them not depicting rape, or head-shots, the person viewing should not take it so personal. The person making the art or photos, dose not personally know you or trying to hurt you. I think it's silly how personal people take things.

 

I think that part of the beauty of these dolls is that they are very lifelike. So when we see them in depictions of violence and abuse, it still affects us and the artist doesn't have to mutilate a person. I don't really understand why someone would mutilate such an expensive doll, but it is a rather harmless way to get a point across in a piece of artwork.

 

I think let people like what they like when it comes to their dolls. They are their dolls, and if their dolls have been "raped/abused/shot/stabbed" if that's what they want them that's what they want. It's not like it really happened. Maybe it's a way for them to channel their previous traumas.

I know I personally do not like to talk to therapists, it makes me angry. So when I have something on my mind I usually paint, sketch, or write. For some people it's impossible to talk about traumatic experiences to another person they don't know.

Or even if this person have visions of doing bad acts, maybe depicting it on a doll helps them repress the urge? lol in a worst case never going to happen scenario.

Some people have a natural curosity for gore and violence, I know I do. That's why I'm going to become a a homicide detective. I've seen a few live autopsy's though and let me tell you, when you see the face of a mother and her children brutally killed, it sticks with you for the rest of your life. It's something that either makes you sick, or it makes you so angry that you want to find the person who did it and tear out whatever bodypart they hold dearest.

 

Actually, I'm finding the whole thing a bit too much. In well over 20 years of doll collecting I've never before come across such an obsession with violence & abuse. I do understand that many BJD people are coming from an anime/manga background & much of that is pretty violent as are video games so I suppose that helps influence folks' world view & fantasies.

Also it seems that many people have dark fantasies resulting from their own pain, physical or mental, & incorporate that into their caracters. Now don't get me wrong, there's nothing wrong with exorcising your personal demons thru your dolls & stories but it does seem to be an increasing trend almost to the point of another wounded, scarred, abused princling, ho-hum.

Whether or not violence against inanimate objects affects people's real world view, I can't answer that. That's for research studies & the professionals. Though I do believe that everything we're exposed to has some effect on our world view.

 

I agree, I find it extremely excessive. I know most people doing photostories aren't writers, but if I want to read a Mary Sue story, I'll look up some 13 year old writers on fanfiction.net. This is why I don't look at photostories anymore (well perhaps if they involve pukis and well done hilarity ).

 

Where does this come from? Life. Reality. When I was thirteen, everything I wrote was happy and sparkly. If something bad happened, it was a clause to get to hero to swoop the heroine into his loving embrace. Things don't work like that, though. As I got older, I realized that bad things happen, and that these things become a part of somebody. Those characters that were abused in their past - no one acknowledges the fact that abuse is a cycle, and that character may come to hurt someone else. Why is there violence? Because there are people like me who see the reality. Or maybe it's because people actually do like it. Numerous times in fanfiction I've come across rape as being a romantc act. The hero is so overcome with lust that he savagly attacks the heroine and halfway through she begins to like it. Rape is not romantic. It's hate. So either people think like me, or they have some weird fantasy that rape and violence (like the hero pinning a heroine against the wall) are sexy.


Does viewing depictions of violence/sexual abuse against a non-human object have an effect on real people? If it is done artistically and tastefully it can have an affect. R727 has a piece where two of her dolls are romantically involved. It is extremely rare to see a picture where two dolls being romantic looks real and nice. R727 dd it. I think that few people do have the potential to pull of something like this in a realistic way and not made to be sexy or romantic.

Is this quantifiable or supported by any sort of existing research, or is this view based purely on opinion? Opinion. What else? :-) Oh, and apologies if some fruitcake like me has already said this.
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I agree with this. I've felt the same way, in fact. You can try things out with your dolls that you don't want to do in real life. This occurs even in safer ways, like dressing them in crazy fashion or hair styles.

 

I think a lot of people use the hobby as a way to creatively express themselves, or journal. So sometimes the violence/abuse might be autographical. But other times, the dolls are physical representations of a fictional character who happened to be a victim (or the perpetrator) of violence or abuse.

 

I most certainly agree with this. We are over-saturated with these depictions of violence, sexual behaviour, and gore due to the Media, but these things also happen in real life, and for no good reason whatsoever. Why do people get raped and murdered? No one really knows, but this happens all of the time. There are a lot of sick people out there, and we all are going to have to accept that before we try and make it stop. If you can survive these things, than that must be the ultimate test of your mortal strength--at least to me. As hard as it my seem, people can survive this, have survived this, and have become become stronger because of it. It's an indescribably horrible thing that has happened to people, and will continue to happen to people, and it may seem impossible to recover from it, but the first stage toward acceptance of yourself again is to face this situation head-on.

 

It is healthy in fact to use creative outlets (in this context dolls) to vent frustrations. Many times this is seen with dolls who have gruesome mods, or are photographed in psychologically unpleasant situations. Although it may bother some people, there is certainly nothing wrong with it, as it isn't hurting anybody. In some situations this outlet could even serve as a preventative for using other, more damaging means, to cope with someone's unpleasant emotions.

And if you want to look at doll modifications from an artistic standpoint rather than a therapeutic, darker themes have always been an important facet of artistic work, it is these works which are often the most provocative, as this thread proves.

 

Almost every single person have a violent stroke in. Like when you have a thought "I would kill him/her" when angry. Some people have just thoughts about it, some people bring it in life. There's violence, it exist, it is one of the parts of life. What you can see in doll stories, its a mirroring of a real life through the head of an owner. It do not mean he/she likes to hurt people or like to watch ppl being hurt. It might be sympathizing, telling the story about abused, not abuser.

 

Although this post was made quite a while ago, I only notice it now.
I was not suggesting any limitations to creativity. People can create as much as they want and creating is not the same as exposing other people to what you create. Of course people want to share what they create and it is only natural that they do. People still need to be conscious about their own actions and show it to the proper audience or not complain when people say they do not like it. You yourself can limit the amount of fuss you get. That has nothing to do with limiting creativity and pleasing everybody else.

 

That's the exact reason that makes me believe DoA ends up being a 16+ forum and not 13+ as it states ... I'd never let a child under 16 to browse this forum , I've put it on my parental filter of antivirus & windows. We have to protect the children first of everything .
I'm into zombie horror (which of course can never be true) and still the blind pure human hate and misanthropy towards anyone innocent I see in some stories scares me , it's not only the pictures & the violence -it's those too, but also it's that it's blind hate to all/everyone/everything , and it's the writer's psychology which is sometimes , and worse is the glorification of brutality that occurs in debates or discussions as this one and this is much worse than a photostory (there were even some people defending true violence/crimes in some threads of debates like this one, which is preposterous and maybe illegal) ... I avoid to read posts of those people but if I randomly see some then I am old enough to not being traumatized at all (it's impossible for me to be traumatized by a photo story but I'm old enough a child under 16 could be traumatized) ... so if this forum wants to be 13+ some should low down a bit their brutal creativity inside the forum & also if something can't be in a story here then we shouldn't have debates around it cause those debates & discussions usually they turn into discussions of the true violence e.t.c. as well (which some even defending) , if not then this forum (Doa) in my parental filter will stay as a 16+ and in some cases (especially debates & discussions) a 18+ site and not as 13+ as it states.

 

As BJD have become more popular, there has been an increasingly popular trend of depicting violence and sexual abuse using dolls. Where does this come from?


I don't think a single cause can be worked out for this phenomenon. Possible reasons for the individual artists/doll owners could be one or several of the following:

1. using such depiction as a way to cope with own traumatic experiences
2. trying to copy/repeat a topic seen or read in media
3. using it as a means of provocation, be it rebellious or „for the laugh“ (yes, sadly possible)
4. searching for a possibiliy to play out „taboo“ fantasies in a safe way
5. wanting to be liked by others who have posted similar depictions
6. using the topic to criticize our society and show the reality like it is
7. actually wanting to inflict horror or disgust on the viewers, living out aggression this way
8. ...last but not least, it could simply be a part of the depicted character's background (with the same doll owner having nine or more dolls that do not have this type of background, making the one character who does less than 10% of the „doll population in the house“ – and this would actually be much more idyllic that it is in real life, where violence or abuse (sexual or not) occurs to much more people than just 10% on some point of their life line)

The list is far from complete, of course.


Does viewing depictions of violence/sexual abuse against a non-human object have an effect on real people?

Everything we perceive can have an effect. So these depictions have an effect on the viewer – the viewer can be shocked, disgusted, delighted, intrigued, or left calm by the depiction. If the viewer is sensitive to this kind of material, it can even be traumatizing. It can trigger posttraumatic or dissociative symptoms. Maybe it can even add to an already existing aggressive personality and work as an enhancer.

But I do NOT think that viewing this kind of material a couple of times causes the viewer to immediately attempt violence and/or sexual abuse - generally. Learning just doesn't work this way.


Is this quantifiable or supported by any sort of existing research, or is this view based purely on opinion?

I have read quite some research material on the influence of media and/or viewing a certain scene on behaviour. The results of this research is conflicting. Even more, changes in results can be caused by the choice of research hypothesis, choice, homogenity and number of experimental and control sample, alpha value and much more. There is research on aggression in games that I am interested in, so while only loosely connected, it might have formed my opinion to some degree – since it implies viewers CAN distinguish between virtual and real aggression very well, and that repeated subjection to viewing of virtual aggression doesn't cause desensitizing. Example see here: http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/17470910903315989

But I prefer to not stick to a popular new hypothesis only, so this view is based on an amalgam of former read articles, books, and blogs on neuroscience, psychology, philosophy etc., and of course my own thinking.

In other words: it is based on opinion above all else.

 

I honestly can't see why you think this forum isn't suitable for those under 16. There are plenty of members under that age here. I also don't believe we must always "protect the children". The truth is, children are pretty quick to pick things up no matter how sheltered they are- and if they are over-protected, they're more likely to take bigger risks.
I have met some people who do use their dolls to act out their misanthropic and nasty views, and the doll becomes a vicarious means of spreading their own toxic hatred. These people, to put it bluntly, are idiots and should be avoided. Luckily they are also in the minority. I have my own misanthropic doll, who can be very violent, but I personally am not misanthropic and certainly never violent. He's just a creation I use to act out a storyline that is more campy 40s horror-movie than actual blood-and-gore repulsiveness.
Also, dollblue- I agree with you entirely.

 

Although I agree with you that we shouldn't put little children in front of a violent horror-movie, I think we should be careful not to use words like 'trauma' too lightly.
When I was ten I saw the movie 1492 where they showed someone being hanged and it shocked me (mostly because I have an almost phobic attitude towards anything related to suffocation). But even though those images stayed with me, they didn't have nearly the crippling effect as a few traumatic events in my life had and have.

All in all, I don't think a few averagely done photoshoots with dolls will have quite the same impact as news items we see on television everyday.

 

You are right. We shouldn't use the terms lightly, and when I talk about trauma in the following my intent is not to belittle or rationalize away real life traumatic experiences. I also agree that it is, in general, not likely that a 13-year-old will be traumatized by a photoshoot of a doll chopping another doll's head off (just an example of "violence"), because like I mentioned, research suggests that it is probably easy for a viewer to distinguish between virtual and real life situations.

So while I agree that horrible real life events are much more likely to cause trauma than a photoshoot with dolls depicting a horrible event, there still is at least a small possibility of trauma. And more important, the probability of retraumatizing should be kept in mind. Like I mentioned, someone sensitive to a certain matter, for example because they already encountered a very similar event in real life, could be additionally traumatized by the images and/or the way these images are treated by the audience/viewer community. Imagine a photostory depicting sexual abuse in an objectifying way. Imagine ten comments saying "Hot!". Imagine some forum member that has been a victim of such abuse as a kid seeing these images. Yes, they could simply hit the button back. But this situation could already have triggered posttraumatic symptoms, flashbacks, a depression episode...

But when we are talking about television - it could have the exactly same effect. If not worse. I think it is perfectly possible to be retraumatized by something seen on TV or in the media and I think it already happens all the time.