What would you do if...you bought a doll that had been stolen?

There is such a contrast between these two statements! Both students, both broke...

 

I know O.o I too am a broke student, and I honestly believe that not having much money shouldn't impinge on your morals at all. Of course dolls are a big investment- they are even for people in full-time employment: they're expensive things! It just goes to show how different people's morals can be. Very telling. Makes you wonder: if their moral compass is pointing in such a weird direction, what else is possible?
Miluriel: For the record, theft is a horrible thing to happen to anyone, and what's more, it CAN happen to anyone, no matter how careful they are. Blaming someone for being a victim of these things is like blaming a women for being raped because she was wearing a short skirt.

 

Be sure to add "illegal" to "harsh and unmoral."

 

Geeze, I should stop reading this thread, certain users are putting me right off the doll community. I know some people dont have moral compasses but I thought, being doll people as well, they'd at least do the right thing. The y'know, non illegal thing.

 

From what I've experienced of human nature, the being broke part isn't important, not when the issue's this black and white (it's against the law, for crying out loud!) Some people will do the right thing, regardless of the amount of money in their bank account and others will make excuse after excuse for acting selfishly.

 

I wonder why, though. It would be interesting to do a study on precisely what shapes a person's moral compass. Upbringing? Genetics? Maybe if you have selfish parents you too become selfish? Maybe if someone has been selfish towards you, you then feel it's OK to be selfish back to the rest of the world? Perhaps others who have posted here can enlighten me.
Personally, I have a very strong moral compass, so it's difficult for me to understand the viewpoints of others who act in ways I view as morally heinous (I don't just mean handing back stolen dolls, I mean other things I disagree with: intensive farming, unscrupulous companies, and so on). Which is why I'm curious about it. I
n fact, I would never think of even opening a thread like this because I would have thought the answer would be unanimous: You give the stolen doll back and report the thief to the relevent authorities. That there are people out there who would keep the doll or try to extort the victim... it makes me feel sick. I'm just glad they're getting their views out in the open, so I know who not to deal with in the future.
All I know that EVEN if I had saved up for years to buy the doll, and EVEN if it was my dream Grail doll, and EVEN if I adored the doll when it arrived, the minute I found it had been stolen it would no longer be MY doll, and it would be on its way back to the original owner.

 

I really hope you're not blaming the victim for allowing the theft to take place? It's neither your nor the legal owner's fault the doll was stolen. There are people who have taken great care of their dolls or left their doll in the care of equally careful people and the doll has been stolen by another party. No one has eyes in the back of their head, after all

Instead of pointing the finger at the 'careless' original owner and using that as a very weak argument to keep the doll or expect reimbursement from the original, legal owner, why not focus on the thief? They're the reason the legal owner is out a doll and you're out your money. The thief owes the legal owner a doll, and owes you your money.

File a police report and let them do the work. I would rather be out the money than have the weight of a stolen doll on my conscience. It would feel as if I'd stolen the doll myself to keep it.

 

Dosn't sound harsh...sounds like your blaming the victim for being victimized. Easy to do I'm sure until your the one who is the victim. You can do everything right but sadly there are times when things just go wrong. Even if you left the doll sitting on a table with a big neon sign over it saying "expensive doll worth lots second hand!" if someone takes something without your permission, it is THEM who is to blame not you.

 

I wonder about this, too. My hubby is the most unselfish person I have ever met, and his dad is quite the opposite (unbelievably so). But my hubby's grandfather was also unselfish, a real sweetheart. Heaven forbid the selfishness trait skips a generation, as I have an eleven year old son. But right now he's like his dad, and hopefully this aspect of his personality is set in stone by now (crosses fingers).

On the other hand I have met entire selfish families, where parents and children seem to lack a moral compass. And the opposite, too. So who knows what combination of genetics and environment is at play here. Or maybe it's just random.

As for this discussion, I appreciate that people are honest enough to tell us what they really think, on the one hand, while on the other it makes me sad that said people don't seem to think they are doing anything wrong. It seems like the inner voice that makes you feel small and mean when you do something wrong is just missing. That's really troubling to me.

 

This is very difficult and the laws in the US concerning having stolen goods is rough. You also have to put into consideration that since BJDS are high ticket items, you can report them in insurance claims,blahblahblah (I can't remember exact details).

If I was in this situation and the original owner provider my proof,I would definetely contact them,tell them the seller's name and info I bought it from,and talk about it. If I paid a good chunk of money for it,I would (shamefully lol) ask for some kind of reimbursment. I'm considered a victim in this shindig too. The reimbursment doesn't have to be money though. We could try to do an equal kinda thing. I defenitely would not ask for the total amount I paid for it,unless they offered to pay that amount. Also some DEFINETE claims are going down on PP in the end.

 

It doesn't matter if it was a huge investment or not. You legally and ethically can't keep something that doesn't belong to you, period. Sometimes life sucks, and you do end up out money, but that's not an excuse.

Not necessarily -- being careful helps, but it is impossible to guarantee that you will never ever ever be the victim of theft. The seller is the one to blame. Both you and the original owner would be the victims, unless you choose to keep the doll or try to sell it back, in which case you would also be guilty of theft. Like it or not, as the doll was not the sellers to sell, it was not yours to buy, either. What you said in the above quotes would actually make you one of the 'black sheep'.

 

...and if the previous owner was also a student and it was a huge investment for them, in your same position, they should be forced to lose it twice over?

Than you? Perhaps. But not more than the thief. The same could be said of you in this hypothetical situation -- maybe you should have been more careful to not buy from a thief. Victim-blaming doesn't work, but if you're going to use this argument, know it can certainly be turned right back around against your position, too.

 

I'm a student, too, and I have absolutely not a dime to my name. I don't work, either. All my doll money comes from change for when my parents give me gas money. I don't order from the marketplace for this reason. I'm too worried I'm going to be taken. Regardless of how many legit transactions go down, I don't do it, just in case.

And if money is that much of an issue, dare I say, this hobby might not be the best choice? We're all struggling with finances (or have been), and we're all going to be sad and unhappy that our doll wasn't ours to begin with, but most of us here would still do the right thing.

And blaming the victim is kind of tacky, if you ask me. Like others have mentioned, locks can be broken, and alarms can be deactivated. Especially the trunk of the car theft. Putting the doll in the trunk meant that they didn't want anyone to see that they had a doll in their car. They did that because they were trying to take precautions, and still someone broke in.

 

My garage has been burglarized twice (it's where we keep our car, as the times we've left it in our driveway (private property), it's been broken into). This despite alarm systems on the garage and the car and security lights, too! But I guess as the victim, it's my fault. I should camp out every night with a shotgun, perhaps. Or maybe I should just let the next thief take the car, as it's obvious I don't deserve one.

And a couple years ago, after the old car that we donated to charity was stolen off a storage lot surrounded by razor wire topped fencing and a locked gate-- well, that certainly wasn't the thief's fault, was it? And it wasn't the fault of the person who bought the car either. Of course not! By your logic it was the charity's fault! Most definitely. Oh, wait. That's not what the police said when they picked up the stolen vehicle from the buyer's driveway and charged her as an accessory after the fact.

The truth is, when you buy something used, you are running the risk of buying stolen property. Therefore, if anyone is to blame other than the thief, it's you. Long before the victim. She's lost her property. You've gained something via illegal means, something that doesn't belong to you, no matter how much you paid the thief. Once you realize it's stolen, if you don't return the property you are as guilty as the original thief.

 

Obviously. Because it's totally within your power to predict break-ins, and shame on you for not preventing hem before they happen. I mean, you SO could have hired (or can still hire) an armed guard for your garage just in case. OOH! Or plant land mines! That would stop them. See? Totally your fault for not putting explosives in your garage to deter thieves.

AGAIN, because clearly, people are either not reading this thread or not grasping the concept, that. is. illegal. I would hope that you (and others who have said they'd try to get compensation from the original owner) would value not going to jail over getting back money for a doll. You being a victim also (which you would be, though maybe not to the extent of the original owner whose doll was stolen) does not justify you going after the person who was the initial victim in the situation. The person whose stolen doll you bought would and should not owe you a penny, because, hey, it wasn't their idea for someone to steal their doll and sell it to you. It'd be like expecting someone who had their car stolen by a thief who then hit you with it and broke your leg to pay for your hospital bills.
By the way, paypal won't do a thing about getting money back for you. It's not their responsibility if you end up buying stolen property just because you paid through them. You *may* be able to do something through your CC company though.



I know that I am among the people who, if I discovered a doll I bought had been stolen, would immediately hand it over without expectation of compensation from the person it had been stolen from. Losing money would be bad; jailtime would be infinitely worse.

 

I've seen a couple people say how this thread is negative, but really I'm feeling quiet good reading through and seeing how many people would do the right thing without question.

As for me, I know I would do the right thing and return the doll to it's rightful owner no money requested, but I won't lie and say that it would be easy for me. I know the thought of keeping it would cross my mind, before I sent it back.

 

Looking at my own dolls right now. I know it would break my heart loosing any one of them, no matter the cheap or the expensive, I am very attached to them and i love them.

That being said, I know it would break someone else's heart to lose their doll. Whether they were careless or it was a horrible accident. That doll would be their doll. They didn't give it up or ask for it to happen. Everyone makes mistakes. If I bought a doll and found out that it's owners was trying to find it I'd contact them immediately. I just wouldn't be able to keep it. Even if I loved it to death, as soon as I found out it was someone else's stolen doll it would hurt me to look at it. It wouldn't be MY doll, It wouldn't be at home with ME. It's home would be elsewhere with it's rightful owner.

I would however try and get a refund from the person who sold me a stolen doll. If that didn't pan out it'd suck to have lost that much money. But at least it'd be good to know I'd done the right thing and helped a person who was sad over losing their precious doll.

Also spin it in a different light.
If you were the victim of a doll theft, would you want someone to do the right thing?

 

I've been taught to try to look at things through another person's eyes and see how I would like it. If my doll got stolen and the person who has my doll (regardless of how they got it) refuses to return the doll (or hand it to the police), I'd be very angry and will take legal action (file a police report, contact my lawyer and see how I can my expensive property back). If the person who has my stolen doll returns it to me, I'd be so happy. So the other way around, if I keep something that isn't mine, I would expect the owner to be angry at me and take legal action against me, but if I return the doll, I would make the owner happy.
I think some people just look at things only from their own perspective. If they get robbed, they should get their stuff back and if they get something that belongs to someone else, they should be allowed to keep it. They can try to live in a world where only they should get a special treatment, but I'm sure they'll just end up on other people's personal blacklists. What goes around, comes around.

 

This is so very true. Sadly, usually they just whine about how 'it's so unfair' if they are ever called upon -- or forced somehow -- to behave the way the former group of folks behave naturally, and behave as though they are a victim of the universe. It's extremely disheartening to see such selfishness.

 

(you = general sense)

Exactly; they take it from the perspective that the world revolves around them. On one hand, if someone's doll ends up in their hands by way of a doll theif/scammer, it's only "fair" that they get to keep the doll because they bought it, and "they" wouldn't be so naiive to "let" someone steal their stuff.

But, if the tables were turned, you can bet your life that these people would be extremely distraught, pulling out all the stops, notifying everyone, and just about going nuts if their doll was stolen. I bet you all of these people would do a complete 180 if their doll ever did get stolen. You can bet on it that these people would be enraged at the thought of someone trying to sell back their doll to make up for the other person's troubles.

That's usually how it happens. They totally miss the point.

Sure, they could keep it. Even if it's against the law, they could keep it. Crooks, unfortunately, don't get caught sometimes, and searches stop. But would you really want to risk that happening? Would you really want to risk the thief not getting caught, just so you could be happy? By ignoring the fact that someone, somewhere is probably heartbroken, and wondering what they could've done differently, besides feeling utterly vulnerable, and possibly destroying their interest in the hobby altogether? You could potentially destroy someone's enjoyment of the hobby. You don't know how this person would react. This could've been their only doll.

But again, would you really want to risk the thief not getting caught so you could keep someone else's doll? You risk your own reputation in the process. The excuse of "I paid a lot for it" isn't going to fly with the justice system. Why would anyone want to risk their reputation - and maybe their freedom - by not doing the right, and legal thing? It still astounds me that people would still take that risk. You take a chance of losing more money in legal fees. That doll is going to look cheap compared to what you'll need to pay lawyers.