1. It has come to the attention of forum staff that Dollshe Craft has ceased communications with dealers and customers, has failed to provide promised refunds for the excessive waits, and now has wait times surpassing 5 years in some cases. Forum staff are also concerned as there are claims being put forth that Dollshe plans to close down their doll making company. Due to the instability of the company, the lack of communication, the lack of promised refunds, and the wait times now surpassing 5 years, we strongly urge members to research the current state of this company very carefully and thoroughly before deciding to place an order. For more information please see the Dollshe waiting room. Do not assume this cannot happen to you or that your order will be different.
    Dismiss Notice
  2. Dollshe Craft and all dolls created by Dollshe, including any dolls created under his new or future companies, including Club Coco BJD are now banned from Den of Angels. Dollshe and the sculptor may not advertise his products on this forum. Sales may not be discussed, no news threads may be posted regarding new releases. This ban does not impact any dolls by Dollshe ordered by November 8, 2023. Any dolls ordered after November 8, 2023, regardless of the date the sculpt was released, are banned from this forum as are any dolls released under his new or future companies including but not limited to Club Coco BJD. This ban does not apply to other company dolls cast by Dollshe as part of a casting agreement between him and the actual sculpt or company and those dolls may still be discussed on the forum. Please come to Ask the Moderators if you have any questions.
    Dismiss Notice

Your thoughts on the Secondhand Market?

Dec 31, 2017

    1. The dolls I own are all secondhand, since they’re not on sale anymore, I guess they hold their value if taken care of. Still I wonder would you sell them the same as when you bought them or higher because of its limited production or discontinued line.
       
    2. I would prefer purchasing a doll directly from the factory or the artist; however, that is not always possible. I like to be the first (and hopefully) only owner.

      There are two dolls on my "want" list that aren't being made any longer. The only way I can get them is by purchasing them second-hand.
       
    3. I love secondhand but I only purchase from here. Almost all the dolls I love were LE so buying from the artist isn’t possible anymore. I’ve had lovely experiences buying my dolls here, they gave me a chance to own my dream dolls.
       
      • x 2
    4. Half the second market are scalpers or people who are trying to sell a doll for the original price + their shipping + their customs. Shipping and customs are just part of the expense of collecting. The doll isnt worth more because of them.

      The other half are trying to sell modded, hybrid, or incomplete dolls for more than the original sold.

      There are deals out there, but unless someone is looking for that specific doll, it's going to be a wait if you want to get a large portion of your money back.
       
    5. I really love the secondhand market because most of my dolls are retired full set dolls. I really love dolls that I wasn’t able to buy back in the day due to financial situations, so I’m glad I’m able to find them on the secondhand market. The price hasn’t really bothered me yet, but that’s probably also because I’m a tiny collector.
       
      • x 2
    6. You do realise you are also insulting half of your fellow DoAers here, and that seemingly without any deeper knowledge of the marketplace and the way pricing works to prove your allegations?
       
      • x 7
    7. .
       
      #47 Gintsumi, May 30, 2020
      Last edited: Feb 28, 2024
      • x 4
    8. I've been doing in the hobby for over a decade, I'm pretty sure I understand the market.

      It's not like the hobby is over flowing with riches. Most people can barely afford to be in the hobby.

      Why stay in a hobby if you cant afford the dolls you really want?

      And your dream doll is probably not my dream doll. It's why modded and hybrid dolls sit on the market forever or the hybrid is split sold.
       
      • x 1
    9. I cant speak on a seller's perspective but as a buyer i find the second-hand market to treat me very well. I just recently got my supia doll rosy (with face up !) second hand and i couldn't be happier. The only thing I would say is I get a bit disappointed when looking for sculpts like a switch because prices are brought up very high ( I've seen blank sculpts go for 300 for head only + shipping!) but other then that i truly enjoy the second hand market
       
      • x 1
    10. I think it largely depends on what kind of doll you’re trying to sell, and where you’re choosing to sell it.

      For example, every Minifee Doll/head/body has typically sold within hours of me listing it for sale, but more commonly so, within minutes. But I also do my selling on IG, where I have a large following, and typically don’t charge what I originally paid, but a little less.

      I never really understood asking exactly what you paid, if it’s non-limited doll, because personally I would never pay the same price for something used that I could buy from the company or a dealer brand new... but idk, maybe that’s just personal preference. I know a lot of people actually prefer buying secondhand.
       
      • x 2
    11. It has been a couple years since I replied in the thread. I do still prefer times when I can trade something I already have, for something with another collector. It just works out better for everyone. The only cash exchange goes to the shipping company, or a lesser amount to make an even trade. I've had some really fun dolls come from trades. Sometimes I enjoy them for a little while, and put them up for trade again.

      I've had overall great luck buying from the second hand market. Sometimes it doesn't work so well, but I have learned a lot. I usually have some idea of then next doll I would like to buy. I've impulse purchased only one BJD, but he was $60, so it wasn't out of my regular budget. I still have him and he's likely to end up in my estate one day. The last time I posted here, only two of mine were bought new. That has now increased to six, with one being a freebie gift from the dealer. One of the new ones is an Angel Philia, I've bought so many of the extra parts for her! I can make several different body combinations and plan to paint the blank extra head so she can have an alternate face. I did get a couple of the parts second hand, but they are difficult to find. I prefer to buy from other collectors, but often enough what I'm after isn't available second hand or shipping from other collectors will make it prohibitively expensive. Supporting other collectors is just as important as the companies to keep the hobby healthy and thriving.

      DoA has a great vetting practice and good mods. I strongly prefer to sell here, but it's not always the easiest way to sell. Pros and cons present no matter how you buy and sell. I've sold three times on Facebook. One, I wasn't looking to sell. A nice boy in California had an entire collection of elves, but was missing the exact one I had. I thought it was a neat doll, but didn't fit into my collection well and the appeal of instant, unexpected doll money was too hard to pass up. That was a happy transaction on both sides. The other sale was just a head, and a bit more trouble to sell. It was listed in a group, and some people decided to discuss in the comments what they decided the price should be (even though I made it clear I preferred a trade)! This was quite silly because it was not a common head, was in new condition (only handled by me for photos and returned to packaging), and was not easy for me to import since I had to use a proxy. They are welcome to do the same and see for themselves why some things are priced as they are though. I don't get why people do that. You can always make an offer if you don't like the price, or just conclude that people can keep their things if they would rather than take less than what the value is to them. I don't do business with rude people, it only leads to trouble. Selling the head all ended well as a nice lady asked for a layaway and it ended happy for the both of us. Another time I just sold a part that didn't work for me, everyone was happy.

      In the past couple years I've had some more interest in expanding my off-topic side of my doll collection, and that has been good too. Some of them haven't been made in decades. I've learned so much from buying BJDs second hand, I'm not afraid to do so for other dolls I've desired since childhood or when I couldn't afford to even look at them. Just as often as not, other collectors have accepted my offers. Sometimes other BJD collectors will do a generous layaway with me, so that makes it much easier to consider second hand dolls. If I make an offer, the seller may decline, which is acceptable in every way. On DoA, I check sellers' feedback and I also check their regular posts to avoid drama. Sadly, some folks just give off red flags, and it's best to pay careful attention to online behavior to avoid trouble when money and expensive collectables are involved.
       
      • x 1
    12. Well, nothing you said so far does prove your allegations, and neither does your answer help in that respect. I am sorry your experiences seem to have been so negative. But since the second hand market is far from being split into either scalpers or sellers of "modded, hybrid or incomplete dolls" I think it is valid to voice my doubt about your knowledge of it.
       
      • x 2
    13. As far as I know, in China, if you have very popular second-hand doll items, you will be sought after, and many people will pay twice or even triple the price, but if your second-hand goods are only very ordinary, then you must reduce the price. Then you will wait a long time before someone will contact you.
       
      • x 2
    14. I'd say only 1 or 2 of my dolls could I get back what I paid for them and I'm just fine with that.


      I was always one of the people who argued that these dolls were a very poor investment back in the day and that secondhand prices for basic dolls were a little over blown. When I first joined the hobby owning my dream soom doll seemed unattainable but year after year the dolls aged and yellowed, newer fantasy dolls became available and suddenly a second hand doll from them was in my budget!


      These dolls yellow. Period. No Matter how well you try to take care of them resin is just a very poor choice for anything you want to truly last. There's a reason porcelain is the material of choice for those trying to make a doll to last the ages.
       
      • x 1
    15. I'd actually second what they said about the second hand market. I've also been in the hobby for years and now more than ever there is no incentive to buy a second hand doll for the price of a new one. We have so many companies to choose from that unless the doll is truly unique why would anyone want to buy one that has a head start yellowing for the price of a 'fresh' doll? We also have a lit of people who try to shirk PayPal fees, make up for their shipping costs and still sell a yellowed or stained doll for new prices. It's fine if they dont mind holding onto that doll for months until somebody with more money than patience comes along but they cant expect a fast sale.

      I did my research when I first joined the hobby. I've kept my dolls in a dark room away from the sun and live in a non smoking household yet still many of my 8+ year old dolls have yellowed. Some (doll chateau originals) have yellowed very badly despite being quite young in comparison. If I ever wanted to sell them I wouldn't be so foolish as to think I should charge full price and then some when an order new from doll chateau is a click away.
       
      • x 1
    16. @-T2P-
      I am not sure why you quoted me, since I was questioning someone else's statement that the second hand market is divided into either scalpers or sellers of damaged, modded, incomplete and hybrid dolls. And one look at our marketplace, for instance, proves that that is not true?

      All those things you describe in your reply, while not substantiating the original statement either, do happen, I agree. But that is not scalping. A scalper is someone who will buy a rare commodity wanted by many for the sole purpose of re-selling it for higher than the original price was when it is no longer available. (Going with the Cambridge Oxford dictionary's definition here, just to be sure.) Such persons exist in our hobby and do occasionally pop up, I remember an incident at a Volks event, I think last year? when someone turned up and pulled that stunt.

      Someone selling their used doll in the secondary market for higher than you or any other person thinks justified, whatever their reasoning behind the price, is not scalping. It's the normal mechanism of demand and supply - that's just the way pricing on second hand (or all free) markets works. If someone is willing to pay a given price for a doll, then the price is in and of itself justified. If said doll doesn't sell, and the potential buyers buy new instead, then that is the same self-regulating mechanism at work. This has zero to do with scalping.
      And I guess opinions will be divided on whether the unavoidable traces of normal, careful handling of a BJD qualify as 'damage'.
      So I guess I am just not sure what exactly it is that you are criticising here.
       
      • x 2
    17. I wasn't really critising anything except perhaps the idea that bjd should hold their value particularly well? Honestly I kinda missed the scalper portion of the users comment and was mostly referring the the damaged dolls being sold by people attempting to recoup costs on a used item. I feel like there's a certain point where yellowing becomes damage to most people in the hobby. Uneven yellowing usually is, but once a dollreaches that lemon phase most people will either want to pay less for it or buy it new.

      I'm just rambling about my experience as a serial market place stalker I guess, and how frustrating it is when you see the same dolls there clogging the marketplace because the owner thinks their 7 year old severely yellowed still in production doll is worth a premium. Even worse when they complain about how it isn't selling and get mad when anyone suggests the price may be a tad high :sweat
       
      • x 1
    18. I personally love the second-hand marketplace and it’s been a wonderful experience for me. Keep in mind however that I only buy and sell here in the DoA marketplace. I’ve just never bothered to go anywhere else, because everything I need in a second-hand venue is right here.:)

      I’ve bought a great deal of my collection here, and I’ve been thrilled with every single purchase I’ve made. I always check feedback carefully, and look for anything that I consider a possible red flag to my collecting habits...like over-pricing, exorbitant extra fees, damage, poor condition, etc. I will only buy dolls that are fairly priced by people I feel I can trust.

      And I have sold a fair number of dolls as well (when refining my collection over the past 14 years I’ve been here on DoA.) I always sell for less than I originally paid because I’m sentimental about dolls, and I love offering our members here good deals. That’s just who I am as a person, so I always deduct a fair amount for the time I’ve enjoyed the doll. So naturally, everything I’ve sold has sold very quickly, without difficulty. I think the reason so many dolls linger in the marketplace at this time is because there are so many more doll companies creating new dolls now. It’s simply an issue of supply and demand. Back in the day, you could pretty much count on selling a used doll for full price because there was only a small handful of companies and not a great deal of stock. That’s simply not the case anymore, and because the dolls are no longer so scarce, people are less likely to pay you a premium. It’s as simple as that.

      And one other thing I’d like to point out about our second-hand marketplace is what a great resource it is for learning about dolls. For 14 years I’ve checked it everyday with my morning coffee, just to see what’s out there, what’s selling, what’s not, what things companies have created, etc. It’s a great way to learn about dolls you don’t know about, and keep up with trends and availability. It’s an awesome learning tool.;)
       
      #58 PoeticSoul, Jun 2, 2020
      Last edited: Jun 3, 2020
      • x 3
    19. As a buyer, I love the second-hand market. I've been in the hobby since 2009 and when I started, I was a young teenager. So many dolls were so very out of my reach, and the prices even on the second-hand market were very high at that time. I've dipped in and out over the years but got back into the hobby full-force late last year. I was absolutely floored, and kind of saddened, to see how low some of the prices were second hand. For example, "back in my day," even a common second-hand Volks doll would command full retail. Now, I am able to get dolls at extreme discounts either here on DoA or on Y!J auctions. Thanks to changing tastes in the hobby and so many new options, many of the older dolls can be bought for a song.

      On the opposite end, there are many more companies now, with many more releases. It's impossible to buy everything you like when you see it new, so sometimes you have to wait and buy it second-hand. It's a risk because the price can easily be more than retail if it were a limited or popular release. For example, I paid more than double retail for a head last year, because he was a limited run and I missed it. However, if it weren't for the second-hand market, I wouldn't have him at all. I don't consider this scalping, either, because the seller may not have bonded with the item after they brought it home. It's not always sold with malicious intent for monetary gain, but if you find yourself in possession of something now valuable, of course, you're going to sell for the full amount.

      As a seller, I also like selling second-hand as I know a doll I have loved will be going to a new home. Naturally, as I enjoy lower prices as a buyer, I must also honor those lower prices as a seller. I have never sold a rare or in-demand doll, so my prices are always moderate in order to make the sale. I am more than okay with taking a loss on a doll. I consider it a tax or sorts for having owned it and enjoyed it for many years. I'm glad DoA is a safe place for both buyers and sellers to make transactions on the Marketplace.
       
      • x 1
    20. I have gotten and sold some of my dolls. Value is lost after play time and so the return ay be less than the initial amount spent but it covers the time youve had it for. The market really is better for buyers than sellers as I have struggled selling a doll that isnt as favorable to newer ones.
       
      • x 1