Angell-Studio's Gabriel & Lucifer Discussion

It was very nice of them to reply so early. What's really hard for this hobby is the language barriers, making it harder to understand each other or explain sides...

That explains why only the pajamas come along with the doll.... I am so relieved.

Thanks Allemarthe for the info.

 

I wish they would have told that to the rep who told us that the outfits would be for sale . . . all of this could have been avoided (even I won't get upset about cosplaying dolls--my only problem was them selling the outfits). But, y'all who want the dolls, it looks like they'll come back for you to buy ^_^

 

*sigh* I'm really glad that they managed to settle things a little... Cause I really love Lucifer and Gabriel, and to me, it's the doll which is more important than just the outfit... Cause in the end, AS is selling their dolls, not the doll character from Angel Sanctuary... Besides, what if someone gets Adam, mod his eyes to be similar to Lucifer, then customize him with outfit and all like the Angel Sanctuary character? Copyright? It's the doll which is the essence of it all...

If AS re-release the dolls again, I won't mind them being the same name... In short, the main issue is the outfit that the both of them are modeling, not the doll itself... Unless AS totally created the molds based on the character itself without proper permission, then it's illegal... Anyhow, hope things go well with them... I'm really glad with their quick response on this issue...

Just a quick one... Has anyone realize the similarity between Angell-Studio and Angel Sanctuary? Both initials are "AS"...

 

What are you buying? The doll or the clothes? =3=

 

Hahahaha XDDD You stole my idea XDD I was gonna post something like "Angel Studio = AS = Angel Sanctuary" and laugh off the whole matter cos in the end this is SOOOO much ado over NOTHING

EDIIIIITTTT
I have an interesting question. Now that we all know the reason behind the Angel Sanc clothings, and how the mold is innocent as babies can be, I believe that AS should have the freedom to show off those photos. Say, it would be something like a seamstress showing off some of her cosplay costume photos in the gallery section of her shop website.

I'm really of mind to suggest to Tony to ask the company to do something like that, since if they joined one comic con and cosplayed their dolls, I'm sure they'll do it again, and looking at the quality of the clothes, I'd love to see more.

And even the DoD inspired clothes. with a caption saying that where the inspiration for the clothes came from (the same thing they'd do with the Angel Sanc clothes, if they do make such a gallery), I don't think it should be that vile/evil/theiving move, would it?

If AS were to open up such a gallery section on their website and post up the taken down pictures, with their proper citations and all, would the pikes and torches still be raised against them? Because then it wont be used in the sales, but something like a gallery of the various photos of their dolls by their own work or so.

 

Watch out with equating "bad" and "illegal." Sometimes they coincide; sometimes they don't.

At any rate, a gallery of cosplaying dolls is legally infringing, but not (in my opinion) morally bad. I certainly wouldn't complain about it. With proper attribution, I doubt Kaori Yuki and DoD would care too much, as long as the clothing isn't sold. That is the hang-up most of us had.

 

That was my major personal issue... the sale of the clothing. It's the idea that someone other than the outfits' creator would be making a profit from the clothing. I know the dolls were listed as coming with pajamas, but we had heard from a rep that they would be selling the outfits separately. Apparently that was a miscommunication. I don't have an issue with the dolls themselves or the company in general (Abel is actually on my wishlist) , just the particular issue of the outfits. If that's resolved, I don't have a problem.

Sorry if my viewpoint is seen as "pikes and torches", but as an artist I know I would be very upset if someone else starting making unauthorized money from my designs. I believe that a creation should belong to it's creator, and they should be the one making a profit from their work. I have also tried to present my viewpoint in a civilized and informed manner, so it isn't just seen as a "mob mentality".

Overall, I am just glad that the issue has been resolved, hopefully to the satisfaction of both sides.

 

Haha.........copyright........
I don't think they got the copyright.......

 

Awww. Thats so lame! I love both dolls. And I LOVE Angel Sanctuary. Its so stupid that anyone would even care that they have OUTFITs on that resemble the anime.

 

I think Kaori Yuki would have every right to care, considering she made those outfits up in the first place As fans of hers, we don't want someone else to profit from her work. I'm glad A-S had a chance to clarify that the outfits aren't for sale and what their purpose was before someone told her and they got into trouble, but copyright law applies to everyone equally.

 

this is more to do with the tinies (who were going to be sold full set). I think, given comments on DOD site, that they would mind.
here is a quote from dod on their site and how they are disheartened by people copying their designs and stories(they dont mention doll copies, but specifically the clothes):

=============
The story behind the doll, dress, shoes and photo work, before one doll release, it takes many time.
But there is the doll maker that copy our stories, dresses and shoes. etc.
I am not only just angry or disappointed but sceptical even sceptical about my job. Do I really have to try so hard to creating the story and dolls?
There are so many copy cats out there and if customers think they are all same, I really don't know what to say, but these dolls are our child we pour our hearts out to that.
I can't help but being skeptical..

Dream of Doll
=====

 

I agree with la_contessa too... The thing is, those outfits are created by the artist/designer themselves and they have the rights over it... It's not as easy as saying resemble or not... If they're not making the outfit for sales, it's fine... However, unless they had permission, they are not to actually recreate similar/inspired outfits... Especially when the tinies' outfit is (roughly) based off the DOD outfits (though theirs is not for sale too)...

 

Erm. Someone mentioned earlier that Dream of Dolls' message wasn't directed at Angel Studio. The message at DoD was put out much earlier than Angel Studio's release of the tiny.

Anyhow, it's already been clarified that the costumes aren't for sale. And they've taken down the dolls.

When it comes to Kaori Yuki...I wouldn't pretend to know what the lady thinks but Japan is pretty blase when it comes to recreating anime/manga designs for sale. Doujin, cosplay accessories, costumes... They don't seem to really care that much. Since Angel Studio doesn't sell the costumes, I think displaying the dolls in the costumes really wouldn't be a big deal to Kaori Yuki.

 

I hope they have the dolls up again soon. I'm not interested in them personally but I do think that if the outfits aren't for sale and never were intended to be for sale then they shouldn't be in question. After all outfits can help sell a doll but so can wigs, eyes, posing, background as well as a over all picture. A lot of times everything that creates the image isn't for sale.
Otherwise this isnt the first anime / manga inspired outfit I've seen a company put on a doll and I don't think it will be the last. But I do think this is the first one i've seen that used the names of the characters modeling the doll so I guess thats why people were more upset about this incidence? I do have to point out the huge amount of fan good, doujinshi, etc in japan that does go without creator permission is slightly diffrent. There are people on DOA right now selling cosplay doll costumes like with a lot of other fan goods they are small press/ fan made. If an official company came out with an angel sanctuary novel based on the manga, I'm sure that the reaction for the Mangaka would be slightly diffrent. "Fans' get away with more >.> .

 

wow
I've never heard of this company before, those dolls are stunning~

 

So purty! Have to consider Angel Studio.

 

I hope the dolls go back up for sale soon... With pictures from other angles.

 

has somebody news from this two dolls? would angell sanctuary sell them again??? I NEED lucifer and gabriel since the first time i saw them! TT__TT
i'm really worried because they took them out of the website a few weeks ago and they're not back... i thought it was something quick (only a few new shots with other make-up and clothes...)
i know they had other dolls that are not for sale anymore (i think monica was the model name?) and i'm afraid that they're not planning to sale them again U__U

(sorry for my english O.o i'm not sure if i had express myself right)

 

Most likely they'll be back up but we're not sure how soon... And it's Angell-Studio, not Angell Sanctuary, though their outfit is based on it...

 

It's odd that they haven't just taken new pictures and put them back up... o_O

If they don't get her pictures back up on the site soon, I'll do a photoset with Elise (my Gabriel-) when she arrives. Hopefully someone will have ordered a Lucifer and can do the same with him once they get him.

At least that way there'll be pictures of them somewhere...