Do you consider Dollfie Dream to be a BJD?

I have a couple of DD/Obitsu hybrids (both ways...DD head/Obit body and Obit head/DD body) and I love the combination.

BTW - seeing your location makes me homesick. I need a dose of a kilted piper outside of Borders.

I hope you get your "dream" dolly one day.

 

Dollfie Dream and Obitsu may not be everyone's definition of BJD, but they are certainly related and fit very well in the realm of doll lovers. They deserve loving, and I simply despise when elitists mock them.

 

The vinyl dolls Mentioned in the OP are not ABJDs by the definition of DoA's On topicness they would be considered "off topic" simply because they are made out of vinyl and are not strung together as with the on topic BJDs.
They where grandfathered into the forum because at one point in the past they where strung with elastic like normal BJDs.

In my opinion: They are not BJDs,because they very different from normal BJDs. However they are still Dolls. Very pretty dolls. I wouldn't mind adding one to my collection.


The Admins can allow any doll they consider "on topic" It's their forum, we don't really get any say in this matter and there's a very good reason for this.
I'm sure there are plenty other places to discus "off topic" dolls like.....(Self censored.) Thought, I find it a bit strange as (Censored) is more "on-topic" then DDs are.

 

Certainly they are the definition of a 'ball jointed doll', but I don't consider them the same as a resin BJD, artist BJD or even antique bisque dolls. The term 'BJD' is something I've only heard used in this hobby and so I associate it with artist quality dollsmade of top materials with a certain style- basically like art pieces- any other doll with similar joints I'd just refer to as ball jointed. The DDs (and others) are more like large action figures or fashion dolls to me, with their more cartoony, softer stylization, and way they're presented and dressed by companies.

This is not a put down to DDs or Obitsu, etc, in fact I really like them and have considered getting a 50cm Obitsu boy on several occasions, however to me they're like two different creatures with similarities.

 

This thread was a very interesting read for me because, despite people I know having (apparently xD) owned them, I have never seen one in person. Therefore I have no opinion on whether or not I consider them BJDs, as I have nothing to ground that opinion on. *Goes off to do a search* xD

 

Some other people have alluded to this, but it does bother me that people are still casting DDs as "the cheap dolls". They may have been the budget line of Volks when they first came out, but the pricing of their character models is very much in line with that of the better Korean doll companies and basically everybody but Volks or Unoa. A lot of people still think of them as the "budget line", and in fact that's how the first ones I encountered were described to me, in '08, when they were already just as expensive as most resin dolls.

Somebody has probably mentioned this, by the way, but I didn't see it. Volks did make a few "Super Dollfie Dreams", which were some of the early DDI models cast in resin instead of vinyl!

 

I would like to say that this is indeed true. When I was pricing for another custom DD from volks, for the head + body + eyes + wig + a simple oufit it would have cost around $500 or so, which is on par with some fullset MSDs or a very very basic/blank SD. And that's just getting a custom one to suit my own tastes- that isn't even close to what some of the limited character DD's will run you for. As far as "cheap" dolls go, they are definitely on the higher side of things. Granted the image character models Volks offers are fairly cheap for what they are, but the way I see it they only work if those are exactly what you're looking for- otherwise it's probably more worth while to do what I did and get the head/body seperately and choose my own eyes and wig and makeup to go with them. Nowadays there are definitely much cheaper resin options.

Though I do have to admit that getting a DD is still just a tad cheaper than getting most other dolls of the same size from other well known companies. When I started I wanted a volks, because volks and luts were all I knew back then, but their sd's were a tad too pricey so I went with a DD instead. I did as above, ordered a head, a body, a set of eyes and a wig and a body stocking- if I recall it was upwards of $450 back then since the outfit i got her afterwards wasn't bought from volks. Sure it's no bobobie, but it wasn't an Sd13 Link either. Basic DDs are a great mid-range doll. Their limited editions however..... Lets just say you could probably get a fullset Soom for the price certain limited DDs go for....

 

I thought this was interesting. I had posted in this thread earlier as probably one of the very few people who DO NOT consider Dollfie Dreams as BJDs for very obvious reasons.

Even Volks does not consider them BJDs. http://site.volksusa.com/sumikatimes/2012/04/25/what-is-a-ball-jointed-doll/

I hope this further legitimizes that Dollfie Dreams are not BJDs. I hate seeing them looked down as "cheaper vinyl dolls" they're their own type of doll!

 

That sounds cool! Do they have silicone skin or something?

 

I was actually looking at Dollfie Dreams today, because my boyfriend was curious about the Saber doll.
He's a big fan of that anime, I've never seen it.
But anyways he was blown away when he saw her and said he would so get one over a figure any day.
The standard dollfie dreams, might be 'cheaper' than resin dolls the same size but the limited ones modeled to be anime characters are defiantly not cheap. (I saw a few going for $1,000 to $3,000 on ebay today)

As for are they BJDs? Well, even though they are on a skeleton they do have ball joints. They don't have elastic though. Others are right though, they deserve just as much respect as their resin cousins. They are beautiful, well made and amazingly cute! You can do a lot with them! ^_^

 

I pretty much do consider them BJDs even though most people classify them otherwise. I think of them as BJDs because when they were first developed, that's essentially, what they were and how they were made. They've just evolved a little since they were first created. ;D However, the biggest "BJD" trait they lack isn't the internal skeleton, but rather, the fact that they are not resin. That to me is the only real thing that could separate them from the BJDs. Either way, I tend to simplify things, other wise my head will explode. :P I will say that the fact that they have joints, were once strung with elastic and still require some internal structure to hold the whole body together always makes me think, BJD!

One thing that definitely irritates me is this idea that BJDs are artist dolls and DDs are not. O.o This just baffles me. They were constructed and designed with amazing ingenuity and creativity and were designed to be customized, and "brought to life" by their adopted owners, just as a BJD. In fact, I'd say they were inspired entirely from an art style. The quality of a DD is on par with a "BJD" it's just different. In fact... I see a lot more poor quality, "cheap" resin BJDs, but I won't mention any names. ;P

 

Of course! I'll admit I didn't like them as much until I saw one customized less anime more "manga". That is more lines and details put into the face-up. Than I fell for them hard!
How light they are is nice. The skeleton is a bit annoying compared to strings for me. But they're improving the mobility slowly but surely!
Besides, the only reason anyone thinks they are not is the doa rules. Which are Just in place to keep things a bit more orderly. As fun as this place is, it's not the end all or be all of classiphying dolls.
They still have the ball joints for movement, it's just what connects the balls that's different.

 

They have ball joints
But they're not the same type of ball joints as a standard bjd.

 

I am going to take away the personal sentimental factor, because although I have a DD I don't care if she's accepted as a whole DOA's crowd or even the ABJD, and I'll also remove the sentimental.

Dollfie Dreams in many ways fit the definition of ABJD, as defined by DOA, in spirit. They are highly customizable, the have very asian aesthetics, and they have that sense of creativity that ABJDs bring to the table. I am not just talking about the physical creativity, I'm talking about the photography, the imagining of why the doll may like this color over that color. The sort of weird things that doll collectors, as a majority, tend to do. I do them to my porcelain and antique dolls, my antique teddy bears have their own opinions on matters and I rarely touch those!

The most important thing is.. they are dolls, and we like them. *runs off clutching her Alna*

 

I've recently seen a DD in person and she was stunning. She certainly didn't look cheap. As for being a BJD, well, the main thing I liked about "BJDs" was the feel of the resin. I liked the weight and the fact that I don't have to worry as much about staining etc with dark outfits. So for a long time, BJDs had to be resin for me. But I've been collecting for a few years and now I find that I am drawn to different styles of dolls from what I used to collect ie Nefer Kane and others, who are also not considered typical BJDs and more 'art dolls'. It seems very hard to define what a BJD actually is these days. There are so many different styles and varieties from the original range of dolls. Even the joints on most dolls are no longer ball jointed but often peanut shaped for better posability. Now with all the unusual body shapes - pear shaped, elongated limbs, centaurs, centaur/moose/human hybrids (Doll Chateau Alberta) is there even really a standard? I'd have difficulty defining "Asian Aesthetic" these days. It may be made in Asia, but some have pointy chins and an anime look, others are hyper realistic, others are a blend of both. DoA has a large group who vote on selection criteria and even then people dispute their choices. At this stage, I'm like dollswholived and just picking dolls I like and not worrying whether they're true BJDs according to anyone else. I figure they fit the definition in spirit regardless.

 

That's not how much they cost from Volks. The limited Dollfie Dreams tend to go for between $650-800 (depending on how complex the outfit/faceup usually) brand new from Volks. Those several thousand dollars you see is the aftermarket cost. DDs actually go UP in value from the moment they are released, some more than others.

Anyway, I think DDs are BJDs. I mean, they technically do have the ball joints. The only difference is they are made out of vinyl instead of resin (upside to vinyl is they are much more durable and don't yellow, downside is they can get staining from wigs and clothes) and all of the DDs after the first editions are not strung.

I think people think they are cheaply made because, in comparison to resins of the same size, they are cheaper. However, they're quite well made. They can even use the same wigs/clothes/eyes that the resins do.

 

Can I just add my two cents to this discussion?

If it looks like a duck (IE: If it has ball joints) quacks like a duck (is able to be customized) and walks like a duck (poses well for photography) then it is a duck (BJD.)

 

I honestly feel like this shouldn't even be a debate thread. It's like it's asking "Are Dollfie Dreams good enough to be considered BJDs?".

Basically any doll is a BJD, but I feel Dollfie Dreams are not.

Arashi, "poses well for photography?" That's really not criteria regarding BJDs in my opinion. So if a doll has ball joints and can be customized but can't pose for photography, it's not a BJD? They don't even have to be photographed. Photography is just an aspect of the hobby, it doesn't rule what is or isn't a BJD.

 

I apologize I was tired when I wrote that post I wasn't really thinking I'm sorry.

 

Well... By the way we define a modern ball jointed doll, they really aren't one. That doesn't make them bad. I prefer obitsu, personally, but that's more an aesthetic thing, when it comes to heads...

But I digress... Both the large obitsu and the dollfie dream belong in their own category, I think...
Yeah, they aren't BJDs. Technically, yes, they're ball jointed...
But when the term BJD is tossed around now, it generally means ball jointed and strung together with elastic.
(Where the doll is made, or what it's made out of doesn't matter too much to me...)

By the modern usage, they aren't really the same thing, with their internal skeletons.

They're still of wonderful quality, and hold their poses better than BJDs.
They have a similar style, yes, but it's like comparing apples to oranges.