Dolly Cross-Dressing

Actually, I have the same feeling as you do (and I'm a female, go figure..), that's why you won't see any girly dolls in my crew. The most girly one is Timothy.. having a pink face-up, but even he is dressed in typical boy clothes and has short hair.
If you get a girl-mold, dressed in a frilly dress, with long wavy hair and a girlish face-up with lots of eye-shadow and acting all cute... I will only see a girl, no matter if the owner says otherwise. Of course I respect his/her opinion and I won't start a riot saying 'YOUR BOYDOLL IS NOT A BOYDOLL *OUTBIRK!!!1!!*', but I probably won't put that doll on my 'favorites' list. To each their own.

I personally think that the preference to make boy dolls gay or girly comes from the fact that many people here on this board are yaoi fans, or like slash. And just as people who are crazy about vampire stories will most likely have a vampire in their crew, people who love yaoi will want something like the manga they read or anime they watch.

 

Nice reply.

I would have to admit if I bought a male dollfie he would be feminised to a certain extent, because that is the nature of the canvas. Sexualising I couldn't bring myself to do because dollfies hold for me an unparrelled innocence. My girls look untouched and untouchable. A male dollfie would get the same treatment, and look pretty to boot.

 

I always thought that it was more difficult to make male molds that actually looks good. And because it can be difficult to include facial hair in the faceup. I think now that most MSD molds are girly because they're supposed to be kids. And I bet some of the reason for the girly boys are the culture in Japan and Asia. Guys dressed up in dresses, and the girls LOVE them. Yaoi and Bishonen are popular, and I think some japanese guys I saw on the streets there actually looked like girls. I bet some of them were though, girls dressed in guys clothes. ^^;

I haven't bought a male doll yet, because I can't find a MSD mold that doesn't look like a kid or a girl. I don't much anything against all the girly boys around here, but I don't want one myself. The owner loves their dolls, and that's what's matters. If I'll get a male SD, I think I'll end up with something from SOOM or Iplehouse.

Rant;
Yesterday, I found a preeeeetty doll I just fell in love with. Thought that THIS was the doll I had to have! It was a picture only to show a wig, but when I looked for the doll, I found out it was a guy. =_= I was pretty pissed, since I wanted it to be a girl and the fact that the site didn't sell separate heads.


btw, sorry for my crappy english. I'm norwegian!

 

I agree with prophetek's reply too. I'd have to say that yaoi is a big factor in why a lot of male dolls often get dressed up girly or are gay. But then, I also think the way male dolls are sculpted plays a role too.

Save for a select few companies that sell more masculine looking male dolls, most companies tend to sell boys that have a certain 'feminine' grace to them. Even if their bodies are obviously male, their faces are more beautiful than handsome in most of the cases.

I have absolutely nothing against someone turning their boy doll girly looking or making him gay (heck, my boy doll's character is based on my OC who is gay). As to why I decided to make him gay? I'd have to say he was straight to begin with but then I discovered yaoi.... Like many others, I ended up liking yaoi even though I realize a real-life gay relationship is not like the stuff seen in yaoi manga or anime.

I suppose it's just one of those girly fantasies of mine, I just like the idea of two pretty (or beautiful) looking men being together and then when I saw bjds and how pretty they were... it just seemed natural to me to model my doll after my own character who is pretty/beautiful and gay.

To each their own though. I am a little more perplexed about dressing boy dolls in really girly clothing. I'm not talking about the random kimono, stockings and lolita style clothing.. I'm talking about a male doll wear cutesy girly clothing of brighter colors (pink for example)

 

I agree with a lot of people on suggestions that its because of the obsession with yaoi that a lot of people own these types of dolls, but I also think there may be as many different reasons for it, as there are doll owners! I don't mind other people having dolls like this, but you won't catch my boys in a skirt, even if one of them is gay. I am not saying that it's wrong. (in fact I have male friend that dresses like a girl all the time and is very convincing, but he's not over the top.)

I, personally love girl molds (I have 2) and they both have male partners. I have one male doll who's gay, and it really came from wanting to have different relationships in one house. I'm not a yaoi fan mainly because I like relationships of any kinds portrayed naturally, not over the top. (This could possibly stem from having both gay and lesbian friends). I could never dress my boys in skirts or dresses because it just isn't them. I have this thing with my dolls, and you can call me wierd but I would never do anything to a doll I wouldn't do to a human. I wouldn't make my guy friends or a boyfriend wear dresses or skirts. I'm big on respect for them even if it is a resin doll. they all have personalities that come out as you work with them. Some turn out girly, some masculine, some straight, some gay. I think its really owner preference, though no one will ever figure out exactly why. Maybe a lot of girls do this because its the type of guy they find attractive? Perhaps they like the appeal of an innocent feminine guy? Perhaps they are attracted to the females aesthetic but given their dislike for competition, they give these female qualities to males? Or heck, they may just think it's cute! It's one of those topics that everyones going to have an opinion on

just my $0.02. No offense intended!

 

Some very good points in this thread~!

I had a doll once, that I dressed in dresses and such, simply because I couldn't afford a girl doll at the time, plus, I thought it was cute, and my poor doll looked even more pissy in it XD The boy I have now, is, yes, gay. However, like others, it's because of the story he comes from.

Now, would I put him in a dress? I highly doubt it. Simply because it's not in his personality to do so....and he knows where I keep my knife....

As to why it seems most people have gay or girly dolls (I think it's much less than 99%...perhaps 75-80%, and that's still pushing it.), maybe they simply got a boy mold first, and don't have the money to get a girl? Perhaps it's part of their story?

Either way, it's the person's personal preference. Yes, most male molds are softer, more effeminate, harder to put 'harsh' or 'manly' face ups on, even with some squaring of the jaw, and sanding of the cheekbones. Such a thing could be inspired by BL manga, and anime all around, or it can also be based on the fact that Asian males are very small. They have small bones, very soft faces in general. It could possibly be the combination of both as well!

And it's natural for people to want pretty things. Pretty jewelry (that I don't understand XD), hair, beautiful make up to look beautiful, beautiful clothes. We look at beautiful art, scenery, etc. etc.! So why not have pretty boy dolls too?

Back to dressing them in 'girl clothes', as I said in the cross-dressing thread, 'if girls can get away with wearing pants, t-shirts, and boots, why can't boys get away with wearing skirts, blouses, and heels?' Why limit what you or your doll can wear simply because society says it's wrong? If a boy doll wants to wear girl clothing, and he looks good doing it, go right ahead! O_O They have a better figure than me, so...WHOO HOO!

 

You just reminded me of something I forgot to mention in my own post. Although I don't really understand why people would want to dress their boy dolls up all pretty and cutesy (as in Sailor Moon cutesy), I did and still do want to buy a ridiculously cute outfit for my boy doll and force him to wear it just because I know he'll hate it and he'll be extremely pissed off with me

That's the only reason I'd ever dress my boy dolls up in girly clothing I think... just to piss them off

 

By virtue of the sculpt, it's easy to see it and then do it. No matter how much makeup you put on, say, Chuck Norris, he ain't ever going to look like a proper Victorian girl, but dollfie are already somewhat androgynous as part of their styling, or at least most are. It may be a holdover from manga and the yaoi trend, but people see that and want to try crossdressing it or making it gay. Can't say I object, but I can't say I like it either because it's like another doll stereotype to deal with.

 

lol'ing forever at that mental image.

My fellows are straight. I have a duncan so he COULD do girl clothes but the body just isnt a girl so I never put him in a dress. Only reason I would have considered it would be because sometimes I want to sew things with ruffles and lace and thats kinda hard to incorporate into a mans outfit and still have it look like a mans outfit.

 

Well I wouldn't put my boy in a skirt. Just because, well... It's not something he would do.

I might have a cross-dressing doll at some point though. xD Guess you never know.

And as for why there are so many gay or girly dolls... I agree that it has something to do with their moulds. They just look... Pretty.

 

Not quite the subject here, and then again: Yaoi. I read slash (the lines between slash and yaoi is blurry if they're there at all) and I wastly prefer it to het stories because.. het stories just scream "PORN" to me. I'm not quite sure why graphic descriptions of sex between men doesn't trigger the same response in me, it just doesn't.

And so it seems more "safe" to pair up two male dolls instead of a male and a female.

Personally, being a female, I would also prefer to look at a nude male to a nuce female any time. Nude females are.. well.. bleh. A nude man otoh can be quite interesting

I have bought me a female doll to have an outlet for my "frilly tendencies" *L* Something I didn't even know I had before I got my first doll

 

I think it's interesting that some people consider it a matter of 'respect' to not dress a boy as a girl. There's this assumption that if a boy dresses, acts or looks like what we'd considered feminine, then he loses his dignity or is being humiliated. The same doesn't apply in reverse anymore, although from what I understand of history, it used to in the past. If you had a woman dressing or looking or acting like a man, it was considered somehow humiliating for her. Having a girl wear pants would be like taking away her dignity.

Since we no longer think this way, it's very difficult for us to imagine. It's kind of amazing the extent to which our ideas about this have been transformed, although of course, that's not true all over the world. We now consider it perfectly natural for a girl to do things that would once have been considered manly. In fact, we value that quality in women, and it's almost ridiculous to suggest that someone should feel ashamed of that or even find it odd.

I don't think it's right or wrong for people to prefer 'girly' dolls or 'manly' dolls. I don't think it's JUST a matter of personal preference either. We're shaped by a lot of different factors and even within the same culture, there are a lot of competing ideas and ideologies. Depending on what's influenced you, you might be led to interpret dressing a man as a woman as something that liberates him or as something that denigrates him. Certainly there are men who feel liberated by it and others who feel denigrated by it in real life as well! The people who feel that it's liberating will be more likely to want to do it and the ones who think its humiliating probably won't (unless there are some unexplored sexual issues going on there, but that doesn't seem to be the case for the majority of people in doll fandom.)

Anytime you start messing with a concept that has some sort of fixed definition in society, you're going to start making people uncomfortable. I don't feel that people on either side of that equation are wrong, though. That's just the way it is. If you had a child who acts like an adult, who does things that we consider only an adult should do, such as holding a job, driving a car, or having sex, people are going to get uncomfortable. On the other hand, an adult who wants to spend all their time playing games made for kids or acts heavily reliant on his/her parents would also make people uncomfortable, although admittedly less so. It's not a perfect comparison, I know. Generally, people who hold jobs, drive cars and have sex should be responsible or they're likely to hurt themselves and others and children are not known to be terribly responsible. (Then again, a lot of adults aren't either...) But whether you wear pants or skirts isn't really going to hurt anybody. It's just an article of clothing. Still, because it gets tied into our ideas about what men or women should or shouldn't do, if you have someone wearing something that is considered 'girly' but they are not actually a girl, then it's like getting a mixed message. I'm sure that this would be even more upsetting if the man had signs that clearly marked him as 'manly,' such as having a beard or rippling muscles. A slender boy in a skirt is less likely to offend than a rugged beefcake in a skirt and also less likely to seem like a parody.

For some people, the conflicting messages are pleasant. For others, they're upsetting on some fundamental level. Regardless of how we personally feel about the dolls, though, as long as we can respect that each response is valid, we shouldn't have any conflict with each other.

But to get back to the question at hand, I'd imagine the reason that there are probably so many 'girly boy' dolls is because more women in this fandom find that breaking those distinctions between male and female brings them pleasure. Gender is a pretty big issue for women today and it's tied into the body. And what is a doll, after all, but a representation of the human body? It seems natural to me that you'd have people fooling around with breaking or maintaining gender distinctions when they're playing with dolls. And since we're all adolescents or adults around here, I think it's to be expected that we'd be more likely to do it in a way that questions the status quo rather than reinforces it.

 

I do not think 99% of the boy dolls out there are gay or girly.

I guess I am one of those, who do not really create a background for my dolls, so they actually do not have any so-called "sexuality". I do not dress them in skirt or girly stuff. (ok, i did dress 2 in Kimono once, that is because I love kimonos - but I have gotten male kimono now for them.)

I have also seen a lot of "regularly" dressed boys out there, so once again I disagree with that 99% of boy dolls are gay or girly

 

What he said.

It's familiar, it's pleasing. I'm in.

 

Reactions:
1.
Girl sees a cute uke looking boy. (example Shuichi from gravitation)
EVERYONE likes Shuichi. He's just so cute and adorable! ^^ It makes us go goo goo ga ga!

2.
Girl sees ugly old man. Bands together with other fangirls:
"You are a crime against yaoi and everything that is bishie! DIEEEEEEE!!!!*


Well thats just my opinion. We're just way more attracted to the beautiful kind. ^^

 

Reflecting peoples personal likes/tastes?

When I see questions like this it really irks me because its like asking someone to explain themselves when they really shouldn't have to. Sorry....

I have all straight characters so far even the really pretty boys , one however it sort of "open", I don't want to attach a name to him because I like the idea of him not being bogged down and just free xD He doesn't wear girly things how ever he does wear unusual thing but he's never "girly".
I have and have had a lot of girl dolls (and Im a girl), I find I can't stand them in girly dresses and like casual to just slightly tomboyish. Just my personal opinion.

I like Yaoi etc but I wouldn't want to put that into my dolls. At least I don't think so xD
The characters for me just develop over time and aren't usually though out before hand.

I'd like to say exactly why there are so many "girly" dolls but you can't, you can speculate but people all have different reasons and maybe yaoi is a big part but it can't be a reason for all of them.

 

There are many reasons why females like yaoi. I personally find it more visually pleasing than het erotica. I like some Yuri too (though I'm very picky about it), so it's not a dislike of my fellow women. It makes sense though, if you like to look at guys, why not just look at guys, why add a female character. Yaoi is not only over-the-top drag queen characters, though, just so you know.

Really how a person dresses their boys is all about personal preference and nothing else. Some have very femmy boys, some have manly men, and others fall in between. While there are some sculpts that are very easy to make more feminine, a lot also comes down to clothes, faceups, wigs etc. I have one very feminine boy, a couple who fall kind of inbetween and a lot of pretty typical guys. Some of my more typical guys probably fall into the category of having more bishi looking sculpts, but I don't think anyone would mistake them for girls.

I agree with nadiaff who wrote this:

Playing with gender can be very enjoyable, especially when you live in a society that has pretty strict ideas of what is feminine and what is masculine. On a personal note, I like to see gender stereotypes challenged--trying to fit people into little boxes by gender and then judging the heck out of them when they don't fit neatly is pretty silly to me. And the idea that any show of "feminine" behavior from a man is bad, weak, humiliating really peeves me off, because if you follow that line of thinking to it's natural conclusion it says some negative things about being female. This might not always be intended--I think sometimes it just stems from discomfort over what is different, but when you really stop to think about it...what's really so bad about being feminine???

 

I think this thread has been done like a thousand times, but here I go with my answer.

Yes, my male dolls are gay. Dietre though is a child (at the moment, going to get an SD version of him soon) so it doesnt come into play. However there is no way you could mistake him for a girl.

Mao has pink hair and a weird sense of fashion, but I hate the thought of him being seen as "girly". He doesn't "act" girly in photostories. He is very assertive and demanding.

So many MNF Shiwoos are sweet little powder puff girly boys with frilly panties and whatnot, to the point where I enjoy that Mao breaks that stereotype a bit.

Even if he does have pink hair. xD

Edit:
Haha, oops didn't give my reasoning over having gay boy dolls.

I think its because, though I'm a girl, I have a hard time connecting with my feminine side. I can't connect to female characters, I never have been able to, they just seem to get lumped into "pretty girl who needs saving" "tomboy" "unrealisticly bad ass warrior" in my head. Where as boys seem to have a wider scope.

I also have a hard time understanding men, but in the real world, i mean.

But in books/movies/etc, you see more sides to them, know their motivations and the emotions they hide. They have vulnerability. So I am far more interested and entertained by male characters.

I have a girl doll, but she doesn't speak to me like my boys do. I got her because I find the mold cute and pretty and i like dresses and tights.

 

Well, I don't have Anjiro home yet, but AFAIK he's neither girly nor gay. He's even got a girlfriend in my head (no, not me, stop looking at me like that).

To be honest, I'm not particularly fond of yaoi. There's a couple of male/male pairings I support or at least acknowledge the possibility of, but for the most part yaoi leaves me feeling meh.

I have nothing against any committed relationship (boy/girl, girl/boy, boy/boy, girl/girl, or even boy/girl/boy for that matter and all its permutations), but the whole concept of "pretty boys [insert favorite euphemism for sex here]ing just so I can watch SQUEE!!!@#" is a big fat turn-off for me. We're talking smelly warthog butt level of turn-off here.

And before anybody out there starts screaming "OMG you homophobe!" (not that anyone on DoA would, I shouldn't think), I am (a) female and (b) in a long-term committed same-sex relationship. (I'm not a lesbian, but my girlfriend of 20 years is.)

 

I feel the same way, but I think that's because yaoi is generally written for girls and yuri for boys. Now this is just my personal opinion, but girls are more attracted to romance, hence the plot line and story which builds up to an intimate scene in yaoi, while guys are looking for a quicker turn-on, hence the larger attraction to het and yuri. I'm not saying yuri can't be romantic too, just that it's laid out at a different pace than yaoi. There's that "aaaawwwww, so sweet!" that I feel when two male characters say they love eachother, or conflict is resolved, after a deep and sometimes traumatic or sad beginning, that I just don't get with het or yuri. And as others have said, it's definately an escape and it's not realistic (although it would be nice if such resolution did happen in real life....and probably has to some people )

In regards to my boy, I'm pretty sure he's straight * he loves shopping for prospective girl dolls with me . But as I am a person who believes it doesn't matter who you fall in love with, male or female, if he finds a boy doll he goes head over heels for, thats fine by me. I don't know if I'd call it gay though, since its a specific person instead of males in general...if that makes sense.

In regards to dressing up boys as girls, I think we do it cause we can. I don't really see myself dressing my boy in girls clothes, but if I saw an adorable Lolita dress he'd look great in, I'd totally get it and put him in it. Not because he's girly or gay, but because, like cosplay is for me, it'd be an escape, as well as something fun and different for him to do. Even though he'd probably kill me for it