If a doll has the aesthetic style of an ABJD, but made in the US, is it allowed?

I never took ABJD style to mean that the dolls must look like they are Asian. Take a look at all the "anime" molds from Volks. You can't say that they look Asian, but they are most definitely ABJD as far as the aesthetic goes.

 

I've found that (for the most part) despite the differences in style between ABJD companies, that they still look different from Western style dolls. It's not a realism thing, or how ethnically Asian they look (most bjds are fairly ambiguous looking in terms of ethnicity), they just look different. It probably has something to do with facial proportions.

 

Most ABJD dolls don't look any paticular race, as Taco said they are ambigous. Even dolls like cocori look different form German and American dolls, due to the facial proportions. In the case of Goodreau doll, well, they were sculpted by someone who had never seen a bjd before, so no wonder they just don't like abjd style.

 

I have sculpted and he is finished and being poured right now. Two boys...and they are beautiful to me. They are only my second sculpt so they took rather long. You are right I was a little disappointed, but alot of people love them. I retired them and I am on to new sculpts. I resculpted the body and I have a few just fun peices coming. But truth is I am not disappointed in disallowing the discussion of the dolls . I won't mention them!! If you want to see my boy's with permission I will post them. Paulette

 

Well, Paulette, I'd be very interested in seeing some photos of your new boys! You can PM them to me, since they are off-topic and I don't want to get you into trouble. Perhaps you could start a list and just communicate privately with those that are interested in your dolls?

 

Are all Goodreau bjds (now and forever into the future) disallowed? Or is it only the first group?

Seems to me, if the artist comes up with a new concept and new aesthetic it should be reconsidered and evaluated on its own merits as to whether it meets the criteria?
after all, some dolls of other brands (that don't meet criteria) are banned but not everything from the brand (eg, Obitsu, Volks)

 

It will really depend on what the next "batch" look like.

There are a lot of other things to consider, though. For example, If we say that the new ones are okay but not the old, we will have people complaining that we should allow ALL Goodreau dolls because they like Sculpt X, so why can't they post it here? There's also the issue of confusion. There are enough rules already without adding more nitpicky specifics.

And vinyl vs. resin is also a sticking point. If we disallow the vinyl and allow the resin... even though it's in the criteria, people will make it into an issue of cost, rather than an issue of if they actually FIT on the board. It'll be "Oooh, you just don't allow them because they're CHEAPER! Elitists! You only let dolls on DoA if they're expensive."

 

The Hautlier Miso is allowed but the boy, Ian (is that his name, I can't remember) is not, and the RanD Angel girls aren't allowed, but the boys are. I wouldn't think it would be a problem to allow the second batch and not the first, since things like this seem to happen.

Of course, it's up to the mods to decide (not trying to argue).

 

if the mods didn't limit the amount of dolls that are allowed to be talked about here, then we'd be having discussions on everything from BJD's to Barbie.

 

So if you took a Dollfie Dream body, which is allowed, and stuck a non-BJD doll head on it, then would it be considered OT? For example, what if someone took a Goodreau head and put it on a DD body? The body is allowed, even though it's not resin, but the head wouldn't have the "Asian aesthetic". Or for that matter, what if someone stuck a Bratz head on a MSD body? (Blasphemy, I know. But I've seen it done.) Or how about a resin BJD head on an obitsu? It seems like the rule is "It has to fit all the criteria...unless it's involving that vinyl body made by Volks." Is Volks above the "law"?

And no, CBAB, I don't think anyone wants to talk about Barbies here. But the rules are kind of fuzzy when it comes to the actual definition of ABJD. With new companies coming out all the time, the American doll market and the Asian doll market are eventually going to affect each other, eventually resulting in some hybrids that are "sort of" BJDs, like the Goodreau dolls. It can be confusing to hear that this BJD is allowed, but that one isn't. Especially when there are exceptions to the rules, like the DD body.

Ah well, I've heard the DD body kind of sucks anyway. Best to stick to resin.

 

Stoner Kitty, the 60cm vinyl bodies and heads made by Obitsu were also grandfathered in, so by your logic, "Volks and Obitsu are above the law." Sheesh.

The DD body is extremely poseable and has a lot of advantages over resin bodies. There are pros and cons to every type of body (I *loved* the Obitsu magnetic feet, but didn't care for the "squishy" feel of the body), and one is definitely not "better" than the other.

-- A :P

 

To answer some of the questions being posed -- new dolls are accepted on a case-by-case basis, so a new batch of Goodreau dolls (sculpted ABJD style, cast in resin, presented/marketed in ABJD style as opposed to fashion-doll style) would certainly be considered if they were submitted to us for acceptance.

Non-ABJD heads (and "ABJD", btw, originally stood for "Asian Ball-Jointed Dolls" and has been expanded to "Asian-style Ball-Jointed Dolls" as the board has grown) on ABJD bodies would again be a case-by-case issue -- obviously, a Bratz head on an MSD body isn't what this board is aimed towards (although there have been some pretty funny Gallery posts with head-substitutes when heads have been off for face-ups!)

And to repeat what the other mods have said -- "Asian-style Ball-Jointed Dolls" don't have to look ETHNICALLY ASIAN, but they need to fit the "Asian doll aesthetic," which I admit is somewhat nebulous but it's pretty immediately recognizable when you look at a group of dolls that have logically evolved from the first ABJDs. And, again, it's a mod decision in the end whether new dolls are acceptable -- if Volks put out a Pullip, it wouldn't automatically be allowed -- in fact, the BJD-like Volks Customize Kits *aren't* allowed, because they don't meet all of our criteria.

Hope this makes things at least marginally clearer?

-- A

 

Ashbet, i just wanted to ask, and i'm not trying to be ridiculous, I'm just curious...If someone took a head from say a Goodreau doll, and modified it to be more asian in asthetic, could they legitimately bring that doll on here for discussion or pictures, etc? Or would it still be off topic? Just curious, not trying to sound stubborn or anything..

 

Hi Paulette
I would also love to see photos of your new boys!
If you start that list please add me to it. ^_^

I spoke with you at the Disney Doll and Bear Show, and asked if you were planning to eventually produce boy BJD dolls.
Are these the boys that you mentioned might be coming out in January 2008?

 

we really can't know if we are interested in her dolls if we aren't allowed to see them, or know even what they are like :: sigh :: I do think this is a little silly that artist created BJDs are not allowed now. But, i don't make the rules. I guess everyone who makes them, will find places to advertise them.

 

DoA is a community, not an advertising forum. It's not our job to give companies exposure. If a doll or company fits, they can be posted here... but otherwise, it's that company's job to find their niche. This artist has her own website and sells through distributors, so it is possible to see her work on places other than DoA. You wouldn't expect us to allow Evangeline Ghastly advertisements or progress photos here; you'd just go look on Tonner's site. It's the same situation.

Artist-made BJDs are allowed if they fit the criteria - such as Liebchen, Bishonen House, Twiglimbs, etc. We have not put a blanket ban on "artist created" or non-Asian dolls. But they are subject to the same criteria as any other dolls and can be disallowed the same way.

I think it's worth mentioning that DoA is a forum that was created for a specific style of doll, not a great big hug to everything human-shaped with more than 4 points of articulation. Please keep in mind that in order for a huge forum like DoA to function, it needs to have limits as to what is on-topic. Other dolls are great (I love all sorts!), but they may not be suitable for DoA - and y'know, that's okay! It doesn't make them any less special or interesting, just OT here.

 

They're still dolls to me. I don't mind Pullips, 1/6's, Pinky St's, etc at doll gatherings.

But if I understand correctly, the standards apply to DoA only.

 

But I'm STILL curious about my question that I asked Ashbet If someone takes the head from, say, a Goodreau doll, and modifies it to be more asian in asthetic, then can they post about that doll, or would it still be not allowed? (just curious here) LOL

Or would said doll also have to be approved by DOA?

 

In that individual situation, you could submit the doll to the moderators for approval -- however, since it's already been deemed an off-topic doll, it would have to be an exceptional modification. (Just like we don't allow artist-made heads on Volks EB bodies -- the doll is still off-topic even if the head meets ABJD criteria.)

(Sorry, wasn't online for most of the weekend and didn't see this!)

-- A