Importance of doll certificate?

I am a BIG Dollstown fan and collector. When I started buying from the company there were no certificates and the elf, 7 year and 5 year sizes did not come with the blue Dollstown box, just a brown shipper box with bubble wrap, no pillows either. I have also sent a head to be painted and mistakenly left the cert in the box I received it in and never got it back. So I guess if I try to sell them I will be thought to be a scammer and selling fraudulent dolls? This doesn't seem to be totally fair but I don't know how to 'prove' their legitimacy.

 

I don't care about COA's because I do not typically re-sell dolls, but that has bit me in the bum. I sold a discontinued doll and because I had lost the COA, I ended up letting him go dirt cheap. I was able to give the buyer piece of mind knowing the doll has never been recasted, but I think with the COA I would have been able to ask more for him.

When I sold a doll as a split, I kept the head and the other person took the body, There were very specific about wanting a copy of the COA. Since I met them in person, I both copied the COA and brought the original for them to see. It really helped give the buyer piece of mind seeing the actual COA even I did keep it.

 

This is tough. Ordinarily, certificates don't matter to me. I never had the mindset of that type of collector who needed it to feel the doll was complete. I didn't throw them away, but I didn't keep careful track of where they went either.

But with the rise of recasts and dishonest sellers..it's all just such a shame. I know how easy it is to lose a certificate or simply have a doll that didn't come with one, yet I feel I have to protect myself from what I'm buying. I almost feel like I'm forced to put such importance on them, when back when I first joined the hobby, I never gave them much thought. For this purpose, I almost exclusively purchase my dolls directly from the company now, as it ensures I won't receive anything other than the real thing.

I also don't typically sell my dolls all that often anymore, but admittedly, I've also become more aware of the certificates when I receive them and where I store them. It's a bit of a pain as I still don't really care THAT much about them myself, and it's just another thing I have to keep track of, but I know they're quite important this day and age in the BJD hobby.

 

Very important, especially with the rise of recasts. I won't buy a doll that doesn't have one.

 

I keep CoAs in a drawer in my room, just in case I'll ever sell the doll they came with. My older Fairyland dolls don't have them though, and neither do the recent event heads. I just bought a doll from someone who didn't have the CoA, so obviously it's not a deal breaker for me. I understand that things get lost over time as it was obvious that this doll is older (my guess is 8 years as her resin looks just like another doll I have from that company from that time). However, if someone was claiming that the doll was brand new and didn't have their company CoA, that would make me suspicious. I would also be more cautious if the doll was known to be recast.

 

I don't think that would be very useful for me personally as I honestly don't think I could tell the difference for most parts. It doesn't seem like a super effective money-making strategy to just swap out a few parts either, and I believe a lot of recasts have some size differences from the originals which could make them incompatible. I also hate restringing. I like to keep an eye on problem transactions in the community (basically gossip) and I've never heard of anyone doing that (though of course it is possible). I think what I would be most concerned about is making sure the body and head are both legitimate. If I were suspicious about someone selling a hybrid legit/recast as legit, I wouldn't buy it, as that seems hard to prove and harder to get a refund after you possess it. I wouldn't want to try to explain that to PayPal, lol.

With the specific doll I just bought, she has the metal plates from Latidoll, she is obviously quite old, she has a distinctive Lati default faceup, and I don't think her sculpt has been recast. The missing CoA was therefore not a big deal to me. It definitely is case-by-case for me though.

 

I just got a Dollits DAD Rey with factory faceup but I hate the faceup on him as he looks likes he's about to cry. I switched his head with another head I had until I decide what to do with it by either selling it or send out to repaint it. I'd send a copy of the COA with the head if I ever sold it, though I don't think I will. I like this thread as I like to hear what others say.

 

Well, I have bad experience when I still beginner, I accidently buy recast that I think that is legit, So I just give it to someone else when I know that is recast, and saving up to purchase legit doll, and now I wait for the doll to delivered to me. It takes a long time for me to buy the legit one. Now, I will always check the shop that only sell legit and I will try to buy through the company website. The doll is very light, and their string is like loose and can't hold the pose, and if you see inside the joint you can see that the resin very thin, inside the doll head sometimes the surface not really good. And I didn't see any stamp in the back of the head. Oh, the hand or feet is like the finger stick together. Sometimes their body or the head little bit smaller. Even if the recaster really pro you still can tell that is recast one when you put the recast and legit side by side.

 

It's not that important to me, unless I have reason to believe the doll might not be legit.

I've been in the hobby for nine years, and when I joined, many dolls didn't have a CoA in the first place, some didn't even have boxes! Recasts were very uncommon back then, almost unheard of and the few that did exist were hard to find and such awful quality, there would be no doubt that that it was fake. I think because I never had a reason for a CoA in the first few years, it just doesn't occur to me to ask most of the time now. It bothers me that people will automatically assume that lack of a CoA automatically means recast, when so many wonderful older legit dolls never had them.

I only buy secondhand dolls on DoA or from trusted local people and friends. Even then, I do check feedback and sometimes look for box opening photos, but lack of CoA certainly won't stop me from buying a doll I love.

 

Really? I've never heard of recasters making fake CoAs. I've only seen one case where a fake CoA was provided in a secondhand sale and the legitimacy of the head was in doubt.

 

I have seen fake CoAs as well as fake headplates, unfortunately. :/ I don't know if that's a common thing, but I know it does happen. It's extremely frustrating because a legit doll may have never had a CoA or headplate (I own a Volks School A head who never had either, for example), but a recast doll could have both.

 

Yep. Fake head-plates have been around for a few years now, and fake CoAs have also been spotted. Soom fakes in particular seem prone to those.

Instead of relying only on CoAs (which many older dolls won't have) or boxes(which many owners don't keep), or opening threads (which not everyone posts for every doll they own), the wisest thing for you guys to do is to learn what to look out for. Do your homework. Get to know the dolls you're interested in well. Research, look at comparison pictures and if you still have questions about a specific sale... go to the discussion thread for that type or brand of doll and ask the rest of us to have a look at it. There are people here on DOA who are as close to subject experts on their favorite lines as you're likely to find anywhere. Don't skip that resource.

 

That.

My most recent purchase was a Volks limited without a cert. Granted, this particular limited is an older one and not known to be recast as often as his more recent 'big brother' is, and I got him from a reputable source, but I still had two of the mods verify his authenticity before I bought him. As I never intend to sell him, I didn't see the cert as being quite as vital as if I'd been thinking about possibly passing him on further down the line. (Since he's my almighty holy grail doll, I am NOT going to let him go, hell no.) The members of DoA are a MASSIVE and extensive resource. You can't rely on basic touchstones that may or may not even exist (one of my dolls has a CoA but never even came with a box, and most of the rest never had certs to begin with as they're older and predate the recent rush of recasts by quite a few years). A CoA alone will not tell you if something is or is not a recast. Homework, however, is far more likely to do so.

 

I would if I knew the seller, or if I had other means of being reasonably sure I was buying a legit doll-- I mean, I know there are some dolls, particularly older ones, which didn't have certificates, plus I know firsthand how easy it is to lose one (or three)... so I don't feel like I can pass blanket judgment on every seller not to have the CoA. But, there aren't many dolls I feel the need to have that I need to go to the secondhand market for, compared to how many dolls I like that are currently being produced (the one exception being a doll that I never see on the secondhand market anyway), so I haven't really had to sweat that question too hard.

 

Most of my dolls didn't come with COAs even though I got them directly from the company. Back when I bought most of mine it was rare for that to be included, because recasting wasn't such a big issue. Bluefairy, Dream of Doll, Oriantdoll, and Angel Region came with no COA, Doll in Mind doll was the only one that did.

I would never buy a newer doll without a COA, there are other ways to tell, and sure I know they get lost, but I don't have any dolls I am attached to the idea of getting that I would bother. We all know how important proving the doll is real has become, so I'm very careful with my newer dolls COAs (and the ones for the DIM dolls) I don't think I'll ever sell my newer ones, but I still want to be able to prove they are the real deal.

I'm happy I kept my boxes for my older dolls. It's a bit of extra assurance for the buyer. I almost got rid of them at one point, boy am I glad I didn't go though with that!xD I also am always willing to take new photos or share older ones, something I would expect from any seller if I was buying. There is not reason that they can't do that if it's a legitimate doll. (well maybe not old photos as some people might not hold on to everything the way I do! xD) Still, research is the best thing to do. Like others mentioned DoA is an amazig resorce and you can learn all sorts of things about the many different dolls here.

If I bought a secondhand doll and they said they had the COA but didn't give it to me I would be pissed... Unless it was a split and I was only buying the body, but I would expect a photocopy signed by the previous owner at that point. If they offer that kind of
assurance you should receive it. But then I would be unhappy if they didn't send anything that they had in the original add.... because you should get what you paid for.

 

CoAs don't mean as much to me as a seller's reputation. If they are reputable I'm not worried about it. Certain companies don't provide CoAs, and others only have started to recently, in the past couple of years.

I understand that there are things to look out for, but there also has to be some level of trust between pro-artist collectors. There are many collectors that I would trust to never mislead about the authenticity of an item that I wouldn't hesitate to buy from without a CoA. Plus, if they are the first owner and it is a newer doll they should be able to provide a screenshot/receipt/etc from the company even if there is no CoA. I know that FL still has my order info. from 7 years ago on their website (and I have kept it in my email), so that helps too.

 

I will never buy a doll without a CoA if that doll, bought new, comes with one from the company. If the doll I want was bought at a time when the company did not make them, and secondhand is the only way I can get this doll, I will accept other forms of proof that the doll is legit, but other than that, at this point, I will not buy a doll secondhand if it won't come with its CoA. Most every doll I want comes from a company that is heavily recasted, and I am not willing to risk it.

 

having a certificate or birth card is 200% important for me 'cause with the cert i know that the item i'm buying is authentic and i wouldn't have to worry that i spend my money on the real thing and not just a recast, because bjd's prices is nothing to joke about.