Should Second-Hand Buyers pay back YOUR shipping?

It ends when the price is too high for any buyer to be interested. That's the natural way things work in a "hobby economy" like ours. But remember that except in the case of untouched, new dolls, there are almost always other factors involved that mitigate and/or raise the cost -- damage, yellowing, sanded seams, increase in popularity, and so on. So it can be hard to tell if you're really being charged "orginal price+2 shipping+2customs" or if you're just paying a premium for demand. On the other hand, you might be charged "original price+2 shipping+2customs" but still get a deal due to damage. It's rarely clear.

A few people have said now that they just don't like the fact that sellers itemize the shipping/customs in their sales post. But when thinking about this today, I realized that it is a very different issue from the original one posed by the OP, who said:

She's arguing that the cost shouldn't be part of the seller's price at all, not just that it's impolite to mention it. So I guess some of us have started talking about two separate things. I agree with one -- that's it's needless to itemize -- but I don't agree that the seller has no right to incorporate his costs in the first place.

To those who really feel that incorporating shipping, customs, and other fees into an item's selling price is immoral, I have to ask -- is it an issue for you to pay the prices charged at your local grocery store, department store, or hobby shop? Because they are also working those costs into their prices, and I don't see anyone arguing that their prices are morally wrong (at least not on that basis).

 

Allowed, YES
Ethically NO

I think that the shipping paid to get the items imported from abroad is a cost that should be eaten by the person who bought the item to begin with...
Many times an outfit is not new because it was used to dress a doll in for a couple of snapshots... if that is the case then the item should not be listed as new which i am sure many people are guilty of on DOA. Since these items are listed as "new" which they are not because they have been used, even if only slightly, the price should be lowered some and the shipping should be eaten.

take an ethics class and then ask the instructor what they think and they would probably agree that while it is something that happens and is permitted to happen, it may not be the right thing to do.

 

In my opinion, when selling something second hand, the value decreases. Even if the product is like new, the maximum price I'd list it for would be the original price EXCLUDING the shipping.

 

In a free market, the seller is allowed to set whatever price they want to, and the buyer has a right not to buy if the price isn't something they like.

As a potential buyer of a second hand doll myself, I'm prepared to pay the original price + shipping that the seller paid as the original cost in addition to shipping in order to get the doll to me. To some people it may not be fair, but to me, it does seem fair, especially if the seller really needs their money back.

 

I don't think getting back their shipping cost should ever be one of a seller's goals when making a sale. As others have said, items on the secondhand market generally depreciate in value unless there is a special circumstance, such as the item being limited or discontinued. I agree that it is immoral to stick a price jack on something because you want your initial purchase value back - every penny of it. I view shipping as a seperate entity, a way for your purchase to get from one place to another, not something that is averaged into the lump sum value of a good. In other words, shipping, in my opinion, is something between the buyer and the post office, not the buyer and the seller.

Asking for your initial purchase price plus the cost of shipping quickly makes an item overpriced. Of course a seller has a right to do it, but I personally do not agree with the practice and would rather buy an item new if possible than to buy it second hand with what is essentially double the shipping cost attached.

And in the case of arguing that every good on the market, such as general department store items, are marked up to reflect shipping the case is different. Those goods are purchased at bulk rates and generally shipped at media mail fees (cheap!). In other words, the shipping price, while it is applicable to an extent, is so low that it really should not be taken into consideration. It isn't the $30-$60 shipping fee we associate with dolls.

 

Like many people have said the word "allow" is not really the right one. You can't stop anyone from asking whatever they want, all you can do is not buy if you are not pleased.

As a seller I wouldn't ask for the shipping costs. When something is sold second hand the value generaly decreases, you can't get back everything you paid for it originaly (unless it's a limited or something like that), so it just doesn't seem fair to me.

As a buyer if an european bjd owner wanted me to pay for his/hers shipping costs, plus shipping costs to me I'd still buy the doll if that cost was compensated by the fact that I wouldn't have to pay for custom fees (because the transaction would be made inside the EU). If the seller expected me to pay his/hers shipping + custom fees + shipping to me... hmm... what would be the point? I'd just buy from the company.

 

I don't think it's unethical or wrong for sellers to want the S&H that they paid for back when selling the item. S&H can cost A LOT from asian countries - up to $100+ in some circumstances. (I've paid about $80 from Volks before in shipping alone for very few items). The buyer is getting the upper-hand, espically if the item is coming from their own country when buying from a seller here on the boards. They don't have to wait a long time to get the item (unless the buyer procrastinates, has issues, etc.). They're basically paying for the leisure and comfort of not having to wait a long time to get an item.

Currently I'm selling a doll on the marketplace. It took over a month for the doll to get to me after placing the order. Many others wait longer during the holiday season coming up. I've priced my doll in a way that they can buy the doll WITHOUT having to wait an incredibly long time for their doll and miss someone's birthday, holiday, etc. I have the doll in-hand, mint condition, and can have her shipped out within 3 business days. The buyer will have her within a 2-4 days since she'll be shipped via Priority Shipping.

I didn't mark up the doll to an uber price or anything, I paid close to what I'm selling her for. I'm just trying to get back her costs + a few more dollars. I would think a buyer would like a perfectly new doll at the price I'm selling and know EXACTLY when they are getting the doll, than have to go through the trouble that the company is known for, go through that stress + emails back and forth, and then having to wait an undetermined amount of time.

If you'd like to take a look at my sale if you are interested or just want to see what I'm talking about, the link is in my signature.

 

People should charge what it really costs to ship the item from where it's being shipped from. For example, if I bought a doll and it comes to me from Korea, I shouldnt charge the new buyer what I paid for shipping if they also live in the US if it really doesn't cost that much to ship it to them. I don't think that it's right to tack on extras.

 

I agree. It's just better to give one lump sum and let the people decide if it's priced fairly. When you break it down, people would feel that they do not have to be charged some of the "factors" that you feel you have the right to charge them for.

Just give the whole sum and let us decide if we like the whole price. Give us the sausage. We don't exactly want to know which part of the cow goes in there.

 

BEST rationalization EVER! Sorry I have nothing better to add.

 

personally, I dont think it's fair, if your going to pay for item+ regular shipping to sell PLUS shipping to you, why not just buy the item brand new?

I myself offer free shipping, because it is something I find hard to come buy and really appreciate when other seller ship for free. If someone is kind enough to business with you for a 500+ item, it's only going to be 20 or less to ship it (unless out of US) so why not? I guess maybe that's just me though. ^_^ I don't mind paying shipping to me from seller at an estimated price, even though it may be higher than
expected.

most the time I am refunded for the difference, which I dont expect that either. so IMO, I don't think that the seller should charge original shipping + shipping to you, I think they should just eat it.

But everyone has there right to set their own price, but I wouldnt mention it in the sales thread.

 

I think it depends on the state of the doll. I sold a doll for less the price than what I paid for ther in the first place, shipping included. The reason for me to do this was because the doll had been with me for a year, she was an unpopular mold and I had modded her a bit. So in my case I didn't make the buyer pay for my shipping.

I think the pice of the doll should be based on the quality and state of the doll instead of how much the seller bought it for in the first place.

 

I'm just curious -- unless the seller states that they are including their foreign shipping charge in their price, how do buyers even know that's a factor -- or not a factor, for that matter? When I see, say, Elf El for sale at higher than his original cost, I don't automatically assume that the seller is trying to make me pay for their shipping. I assume the cost is higher due to demand and him being unavailable from the company.

What I mean to say is, where is this debate coming from in the first place? It seems that some people posting here believe all dolls on the marketplace would be less than they were from the company if only those dastardly sellers weren't including their shipping cost. Are sellers posting something that gives that impression?

In my experience, most people don't determine prices for their sales by taking the item cost and then adding their shipping to it. They look at the big picture -- how much did I pay total for this doll, what have I done to improve or decrease its value, what is demand for it, is it still available from the company, and so on. I'm stunned that with so many factors involved in pricing, people are zeroing in on one that I've rarely even seen brought up, much less act a significant factor in the price.

 

Hmm. I have problems on a personal level with the widespread notion that you are *entitled* to recoup your entire outlay on what is essentially a used item. And I know a lot of people disagree with me on this - that's fine. So no, I don't agree that I should have to pay you back for your costs in having the item shipped.

However, if you feel that you must attempt to get back what you paid, just give us a price. As others have said. Give us a price, we'll decide if it's fair. In some cases, it will seem entirely worth it.

 

I have always sold my dolls for less than what I paid for them and never try to recoup the shipping costs to me. I figure that I am the one who made the mistake with this doll, I either didn't bond with it, it wasn't quite what I wanted, it has been a hasty decision or other reasons. I figure my mistake so I pay for it. There are some very happy buyers of the dolls I have sold because they got bargains. I even subsidize the postage costs from Australia to the US which seems to be where my buyers are.
Cheers
May --- we live and learn

 

seconded.

if you want it at cost plus normal shipping, get it direct from the original source.

if it's a limited or just generally sold out, that automatically ups the value of the item and it's their right to reap the benefit of that.

 

Why not buy it brand new? Well I'll tell you why I haven't.

I don't like waiting up to two months to get a brand new spankin' doll! To get my doll faster, I am willing to spend a little extra and I do think its fair. Everyone is allowed to decide case by case if you'd rather 'pay' in time or money. But pay you will.

The term 'Scalping' denotes you are making a profit. But if it's money you've spent out of your pocket that you are recouping, it really can't be called a 'profit'.

I am not a fan of driving the price of dolls down. Sure I'd love it of more people can afford this hobby BUT I also like feeling comfortable in knowing that the dolls I buy loose little to no value on the second hand market. If you want cheap second hand dolls go get a Barbie.

 

Personally, as a seller, I can really sympathize with trying to recoup the losses. Shipping can be around $70 for a doll, and that's quite a bit to lose. And you may say "it's only $20," well, if you sell five dolls, that's a loss of $100.

This hobby just consumes so much money. I can't even tell you how much money I've simply wasted.

Personally, I enjoy buying from the Marketplace. Sellers here are so much nicer. They're easier to contact and much friendlier. It's easier to deal with them than with a large company. Sometimes, that means paying a little extra. It's understandable.

Plus, consider paypal fees. That 4%. So if you pay $400 + $15 for shipping, those fees take out about $13, leaving you $2 to ship. Then that cuts into what they originally paid too. It's just loss after loss after loss.

Sure, I'd prefer if everything had free shipping, but while nobody is profiting from that besides the post office, that is still money that the original buyer is paying and losing. And if it's only $20, who should complain?

 

if i ever wanted to buy a doll, and they were charging me their going price, plus the shipping cost to THEM, then, i'd just turn and look for the doll elsewhere. If everyone started doing that, then it would start with the original owner saying well, it was a 700 dollar doll, plus 80 dollars shipping. Then it would be the next owner saying well it's a 700 dollar doll, plus the original shipping of 80.00, and i had to pay my shipping of 25.00. Then the next owner saying Well it's a 700 dollar doll, and the original shipping was 80.00, and i had to pay for 25.00 shipping, so u pay that, plus 25.00 more shipping. it wouldn't take long for a doll to rack up to hundereds of dollars.

It's silly, and i think people need to realize, that when you pay shipping, YOU are paying for a service. One that someone else is NOT recieving. They should not be paying for the shipping charge that was to send the doll to YOU.

Do people have the right? Absolutely.

Is it ridiculous? Absolutely.